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DarkThanatos on 11 November 2012
Stefl1504 said:
DarkThanatos said:

If a lynch train could form that fast- then some would come from those players who have voted Radish. That would mean your vote on him would no-longer lynch him, rendering your original argument invalid. 

You literally just disproved your own statement. 

What information could be spilled? He has already roleclaimed, and it is day 1. He will not have any information on anyone else, and his feelings about others hr would have already raised as he thought he was going to be lynched. Your second part is also invalid. 

Well, maybe something that could be detrimental to hitting scum later on? Maybe something that reveals his scum mates?

@bolded, no, with an uneven number of players it is possible that I go to L-1 without one person changing his vote from radish to me. Also, I would prolly hammer before I get to L-1

That would be the single most unlikely thing to happen. All you need is one of the 6 players that voted Radish to switch and your argument is invalid. For a lynch train to become threatening, you'd need a few votes to switch- and many of the remaining players are not online. Some of the votes WOULD come from Radish lynchers. To put this in perspective. For 7 players to vote you that didn't already vote radish- you have a 1/1716 probability. Your point is wrong. 

And "Maybe something that reveals his scum mates?" So you think he is scum then? Why didnt you vote for him then. 



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Stefl1504 on 11 November 2012
DarkThanatos said:
Stefl1504 said:
DarkThanatos said:

mantlepiecek said:

~quote~

This game is power role heavy so the possibility of a vanilla town is less than 5%.

 


It is power-heavy. Not pure power. In a game of 13- for there to only be a 5% chance of hitting vanilla that would require less then one person to be vanilla. Seeing as i doubt there is just one vanilla player- i believe it is likely there are multiple. 13 power roles would be insane to balance imo. 

Either way- the point still stands. Why take the chance of hitting a less important power role when you have a strong one? 

I.e Why take the chance of hitting deputy when you already have the Doc? 

Because the doc could be protected if he claimed publicaly. Also, a nurse/deputy being hit holds the same value as hiting the cop/doc on night 1. Later on, depending on their actions, killing the power who actually had actions to be taken, can become more valueable.


What? This wasn't a specific case. Are you telling me that some roles are not stronger then others? Thats the point I'm making here. If you argue that all roles are worth the same- then I'd say you are wrong. 

Correction to my last post: I believe there was an unvote happening on radish, so I couldn't hammer him.

No, not all roles are worth the same, but all non-negative roles hold the same potential to help their team, normally a tracker is less than a cop/watcher in terms of power, but he stills holds the potential to catch scum. A roleblocker can help prevent kills the same as a doc can, a hitman can kill through protection, but same can be done by bus driving scum.



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DarkThanatos on 11 November 2012
mantlepiecek said:
DarkThanatos said:
mantlepiecek said:

I did look back but didn't say it to make radish roleclaim. I believed it would be for his best if he is town and for his worst if he is scum.

Why do you care if you think he is scum who has overwhelming evidence against him though?


I do not understand what you mean by the first point. You did look back- but you deliberately misled town? Thats what I'm reading, but I may be misinterpreting. 

Secondly- it's not the effect on him that concerns me (although by saying it it may have stopped players voting him) 

It's that is caused others to claim. If Stefl turns out to be town- you just made him reveal a powerful role. 

I didn't deliberately mislead town. I just didn't say I was wrong about radish being lynched because I wanted him to roleclaim. Maybe you think it is scummy right now, but sometimes role-claiming is the only way one can save themselves from a lynch, and if radish is town, I wanted to help him out.

You realize that he is not lynched right now. Let us assume I am scum trying to manipulate him into roleclaiming. I could make it so that I both lynched him and made him claim - which would work out a lot better for me, no?

Instead I tried to make it so that he isn't lynched this early. He could still be scum but town radish isn't as strong a defender as you may think. I am sure we can find out if he is scum or not later on as well, no need to rush on day 1 with radish.

That's a valid counter-explaination. It still doesn't get rid of Stefl claiming point- but that makes little sense without the rest. Consider the point dropped. 

As to your 

 no need to rush on day 1 with radish.


post- I agree, but I have been waiting for him to persuade me otherwise for two days now. He hasn't done that. I would be perfectly happy with a lynch on him now. 

