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Forums - General - China to wage a war with Japan 2013 *special update reuters jan17 20013 article

Economic war has raged on for years between China and Japan. The rise or China over the last 20 -odd years since the fall of the Berlin Wall has coincided with the stagnation and decline of the Japanese economy. China leads the world in importing consumer goods, Japan continues to decline.



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@Scisca

You're almost expressing a kind of Stockholm syndrome in that you seem to believe that the Nazis had turned the corner and came to respect the Polish people. I think the problem is that you're looking at Germans today and thinking they had a similar mentality during WW2.

In any case your claim that Russians didn't liberate your country is playing semantics. Did they or did they not force the Nazis out of your country?? And do you really think that you would have even existed as a Polish nation if the occupation turned permanent and colonisation began.

I am not doubting that crimes happened post world war 2 in your country but this in no way detracts from the absolute truth and fact that it was the Soviet Army that forced the Germans and their allies out of Poland and then allowed for a Polish republic to exist without absorbing it as they could have done as per the spoils of war.

And finally regarding your very crude interpretation of the world being better off without certain people if I was to use your same flawed reasoning I could make the same argument regarding Poland. I would say that both Russia and Germany would be better off if it didn't exist and they absorbed its territory. Ofcourse that would be a wrong assertion to make and I hope you can grasp how bad your argument is.

@OP

Japan is under full US military control and hence can't act without the permission and consent of the US with regards to China. I honestly think this will be resolved peacefuly because there is too much to lose. Having said that though Japan has to be careful not to overplay its hand. While they are allied with the US they can't afford to be reckless and they should do their best simply to maintain the status quo.

With China they are a proud and powerful nation on the rise and with that power comes more asseriveness. Having said that China will be best served to continue its economic policies and not to get carried away militarily at least for another decade or so.



 

 

Scisca said:
Branko2166 said:

Serbs are very good people!? Dude! Try biggest a$$holes in the region, hated by every single country around it and for valid reasons might I add. I mean, if you don't care to read a history book, just judge by his absurd posts. No, they are not good people as a nation. Really, the world would be a much better place without the Serbs and Russians, instead of them joining forces and causing trouble to everyone around all the time. The Serbs are the lesser evil, but still are not good people.

Their women are hot, but that's nothing impressive over here, since all Slavic women are hot. Serbian are probably somewhere in the middle of the pack anyway to tell the truth.

 

And as for the islands - I think they should belong to Japan. They belonged to private Japanese people anyway, the Chinese had no control over them, and these guys deciced to sell them to the Japanese goverment - the Japanese claim seems more legit to me than the one of China. Plus I just hate the communists...

So if the world would be better of without Serbs and Russians what solution do you propose? While I understand your hatred towards communism I suspect your reasons go deeper than that. There have been many people in history that have placed negative labels and stereotypes on other nations and this has never ended well.

For all your hatred of Russia it is ironic that you hate those that liberated your country from those that at the time considered your people inferior and subhuman. All of Eastern Europe would have been colonised if the Fascist invasion had not been forced back.

As far as history goes it is written by the victors so it's not like those books are entirely factual. 

Bottom line is we may like to think someone is good or bad or right or wrong but the only thing that matters is power and if you are weak you will be used and abused by the strong.  So your assertions about Serbs and Russians is one side of the worldview and your seeming desire to see them wiped is nothing more than a twisted and sick fantasy.

 

To the Serbs and Russians - I have no solutions and by no means am I suggesting to wipe them out! Especially I have absolutely no issues with Serbia, I'm just acknowledging what they did just a couple years ago, what their attitute towards their neighbours is currently and I refuse to call them "good people". I'm stating the fact, the world would be a better place without them, without the hurt and suffering they have caused and are still causing. The only solution is to make them grow up, the way Germans did. The difference between Germany and Russia+Serbia, is that the Germans acknowledged the evil they caused and changed their ways. These guys still can't do it and still form an "axis of evil", even if in the current geopolitical situation there are bigger threats to America and they are overlooked. And Serbia is obviously just a local Balcan bully, not a real world-wide evil.


What a load of bullshit. What attitute? When you are at war, do you expect your enemy to be nice to you? And the only neighbours that ''hate us'' are the ones we were at war with (So Albos, Bosnians, and Croats) And we never even attacked any of our neighbours first in any way, they were always the one trying to segregate, exterminate and destroye at first, and later whine when faced with loser consequences.

