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Forums - Politics - Now that I did not vote for Romney, I already wish that I did?

dsgrue3 on 09 November 2012
Soundwave said:

The economy has been gaining jobs for the last 25 straight months.

The stock market has regained most of the levels it was at prior to the 2008 housing crash.

It's happening slowly, but the country is bouncing back economically and will continue to do so in the next 4 years. The critics of Obama know it, that's why they're so pissed off, because they know he's going to get credit for it.

You do not just snap your finger at the biggest recession and banking crisis of the modern age and just "fix" it in 2 years. Even my Romney's own plan he'd need until 2020 to get the economy back on track.

Jobs haven't been created at a great enough rate to even support the number of people entering the workforce. Estimaes are that 150k-200k jobs per month need be created to keep up. Very few months have even 150k jobs been created. This chart is very telling:

Stock market has little to do with the economy and even less to do with Obama. Is there a point here?

Bouncing back? Unemployment is higher than when Obama took office and with Obamacare  - greater taxes, workers reduced to part-time to avoid benefits, and mass layoffs. Not to mention the fiscal cliff.

You'd do well to research your points instead of blindly believing them, because they are completely unfounded and inaccurate.



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Max King of the Wild on 09 November 2012

I went into bankruptcy 7 years ago from a collapsed lung while I was uinsured... I work at 10.28 dollars an hour... I don't have insurance because I can't afford it.

I dont make little enough not to worry about the penalty. Obama care will force me to obtain coverage that I can't afford or be penalized which I can not afford...



sperrico87 on 09 November 2012
Flanneryaug said:
sperrico87 said:
Flanneryaug said:

What makes you think he cares about the poor?

"I'm not concerned about the very poor, we have a safety net there, if it needs repair ill fix it"

"There are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe that government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you name it."

"And so my job is not to worry about those people—I'll never convince them that they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives."


So you think everyone has a right to a house?

There is a safety net for the very poor...there are thousands of them.  Not even including the nearly 100 government welfare programs, there are also Charities and shelters that are publicly and privately funded.  Is all that not enough for you?  We need to throw even more money at the problem?

There is a difference between a house and housing. Housing means not living on the street. Don't you think people are entitled to food? Apparently Romney doesn't. The fact is that we should provide opportunity for people to succeed, not just a safety net.

Housing is not a right.  No one is entitled to someone else's money.



 

Ail on 09 November 2012
mrstickball said:
Ail said:
mrstickball said:
The real calamity is about to happen.

January 1st, the Bush tax cuts expire. Taxes are going to rise on everyone - poor, middle, and rich by 5% (so taxes on the poor will rise 33%). Additionally, Obamacare taxes kick in, which is a $2,000 penalty for every worker in America that doesn't have health care at a business w/ over 50 employees.

The CBO has already said that we're going to have a recession on par with 2008, but this one will be caused by the contraction of businesses across America because of what happens.

To that, there will not be a great recovery, because we're already at a U6 of 14.6%. We are likely to hit 20, 22% or even worse for U6.

If that happens - and I hope I am wrong - Obama is going to look like a 2-term Herbert Hoover.

Taxes won't raise on the poor and middle class, congress and Obama will come to some kind of agreement...Worse case they will add 6 months to the Bush tax cuts to give themselves time to work on it... All sides agree on this, the issue is that the republicans want to keep Bush tax cuts for the rich too ( people making over 250k/year) and Obama doesn't and the republicans are saying we want to handle all the tax issues at the same time . Basically they are taking the middle class tax hostage to solve the tax for the rich, although you have to understand them, there doesn't need a vote to raise taxes on the rich, it will happen automatically on January 1st so if they don't tie what they want as part of a deal on taxes for poor/middle class ( which would need a vote and that's where Obama needs them) they will get screwed in the end...

I do agree with Obama though, there is no historic evidence that cutting taxes on rich boost heavilly the economy. Cutting taxes on poor/middle class does however as it boosts consumers purchases...

 

96% of business with more than 50 employees currently offer healthcare so the impact of Obamacare on business will not be that huge...


1. You assume a deal will be reached. I only stated what is slated to happen without a change in the system. Even then, the Obamacare taxes will kick in.

 

2. If most businesses with >50 employees offer health care, then why were so many companies granted waivers and exceptions?


Because of religious issues ( religious companies refusing to offer coverage for contraceptives for example).



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Kasz216 on 09 November 2012
KungKras said:
 

Fair enough.

What do the axes in the graph represent? The axis labels have too many avbrevations that I'm not familiar with.


http://www.salon.com/2012/10/27/the_progressive_case_against_obama/

 

explains it...  it's where the graph is from.