Although with this hole Stefl is digging himself- I'd happily lynch him now too. More then Prof now.



So hyped for Rome 2: Total War

Stefl1504 on 11 November 2012
DarkThanatos said:
Stefl1504 said:

~quote~

Well, maybe something that could be detrimental to hitting scum later on? Maybe something that reveals his scum mates?

@bolded, no, with an uneven number of players it is possible that I go to L-1 without one person changing his vote from radish to me. Also, I would prolly hammer before I get to L-1

That would be the single most unlikely thing to happen. All you need is one of the 6 players that voted Radish to switch and your argument is invalid. For a lynch train to become threatening, you'd need a few votes to switch- and many of the remaining players are not online. Some of the votes WOULD come from Radish lynchers. To put this in perspective. For 7 players to vote you that didn't already vote radish- you have a 1/1716 probability. Your point is wrong. 

And "Maybe something that reveals his scum mates?" So you think he is scum then? Why didnt you vote for him then. 

I made two statements in a row. One assuming he is town > giving us information that can be detrimental to catching scum, and one assuming he is scum > revealing information that hints on his scum mates.



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theprof00 on 11 November 2012

unvote
Vote darkT



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theprof00 on 11 November 2012

Now stefl is a better lynch than I?
You have like nothing on stefl!



DarkThanatos on 11 November 2012
Stefl1504 said:
DarkThanatos said:

What? This wasn't a specific case. Are you telling me that some roles are not stronger then others? Thats the point I'm making here. If you argue that all roles are worth the same- then I'd say you are wrong. 

Correction to my last post: I believe there was an unvote happening on radish, so I couldn't hammer him.

No, not all roles are worth the same, but all non-negative roles hold the same potential to help their team, normally a tracker is less than a cop/watcher in terms of power, but he stills holds the potential to catch scum. A roleblocker can help prevent kills the same as a doc can, a hitman can kill through protection, but same can be done by bus driving scum.


I never said they weren't useful. I'm saying why wouldn't Mafia lynch a strong role if they know it? It's not a difficult concept to grasp. You're putting words in my mouth to try and disprove my case. It's not working, your just making yourself look scummier. 



So hyped for Rome 2: Total War

DarkThanatos on 11 November 2012
theprof00 said:
Wow dt take a concrete stance on something both mantle and radish cannot be scum if you believe the words you said. Which one is it? Where is your vote?
The number one tunneling person here is you. On radish since the start of the day and still there with me, someone who is increasingly bevoming your focal point not even being given an fos when i even dared you to lynch me
you are scum.:


Wow, paranoid much. I've barely mentioned you in recent posts. I've been showing Stefl's attempts to squirm out to be invalid. 



So hyped for Rome 2: Total War

Stefl1504 on 11 November 2012
DarkThanatos said:
Stefl1504 said:
DarkThanatos said:

What? This wasn't a specific case. Are you telling me that some roles are not stronger then others? Thats the point I'm making here. If you argue that all roles are worth the same- then I'd say you are wrong. 

Correction to my last post: I believe there was an unvote happening on radish, so I couldn't hammer him.

No, not all roles are worth the same, but all non-negative roles hold the same potential to help their team, normally a tracker is less than a cop/watcher in terms of power, but he stills holds the potential to catch scum. A roleblocker can help prevent kills the same as a doc can, a hitman can kill through protection, but same can be done by bus driving scum.


I never said they weren't useful. I'm saying why wouldn't Mafia lynch a strong role if they know it? It's not a difficult concept to grasp. You're putting words in my mouth to try and disprove my case. It's not working, your just making yourself look scummier. 

Please point out more specific where I put words into YOUR mouth.



Currently Streaming: Tales of Xillia & Best Doto - My DotA 2 stats

DarkThanatos on 11 November 2012
theprof00 said:
Anyone else think its strange that evryone is jumping on stefl so suddenly?
I smell a bandwagon.

While looking back through the thread I found this. Prof trying to remove suspicion on Stefl after a few people put him low down a scum list and one vote. 

Here he is again,trying to defend Stefl by saying i have nothing on him. A whole lot of nothing with the amount of posts disproving his points I have made. 

You are now even voting me because of it and your own paranoia. You are clearly linked in some manner. Scummates, neighbours, lovers?



So hyped for Rome 2: Total War