And you talk about acnkowledging evils comitted during war? Wow, you really are insanely ignorant. Serbs have sent every last man that was demanded to ICTY (including the president and the head generals), the same cant be said about your beloved Croats and Muslims. Also, when did Croats apologize for salughtering thousands upon thousands of Serbs during WW2?  Yeah, newsflash, they were on ''axis of evil'' side. When did they apologize for removing 250.000 Serbs from Croatia in 1995? I bet you dont even know anything about that, you'd rather be just filled with your ignorant hatred towards Serbs (what the fuck did we ever do to Poles??) And where is a criminal justice court for KLA criminals during Kosovo war? Nope, they are given a new country and a presidency. Talk about double standards. Serbs even sent Miloshevic to ICTY, I didnt see Croats sending Tudjman or Muslims sending Izetbegovic anywhere. So dont talk about admitting mistakes and accepting crimes, because Serbs have been billion times better in that regard than any opposite side ever was, and we still pull up with most shit from the west, despite cooperating the most.



Speaking about Chinese threat. More or less okey'ish article from Tokyo-based "The Diplomat" about the capabilites of new Chinese ASBMs (anti-ship ballistic missiles).

China’s “Carrier Killer”: The DF-21D
By James R. Holmes

Commentators have made much of China’s DF-21D (dubbed by many as the "carrier-killer") anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM), which reportedly entered limited service with the People’s Liberation Army’s Second Artillery Corps, or missile force, in late 2010. Their assumption, doubtless correct, is that the U.S. Pacific Fleet represents the ASBM’s primary target. But just as U.S. commanders plan for the hardest case—or against the most capable prospective foe—and trust that the resulting capabilities can handle “lesser included” challenges, PLA commanders can use the ASBM not just for anti-access scenarios involving the U.S. Navy but to pummel less formidable fleets. This is Beijing’s unseen big stick.

And a long arm brandishes it. Just look at the map of Asia contained in the Pentagon’s annual reports on Chinese military power. Rivals like Japan, Taiwan, the Philippines, Vietnam, and most of India all fall within the ASBM’s reach according to American estimates. (Scroll down to page 42.) That lets PLA gunners strike throughout the China seas, well into the Western Pacific, throughout the Bay of Bengal, and into the Arabian Sea—all without deploying launchers outside China’s frontiers. And if ships at sea are at risk, they’re even more exposed while sitting stationary alongside a pier or at anchor.

If the U.S. Navy appears flummoxed by the ASBM, what can smaller Asian navies do? It depends on the fleet. Relatively generously funded services like the Indian Navy or Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force have the option of building stealth features into their latest surface warships, such as the JMSDF’s contingent of Aegis destroyers or the Indian Navy’s Kolkata-class destroyers. Real questions linger about the PLA’s capacity to find targets at sea. The most lethal ASBM can do little without accurate, real-time fire-control data. The more elusive the ship, the better its chances of surviving an ASBM assault.

...

Over the long term, however, the ASBM problem may warrant more ambitious countermeasures. Hardening naval bases against preemptive strikes is an obvious measure, if an expensive and thus unpalatable one. Asian capitals can also rethink the makeup of their navies. I have become a convert to the idea that East Asian fleets should disperse firepower among a host of small combatants that are cheap and can be built in large numbers; pack a wallop; can operate in wolfpacks; and can take shelter in caves and other havens that are hard to find or attack. Trying to sell officialdom on fast patrol boats could be tough, though. It would mean deemphasizing light aircraft carriers like the JMSDF’s “helicopter destroyers,” or the Taiwan Navy’s Kidd-class guided-missile destroyers, in favor of unglamorous small craft. Yet that looks like the best strategic option for navies inhabiting an increasingly hardscrabble neighborhood.

India is an uncomfortable exception to this advice. With ambitions spanning an entire ocean and perhaps beyond, New Delhi can hardly found a great navy on short-range missile craft. Hardening its bases, operating beneath the waves, and pursuing high-tech active and passive countermeasures represent its main options. The Indian Navy, in short, finds itself in much the same predicament as the U.S. Pacific Fleet.

//Well, in its tone it is certainly better than usual crap Billy Hertz of The Washington Post is spewing out only to support myths about "Yellow threat" in his attempts to earn some lobbyists money. Seriosuly people like Billy are threat to US federal budget and should be treated like this in war time :D

Expose and eliminate provocateurs and alarmists!

To the best of my knowledge last ASBM to enter service was some varinat of R-27 back in the early 1970s, so you could easily evaluate that Chinese are 40 years behind in their development. Since then ASBM niche was widely replaced with cruise missiles akin to P-700 (reported name Shipwreck) and alike collectively known as "Minerals" as ballistic missiles proove to be ineffective against US Navy CBGs (carrier battle groups). Merely the fact that ASBMs are entering service could proove that Chinese are either completely derailed in their understanding of military development, or (which is more likely) just doesn't have capabilites to create working and effective ASGM to threaten US Navy. Doesn't mean this isn't a threat to their neighbours though, as not having early warning radars to alarm that ASBM has been launched (unless Americans will share this info in time) could put them in danger.

 



@Mai

Thanks for the article. I remember reading about the so called 'carrier killer' a few months back, obviously it was blown out of proportion although that's not to say that the PLA won't be able to use it effectively.