VGKing said:
Not sure if serious.....if a delayed PS3 release at $600 didn't destroy the Playstation brand, nothing will. |
Couldnt agree more.
VGKing said:
Not sure if serious.....if a delayed PS3 release at $600 didn't destroy the Playstation brand, nothing will. |
Couldnt agree more.
Excuse me while I point out the Elephant in the room. All the speculation in this thread thus far has revolved around what Sony needs to do to win, or what Sony needs to do to keep from losing. Maybe what we should be discussing is survival strategies. Whether some here want to believe it or not. Sony isn't the company it was a decade ago. They have lost money for five straight years, and that is in spite of selling large chunks of the company off, and actually using credit to cover operating expenses. Sony is neck deep in debt, and that isn't any kind of a exaggeration.
Meanwhile Microsoft and Nintendo aren't the companies they were five years ago in this space. While Sony got weaker they went, and got a hell of a lot stronger. Nintendo just came off of a home console that printed them money, and was a smash hit. Microsoft is coming off a very profitable console thanks to their subscription scheme, and more importantly they used all that money to fund expansion. While Sony on the whole has shed studios, exclusive franchises, and reputation. Microsoft has increased its number of studios. Created a number of franchises, and has only seen its reputation improve over the coarse of the previous generation.
The whole point of this diatribe is this. Sony is crippled, and its competitors are in peak physical conditioning. We are really talking about long odds. Sony could make a run at the prize, but rest assured that the exertion really could destroy them. There isn't any reason at all that Microsoft shouldn't just outspend Sony out of the gate. Microsoft has proven that it has no qualms about loss leading on its hardware, or about bribing third parties to get preferential treatment. Nintendo has opted for a positional advantage, and that means they will be protecting a lead. Rather then being forced to assail the lead. They get all the advantages that more time brings.
To me that means Sony has to be more pragmatic then it has been in the previous generation. Which means that they have to be looking for a happy medium. They need to look for a pace that will let them place without overexerting themselves in the process. Further more the longer they hang in there. The greater the chance for a turn around in their fortunes. What they really need is a strategy that will let them hang in there.
So if you are thinking about a 2013 launch. Then you have to expect a compromise on the hardware front. Either Sony has to tone back their capabilities to make a profit from the hardware, or they have to go off on a tangent. Whichever way is the most profitable out of the gate. In this scenario money gives Sony more time. If you are thinking of a 2014 launch then the hardware can be competitive at a profitable price point.
I honestly think Sony has some good options here. More then most of you seem to think. Once you think outside of terms of black and white, winning or losing. You can see how Sony can do well for itself without conquering this marketplace. It seems to me that too many of you keep thinking of Sony in terms of Giant on the Playground. When it is fact now the runt of the litter. They can't brute force things, and get their way anymore. They tried that last generation, and got the stuffing beat out of them.
Sony isn't the Champion anymore it is the Underdog. The sooner that little tidbit sinks in the better, and as the Underdog. Their path to success doesn't involve them playing the game the other guys are going to play. They have to opt for guile, patience, or surprise. Which is how Nintendo moved up. They knew they couldn't win a fight pound for pound against Sony and Microsoft. So they changed the equation. Anyway does anyone here have the slightest desire of discussing what Sony should do outside of playing only to win.
There's no way Sony is going bankrupt anytime soon. They just announced that they were bringing back Walkman yesterday.
