By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Sony - By JayWood2010: Mistakes Sony can NOT make with PS4

JayWood2010 said:
Yes i threw my name on the title for a few reasons. I do not want you all to think that it is some article that i just copied and pasted. Even if you guys dont agree with what Im saying it took me a long time to write this so I hope you all at least read through it.


i wonder who made you think that i read about a third of it, ill post once i read it all



Around the Network
bananaking21 said:
JayWood2010 said:
Yes i threw my name on the title for a few reasons. I do not want you all to think that it is some article that i just copied and pasted. Even if you guys dont agree with what Im saying it took me a long time to write this so I hope you all at least read through it.


i wonder who made you think that i read about a third of it, ill post once i read it all


lol hmmm I don't know :P




       

JayWood2010 said:
bananaking21 said:
JayWood2010 said:
Yes i threw my name on the title for a few reasons. I do not want you all to think that it is some article that i just copied and pasted. Even if you guys dont agree with what Im saying it took me a long time to write this so I hope you all at least read through it.


i wonder who made you think that i read about a third of it, ill post once i read it all


lol hmmm I don't know :P

lmao!! im going to add that to my sig!!



JayWood2010 said:

Still apart of sony though and shows bad strategy.  They pretty much made the same mistakes they did with the PS3 launch and the Vita launch.


Wouldn't really say that at all.

Overspecced like PS3?  Yes, probably.  

Overpriced because of pushing a media format like PS3?  Nope.

Un-necessarily hard to develop for like PS3?  Nope (quite the opposite in fact).

Lacking first-party titles in its first year?  Nope.

Arrogance that they dominated the market last generation so they'll dominate it again this gen?  Lol, nope.

 

Honestly, the biggest "mistake" with the Vita was deciding to make a dedicated handheld device in 2011 when smartphones & tablets were only growing in popularity.  What parallels can you draw from the mistakes of PS3 launch with that?  That in 2006, dedicated home consoles were falling out of fashion so Sony made a bad choice in making the PS3 at all?

Don't really see what "same mistakes" you're getting at, really.  Other than overspeccing (debatable) and lacking games (which is more of a third-party thing than something Sony are directly controlling and even then, it comes back to the whole smartphone thing and that developers are heading there), there really aren't that many parallels I can see.



Yeah I'm going with the launch price and NO GAEMZ.



Currently own:

 

  • Ps4

 

Currently playing: Witcher 3, Walking Dead S1/2, GTA5, Dying Light, Tomb Raider Remaster, MGS Ground Zeros

Around the Network
Kresnik said:
JayWood2010 said:

Still apart of sony though and shows bad strategy.  They pretty much made the same mistakes they did with the PS3 launch and the Vita launch.


Wouldn't really say that at all.

Overspecced like PS3?  Yes, probably.  

Overpriced because of pushing a media format like PS3?  Nope.

Un-necessarily hard to develop for like PS3?  Nope (quite the opposite in fact).

Lacking first-party titles in its first year?  Nope.

Arrogance that they dominated the market last generation so they'll dominate it again this gen?  Lol, nope.

 

Honestly, the biggest "mistake" with the Vita was deciding to make a dedicated handheld device in 2011 when smartphones & tablets were only growing in popularity.  What parallels can you draw from the mistakes of PS3 launch with that?  That in 2006, dedicated home consoles were falling out of fashion so Sony made a bad choice in making the PS3 at all?

Don't really see what "same mistakes" you're getting at, really.  Other than overspeccing (debatable) and lacking games (which is more of a third-party thing than something Sony are directly controlling and even then, it comes back to the whole smartphone thing and that developers are heading there), there really aren't that many parallels I can see.

It is basically a $300 console with very little support in it's first year.  Think about that, what has it had released for it?  It has yet had a system seller released for the vita.  Do you consider that support?  a memory card that can cost up to $100 is not smart all on it's own and the price is still to high due to the lack of understanding power does not sell consoles or handhelds  And yes they are moving tech forward with the vita.  The back touch pad?  I doubt that was a cheap instalment for the device.  Everything about it is a premium product which is good but it scares away third party developers again.  Which is something i mentioned with the PS3 as well.  They have lost support from 3rd party this generation and the Vita isnt necessarily helping in that scenario either.




       

JayWood2010 said:

Now when we say 4K we are not talking about games being in 4K, but technology that allows movies to be in 4K.  Kind of like DVD/Bluray but more powerful.  This is not a new strategy for Sony as we have seen it for the past two generations from them.  PS2 with DVD and then PS3 with Bluray and later on 3D.  But the problem is, we don't know what kind of technology is needed to do 4K and if it will drive the price up or not.

The cheapest HD7000 series videocard supports 4K without any problem out of DisplayPorts 1.2 or HDMI 1.4a. Therefore, the cost of outputting 4K video/BluRay/upscaling games to 4K is practically free assuming PS4 has any HD7000 videocard. The cost is the actual GPU components/kit which would be no different than purchasing RSX for PS3. 

JayWood2010 said:

Now when we say 4K we are not talking about games being in 4K, but technology that allows movies to be in 4K.  Kind of like DVD/Bluray but more powerful.  This is not a new strategy for Sony as we have seen it for the past two generations from them.  PS2 with DVD and then PS3 with Bluray and later on 3D.  But the problem is, we don't know what kind of technology is needed to do 4K and if it will drive the price up or not.