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dahuman on 09 November 2012

I've always said this, you vote for bad, or worse, or just don't vote. I usually just vote for the bad one and not the worse one personally, not sure about everybody else.



the_dengle on 09 November 2012
badgenome said:
the_dengle said:

Talk to a well-informed person for a few minutes and you will be saying you wish you voted for Obama.

Everything that he has done has been good for the working class. Anyone who honestly believes otherwise has been brainwashed by the right-wing media.

Before anyone responds that I've been brainwashed by the left-wing media, I don't have to be told any of this from the media. I can see it in my bills each month.

"I'm well informed because I look at my bills each month, and everyone's situation is just like mine, so if you think Obama sucks you're just brainwashed by Faux News."

"I know I am not brainwashed because I can clearly see evidence of the information I take in reflected in my own situation. I do not blindly subscribe to the words of someone on television or the radio, nor do I make uninformed assumptions based on a single source of information."



bluesinG on 09 November 2012
dsgrue3 said:
Soundwave said:

The economy has been gaining jobs for the last 25 straight months.

The stock market has regained most of the levels it was at prior to the 2008 housing crash.

It's happening slowly, but the country is bouncing back economically and will continue to do so in the next 4 years. The critics of Obama know it, that's why they're so pissed off, because they know he's going to get credit for it.

You do not just snap your finger at the biggest recession and banking crisis of the modern age and just "fix" it in 2 years. Even my Romney's own plan he'd need until 2020 to get the economy back on track.

Jobs haven't been created at a great enough rate to even support the number of people entering the workforce. Estimaes are that 150k-200k jobs per month need be created to keep up. Very few months have even 150k jobs been created. This chart is very telling:

Stock market has little to do with the economy and even less to do with Obama. Is there a point here?

Bouncing back? Unemployment is higher than when Obama took office and with Obamacare  - greater taxes, workers reduced to part-time to avoid benefits, and mass layoffs. Not to mention the fiscal cliff.

You'd do well to research your points instead of blindly believing them, because they are completely unfounded and inaccurate.

Wow, what an absurd graph. Obama's bar is so small because the US was *losing* more than 700,000 jobs per month when he took office, and it took time to dig out of that hole--the hole that Bush dug. Since March 2010, the US has added an average of 141,000 jobs per month--which would rank sixth in that chart, ahead of every Rebuplican president except Reagan.

See for yourself:

http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/CES0000000001?output_view=net_1mth



dsgrue3 on 09 November 2012
Ail said:
mrstickball said:
Ail said:

Taxes won't raise on the poor and middle class, congress and Obama will come to some kind of agreement...Worse case they will add 6 months to the Bush tax cuts to give themselves time to work on it... All sides agree on this, the issue is that the republicans want to keep Bush tax cuts for the rich too ( people making over 250k/year) and Obama doesn't and the republicans are saying we want to handle all the tax issues at the same time . Basically they are taking the middle class tax hostage to solve the tax for the rich, although you have to understand them, there doesn't need a vote to raise taxes on the rich, it will happen automatically on January 1st so if they don't tie what they want as part of a deal on taxes for poor/middle class ( which would need a vote and that's where Obama needs them) they will get screwed in the end...

I do agree with Obama though, there is no historic evidence that cutting taxes on rich boost heavilly the economy. Cutting taxes on poor/middle class does however as it boosts consumers purchases...

 

96% of business with more than 50 employees currently offer healthcare so the impact of Obamacare on business will not be that huge...


"The president will note that the CBO report states that most of the impact of the tax cuts relates to those wage-earners who make less than $200,000 a year. Extending all the Bush-initiated lower rates would boost GDP by 1.4% and help create 1.8 million jobs, the CBO report states, while allowing their expiration for those higher wage earners while maintaining the lower rates for those making $200,000 a year and less would boost GDP by 1.3% and generate 1.6 million jobs."

If you continue the cuts on the rich as well, it helps. That's the bottom line, really. I do agree that in comparison to a middle/lower class tax cut, it pales in comparison to the boost.



Flanneryaug on 09 November 2012
sperrico87 said:
Flanneryaug said:
sperrico87 said:
Flanneryaug said:

What makes you think he cares about the poor?

"I'm not concerned about the very poor, we have a safety net there, if it needs repair ill fix it"

"There are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe that government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you name it."

"And so my job is not to worry about those people—I'll never convince them that they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives."


So you think everyone has a right to a house?

There is a safety net for the very poor...there are thousands of them.  Not even including the nearly 100 government welfare programs, there are also Charities and shelters that are publicly and privately funded.  Is all that not enough for you?  We need to throw even more money at the problem?

There is a difference between a house and housing. Housing means not living on the street. Don't you think people are entitled to food? Apparently Romney doesn't. The fact is that we should provide opportunity for people to succeed, not just a safety net.

Housing is not a right.  No one is entitled to someone else's money.

By that logic, we shouldn't help the hurricane victims, and we shouldn't help starving children in Africa.



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