| Dodece said: Excuse me while I point out the Elephant in the room. All the speculation in this thread thus far has revolved around what Sony needs to do to win, or what Sony needs to do to keep from losing. Maybe what we should be discussing is survival strategies. Whether some here want to believe it or not. Sony isn't the company it was a decade ago. They have lost money for five straight years, and that is in spite of selling large chunks of the company off, and actually using credit to cover operating expenses. Sony is neck deep in debt, and that isn't any kind of a exaggeration. Meanwhile Microsoft and Nintendo aren't the companies they were five years ago in this space. While Sony got weaker they went, and got a hell of a lot stronger. Nintendo just came off of a home console that printed them money, and was a smash hit. Microsoft is coming off a very profitable console thanks to their subscription scheme, and more importantly they used all that money to fund expansion. While Sony on the whole has shed studios, exclusive franchises, and reputation. Microsoft has increased its number of studios. Created a number of franchises, and has only seen its reputation improve over the coarse of the previous generation. The whole point of this diatribe is this. Sony is crippled, and its competitors are in peak physical conditioning. We are really talking about long odds. Sony could make a run at the prize, but rest assured that the exertion really could destroy them. There isn't any reason at all that Microsoft shouldn't just outspend Sony out of the gate. Microsoft has proven that it has no qualms about loss leading on its hardware, or about bribing third parties to get preferential treatment. Nintendo has opted for a positional advantage, and that means they will be protecting a lead. Rather then being forced to assail the lead. They get all the advantages that more time brings. To me that means Sony has to be more pragmatic then it has been in the previous generation. Which means that they have to be looking for a happy medium. They need to look for a pace that will let them place without overexerting themselves in the process. Further more the longer they hang in there. The greater the chance for a turn around in their fortunes. What they really need is a strategy that will let them hang in there. So if you are thinking about a 2013 launch. Then you have to expect a compromise on the hardware front. Either Sony has to tone back their capabilities to make a profit from the hardware, or they have to go off on a tangent. Whichever way is the most profitable out of the gate. In this scenario money gives Sony more time. If you are thinking of a 2014 launch then the hardware can be competitive at a profitable price point. I honestly think Sony has some good options here. More then most of you seem to think. Once you think outside of terms of black and white, winning or losing. You can see how Sony can do well for itself without conquering this marketplace. It seems to me that too many of you keep thinking of Sony in terms of Giant on the Playground. When it is fact now the runt of the litter. They can't brute force things, and get their way anymore. They tried that last generation, and got the stuffing beat out of them. Sony isn't the Champion anymore it is the Underdog. The sooner that little tidbit sinks in the better, and as the Underdog. Their path to success doesn't involve them playing the game the other guys are going to play. They have to opt for guile, patience, or surprise. Which is how Nintendo moved up. They knew they couldn't win a fight pound for pound against Sony and Microsoft. So they changed the equation. Anyway does anyone here have the slightest desire of discussing what Sony should do outside of playing only to win. |
Yeah like outselling the competitors by 100,000 to 400,000 consoles each and every week doesn't mean anything when Sony's doing it.
If they're in such dire shape as you and the others like you point out, why don't they just say they're going out of business tomorrow and be done with the whole thing without going through the whole process of releasing a console that's beneath them?
And you use Nintendo as an example; however, Nintendo got the stuffing beat out of them two gens in a row not one like Sony ( and considering the fact that Playstation 3 is the best selling console out of the 3 for the last two years of the gen and beating the other consoles soundly every week now) why wouldn't they be interested in following a similar path next time?
I'd like to comment on Sony's quote that they "never been first or cheapest". Am I the only one who thinks that quote is quite wrong?
PlayStation: It was released around same day as the Sega Saturn (except for USA where Sega did that dumb surprise launch, but it helped Sony more than it hurt). PlayStation was cheaper than the Saturn; cheaper or around same price as Nintendo 64 (but Nintendo 64 had way more expensive games). Panasonic 3DO failed due to higher price, Atari Jaguar the same. So the Sony PlayStation was in fact pretty much the cheapest around, and released really early into the gen.
PlayStation 2: The Dreamcast released first but everyone was counting Sega out of the race already. PS2 hype alone killed the Dreamcast. So if we remove Dreamcast of the equation, what does it leave us with? PS2, Xbox and GameCube. I'm pretty sure that out of these contenders, PS2 was cheaper and released first.
PlayStation 3: Released late, most expensive. I don't think I need to comment here how it did against the cheapest competitors.
See a pattern? They might not think they were "cheapest or first to release", but everytime they were closest to first to realease, or closest to cheapest, they won. They lost when they changed it with the PS3.
Thus I think Sony should try their hardest to make the PlayStation 4 more affordable than the competition, and bring it out fast!


EdHieron said:
If they're in such dire shape as you and the others like you point out, why don't they just say they're going out of business tomorrow and be done with the whole thing without going through the whole process of releasing a console that's beneath them? And you use Nintendo as an example; however, Nintendo got the stuffing beat out of them two gens in a row not one like Sony ( and considering the fact that Playstation 3 is the best selling console out of the 3 for the last two years of the gen and beating the other consoles soundly every week now) why wouldn't they be interested in following a similar path next time? |
If Sony follows the same business model as they did with PS3, losing over 4.5 billion $, they will be bankrupt within 2 years.
Vinniegambini said:
If Sony follows the same business model as they did with PS3, losing over 4.5 billion $, they will be bankrupt within 2 years. |
So, if Sony releases a console that's outselling the competitors every week week at the end of next gen, they'll be bankrupt? That doesn't make much sense.
EdHieron said:
|
You're ignoring the billions Sony lost during the first half of the gen. Sony hasn't recovered from that (and probably never will).
Nintendo and PC gamer

osed125 said:
You're ignoring the billions Sony lost during the first half of the gen. Sony hasn't recovered from that (and probably never will). |
But they're number 1 now. Don't you think MS and Nintendo would like to switch places?
EdHieron said:
|
Business wise it doesn't matter how many consoles you sell, if you aren't making profit out of it (or even break even) the console is a failure.
Nintendo and PC gamer
