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Forums - Politics - FBI Can listen in on your Android Phone remotely

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Kasz216 said:
dallas said:
ArnoldRimmer said:
What do you guys think about the latest reports about NSA and DEA "cooperation", "parallel construction" etc.?

Here's a short summary, in case you haven't read about yet:
The NSA is giving hints acquired by surveilling american citizens to a special unit of the DEA with more than 100 people, which is using these hints to prosecute drug dealers and users. But the fact that these hints originally came from the NSA is not being revealed; instead, a strategy called "parallel construction" is being used: they have to construct a credible alternative story about how they became aware of those "crimes". For example, the NSA would give hints when and where the DEA should examine cars. If the DEA guys find drugs, they can claim that it was just a random car search that by pure luck made them aware of a drug crime/criminal.

There seem to be quite a number of american cannabis smokers on this website, so I wonder if this changes their feelings on the NSA surveillance. (My impression so far is that many people don't care about the NSA surveillance, simply because they don't see how it could possibly affect themselves)


Sure, but the DEA is becoming less and less focused on weed as the citizenry of this grand nation are gradually demanding legalization, and that's why many of the states have followed suit, at least with medical marijuana.  

so, the government can look for weed all they like, it will be only for a brief amount of time that they will be able prosecute marijuana anyway.-+


Except that's not true.

If anythign the DEA has gotten MORE focused on weed ever since states have improved medical usage.  Going out of their way to hassle the state governments, shut down dispenseries etc.

The prosecution of people running legal (statewise) dispenseries and just growing them has been on a sharp upswing.


But, is the government trying to stamp out the dispensaries, or trying to keep them flying straight?   There is a big difference between the two scenarios, and while i'm a medical marijuana/legalization supporter, I still think tha the best way to have a mature marijuana industry is to have it regulated .



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dallas said:
Kasz216 said:
dallas said:
ArnoldRimmer said:
What do you guys think about the latest reports about NSA and DEA "cooperation", "parallel construction" etc.?

Here's a short summary, in case you haven't read about yet:
The NSA is giving hints acquired by surveilling american citizens to a special unit of the DEA with more than 100 people, which is using these hints to prosecute drug dealers and users. But the fact that these hints originally came from the NSA is not being revealed; instead, a strategy called "parallel construction" is being used: they have to construct a credible alternative story about how they became aware of those "crimes". For example, the NSA would give hints when and where the DEA should examine cars. If the DEA guys find drugs, they can claim that it was just a random car search that by pure luck made them aware of a drug crime/criminal.

There seem to be quite a number of american cannabis smokers on this website, so I wonder if this changes their feelings on the NSA surveillance. (My impression so far is that many people don't care about the NSA surveillance, simply because they don't see how it could possibly affect themselves)


Sure, but the DEA is becoming less and less focused on weed as the citizenry of this grand nation are gradually demanding legalization, and that's why many of the states have followed suit, at least with medical marijuana.  

so, the government can look for weed all they like, it will be only for a brief amount of time that they will be able prosecute marijuana anyway.-+


Except that's not true.

If anythign the DEA has gotten MORE focused on weed ever since states have improved medical usage.  Going out of their way to hassle the state governments, shut down dispenseries etc.

The prosecution of people running legal (statewise) dispenseries and just growing them has been on a sharp upswing.


But, is the government trying to stamp out the dispensaries, or trying to keep them flying straight?   There is a big difference between the two scenarios, and while i'm a medical marijuana/legalization supporter, I still think tha the best way to have a mature marijuana industry is to have it regulated .

Stamp them out.

They have gone out of their way to prosecute people in California who aren't even in the dispensery buisness anymore just based on the fact that they used to.  Just on the basis that they sold Marijuana.

If they weren't flying straight, they would be prosecuted by the state governments.

The DEA's current plan is similar to the RIAA's.


Target people randomly without reason to cause fear and the beleif that anybody could be targeted if they so much as think about being involved in the medical marijuana industry.

 

Either way this is all headed for a Supreme Court date... and unfortunitly thanks to recent rulings that have actually supported leftwing causes... the precedent is probably set to suggest that states CAN'T legalize Marijuana... for any reason.





Kasz216 said:
dallas said:


But, is the government trying to stamp out the dispensaries, or trying to keep them flying straight?   There is a big difference between the two scenarios, and while i'm a medical marijuana/legalization supporter, I still think tha the best way to have a mature marijuana industry is to have it regulated .

Stamp them out.

They have gone out of their way to prosecute people in California who aren't even in the dispensery buisness anymore just based on the fact that they used to.  Just on the basis that they sold Marijuana.

If they weren't flying straight, they would be prosecuted by the state governments.