Both of those points are incorrect. 4K resolution support is a native feature of HD7000 cards. There are no additional costs other than a ~$3-5 High-Speed HDMI 1.4a cable and purchasing any HD7000 chip. Even if Sony doesn't ship PS4 with this High speed HDMI cable, you can just buy one at Monoprice for $3.50:

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10240&cs_id=1024008&p_id=3992&seq=1&format=2

JayWood2010 said:

The cell wasn't a horrible thing as people who can learn how to use it correctly can do a good job but for third party developers the Cell was basically a nightmare.  This is something Sony can not do again.  They need to make life easy on third party developers and why do I say that?

This has already been addressed: PS4 will have an x86 CPU and a unified shader architecture AMD GPU. Both of these components may have limited customization but the underlying architecture will be exactly the same as on the PC. It would be no different than coding games for the PC. That's one of the greatest improvements PS4 will bring: ease of PC porting, ease of developing games on "off-the-shelf" PC components. This will result in lower hardware cost for the console since Sony does not have to raise the price of the custom chip due to incurring $2-3 billion of its own R&D like they did on the Cell. This also would minimize losses on the hardware sold for the console. If PS4 has PC parts in it, developers could choose for it to be the go to multi-platform console. Since HD7000 GPUs (Graphics Core Next) have been out for more than a year, developers have already learned how to use many of its key features effectively. They'll be instantly familiar with how the graphics card works on PS4. 

In fact, many modern games utilize many features of HD7000 cards already, including using the 32 Compute Units to accelerate things like shadows (contact hardening shadows), and leveraging GCN's DirectCompute capabilities to enhance graphical effects like ambient occlusion/global illumination.

Since developers already had to learn underlying architecture of HD7000 cards with games like Sleeping Dogs, Dirt Showdown, Alan Wake, Hitman Absolution and this year Tomb Raider and Bioshock Infinite also take advantage of HD7000's compute capabilities, by the time PS4 launches in Q4 2013, PC game developers will had 2 years to learn how GCN works. 



JayWood2010 said:

It is basically a $300 console with very little support in it's first year.  Think about that, what has it had released for it?  


Uff.  If this is your mindset, then I'll just leave you to it in this thread :P



Kresnik said:
JayWood2010 said:

It is basically a $300 console with very little support in it's first year.  Think about that, what has it had released for it?  


Uff.  If this is your mindset, then I'll just leave you to it in this thread :P


Then explain to me how it isnt? If you are going to bring something up then back it up.  Im not argueing, if that is what you think.  If you bring something to my attention that I am unaware of then I will gladly admit that I am wrong but from everything I know this is correct in every way.  System sellers and games being released are two different things.  Persona 4 is a good game but certainly not a system seller.  same goes to little big planet and Gravity Rush. And it most certaily is a console that goes for $300 in many cases due to high priced memory cards.




       

BlueFalcon said:
JayWood2010 said:

Now when we say 4K we are not talking about games being in 4K, but technology that allows movies to be in 4K.  Kind of like DVD/Bluray but more powerful.  This is not a new strategy for Sony as we have seen it for the past two generations from them.  PS2 with DVD and then PS3 with Bluray and later on 3D.  But the problem is, we don't know what kind of technology is needed to do 4K and if it will drive the price up or not.

The cheapest HD7000 series videocard supports 4K without any problem out of DisplayPorts 1.2 or HDMI 1.4a. Therefore, the cost of outputting 4K video/BluRay/upscaling games to 4K is practically free assuming PS4 has any HD7000 videocard. The cost is the actual GPU components/kit which would be no different than purchasing RSX for PS3. 

JayWood2010 said:

Now when we say 4K we are not talking about games being in 4K, but technology that allows movies to be in 4K.  Kind of like DVD/Bluray but more powerful.  This is not a new strategy for Sony as we have seen it for the past two generations from them.  PS2 with DVD and then PS3 with Bluray and later on 3D.  But the problem is, we don't know what kind of technology is needed to do 4K and if it will drive the price up or not.

Both of those points are incorrect. 4K resolution support is a native feature of HD7000 cards. There are no additional costs other than a $10 High-Speed HDMI 1.4a cable and purchasing any HD7000 chip. 

JayWood2010 said:

The cell wasn't a horrible thing as people who can learn how to use it correctly can do a good job but for third party developers the Cell was basically a nightmare.  This is something Sony can not do again.  They need to make life easy on third party developers and why do I say that?

This has already been addressed: PS4 will have an x86 CPU and a unified shader architecture AMD GPU. Both of these components may have limited customization but the underlying architecture will be exactly the same as on the PC. It would be no different than coding games for the PC. That's one of the greatest improvements PS4 will bring: ease of PC porting, ease of developing games on "off-the-shelf" PC components. This will result in lower hardware cost for the console since Sony does not have to raise the price of the custom chip due to incurring $2-3 billion of its own R&D like they did on the Cell. This also would minimize losses on the hardware sold for the console. If PS4 has PC parts in it, developers could choose for it to be the go to multi-platform console.

Great first post by the way XD