Well, then I guess that I will have to put up with this for a little while.  Btw, I just can't see the feds cracking down on medical marijuana if the support for it keeps growing, and even more states open this up for the public.  If they are trying to stamp out 20 states efforts that is one thing, but what about when 30 or 35 or 40 states have med marijuana? I can't see the government trying to pre-empt that many states, so perhaps patience is what is needed.



dallas said:
Kasz216 said:
dallas said:


But, is the government trying to stamp out the dispensaries, or trying to keep them flying straight?   There is a big difference between the two scenarios, and while i'm a medical marijuana/legalization supporter, I still think tha the best way to have a mature marijuana industry is to have it regulated .

Stamp them out.

They have gone out of their way to prosecute people in California who aren't even in the dispensery buisness anymore just based on the fact that they used to.  Just on the basis that they sold Marijuana.

If they weren't flying straight, they would be prosecuted by the state governments.

Well, then I guess that I will have to put up with this for a little while.  Btw, I just can't see the feds cracking down on medical marijuana if the support for it keeps growing, and even more states open this up for the public.  If they are trying to stamp out 20 states efforts that is one thing, but what about when 30 or 35 or 40 states have med marijuana? I can't see the government trying to pre-empt that many states, so perhaps patience is what is needed.


Eh, I don't see why they wouldn't.   Medical Marijuana enforcement likely won't change until all the old guard die off.


Literally.

 

It's a lot like sceince.  Albert Einstein fought Quantum Physics until his dying breath.

I mean, the president himself used to smoke marijuana... and seemingly see's no real problem with it... yet this is still happening.

 

Never understimate the stuborness entrenched state employees with job security.



Kasz216 said:
dallas said:
Kasz216 said:
dallas said:


But, is the government trying to stamp out the dispensaries, or trying to keep them flying straight?   There is a big difference between the two scenarios, and while i'm a medical marijuana/legalization supporter, I still think tha the best way to have a mature marijuana industry is to have it regulated .

Stamp them out.

They have gone out of their way to prosecute people in California who aren't even in the dispensery buisness anymore just based on the fact that they used to.  Just on the basis that they sold Marijuana.

If they weren't flying straight, they would be prosecuted by the state governments.

Well, then I guess that I will have to put up with this for a little while.  Btw, I just can't see the feds cracking down on medical marijuana if the support for it keeps growing, and even more states open this up for the public.  If they are trying to stamp out 20 states efforts that is one thing, but what about when 30 or 35 or 40 states have med marijuana? I can't see the government trying to pre-empt that many states, so perhaps patience is what is needed.


Eh, I don't see why they wouldn't.   Medical Marijuana enforcement likely won't change until all the old guard die off.


Literally.

 

It's a lot like sceince.  Albert Einstein fought Quantum Physics until his dying breath.

I mean, the president himself used to smoke marijuana... and seemingly see's no real problem with it... yet this is still happening.

 

Never understimate the stuborness entrenched state employees with job security.


Well, sure, some of the older voters that wont support med marijuan will have to die....but support grows regardless year after year.  And soon, I think, it will reach a critical point that would influence the politicians to support it.  You seem to know a lot about politics Kasz, Obama is trying to be something of a centrist, am I correct?  Then that could explain his behavior.



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dallas said:
Kasz216 said:
dallas said:
Kasz216 said:
dallas said:

 

 


Eh, I don't see why they wouldn't.   Medical Marijuana enforcement likely won't change until all the old guard die off.


Literally.

 

It's a lot like sceince.  Albert Einstein fought Quantum Physics until his dying breath.

I mean, the president himself used to smoke marijuana... and seemingly see's no real problem with it... yet this is still happening.

 

Never understimate the stuborness entrenched state employees with job security.


Well, sure, some of the older voters that wont support med marijuan will have to die....but support grows regardless year after year.  And soon, I think, it will reach a critical point that would influence the politicians to support it.  You seem to know a lot about politics Kasz, Obama is trying to be something of a centrist, am I correct?  Then that could explain his behavior.

It depends on how you define centrist.

He's a centrist in that he's shown republican and democratic polcies....  but they've generally been extreme one way or another.

Obama is likely going along with it soley because he doesn't have an option.

The head of the DEA is extremely anti-marijuana... and was nominated because well... there aren't many marijuana supporters qualfied to run the DEA.  Since if you support Marijuana you aren't likely joining the DEA.

He likely just sees no reason to start up a big poltiical fight with her over it when he knows he'll get the Marijuana vote anyway and infighting in the administration makes you look like a bad president... because what's he going to do?

All the other candidates are anti-marijuana too.  He could put in a pro marijuana candidate but they won't have the expiernce to fight all the other drugs, and other hard drug traficking.


Until the "Old Guard"  DEA official die out... there really isn't much option.  The head of the DEA will stick to their beliefs no matter what the rest of the public thinks.



Qualfied DEA agenets will probably trail quite a bit behind popular opinion... and even once a head administrator is elected, it will be tough for them to enforce the "new" will since at the top of the DEA are tons of officials grown up in the "Marijuana is bad" mentality, sitting at all the top positions with seniority and near immunity to being fired.


To them public opinion is meaningless... since they aren't voted for.