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Forums - Nintendo - Wii U "surprisingly powerful," textures "could be used in a movie."

VGKing said:
No to be a pessimist, but this is to be expected, Wii U is like a modern Xbox 360 in terms of architecture.
It is in no way a "next-gen" console though in terms of power.

PS4 and Xbox 720 will be exponentially more powerful than their predecessors.

What else can you predict? How do you think they will sell for instance?



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VGKing said:
No to be a pessimist, but this is to be expected, Wii U is like a modern Xbox 360 in terms of architecture.
It is in no way a "next-gen" console though in terms of power.

PS4 and Xbox 720 will be exponentially more powerful than their predecessors.

Aaw man, not this again...

Just take a look at the link in my sig and you'll understand why PS4 won't be much more powerful... Nowhere near 10x as powerful... made 4x times... also read this: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=136756&page=1



I'm on Twitter @DanneSandin!

Furthermore, I think VGChartz should add a "Like"-button.

JEMC said:
selnor said:
JGarret said:
Ok, I hope we´ll be able to see at least one game that blows the current HD systems out of the water by December 2013.

Remember what a difference one year made for the 360 when Gears was released, it was the first title that actually 'felt next gen'.

Now I expect something similar here, hoping to see at least one game (maybe from Retro?) that really makes me think "welcome, next generation, now we´re talking!" as far as graphical capabilities and visual effects are concerned..and that, ideally by December 2013, just as the other next gen systems are launching.

Problem is, by then noone will care. Especially if Nextbox releases November 2013 with its widely rumoured specs being so much higher than WiiU.

I fully expect to see the likes of Watchdogs among others on the 720 launch. And theres at least 4 Microsoft studios who we know have been working on next gen games for 12 months now.

Actually, a lot of people will care, given the appropiate "ifs", being the most important one if the game launches on WiiU (after all it hasn't been announced and at E3 they were very vague when asked about a possible WiiU version of the game).

IF the game looks as good as the nextbox/PS4 versions. There is no reason to belive that it will look worse than the other versions, after all developers will have had the final WiiU dev kits for more than 1 year and will be more comfortable and used to develop for WiiU than for the other consoles, giving them the extra knowledge to get that bit more from the console to compensate the lack of raw power compared to its counterparts..

IF the console is 50 or 100 €/$/£ cheaper than the other ones. Why should you buy the other consoles for that game when you can buy the WiiU and the game for the price of those consoles?

IF they make good use of the Gamepad. In the game the character uses a tablet/smartphone to hack or control other devices. Devs could use the gamepad's screen to do that, making the players feel more involved in the game. Will the other consoles do that? Not that we know (and don't say the smartglass thing of Microsoft because that means buying 2 devices as well as having to let the pad to use the tablet and then pick up the pad again, something wouldn't happen with WiiU)


If Watchdogs comes to Wii U it will be severely gimped visually. 1 because of disc size and 2 because it only has 1 gbram for games. Watchdogs will not look like the PC game on Wii U. 1080p native rayman is one thing. 1080p native Watchdogs is another. I would expect 720p native with texture and draw distance drops on Wii U bare minimum. Ram is now so important, as devs wanted 1 gig on 360 and PS3 te last 2 years not 1 gig for a new console. 



selnor said:
JEMC said:

Actually, a lot of people will care, given the appropiate "ifs", being the most important one if the game launches on WiiU (after all it hasn't been announced and at E3 they were very vague when asked about a possible WiiU version of the game).

IF the game looks as good as the nextbox/PS4 versions. There is no reason to belive that it will look worse than the other versions, after all developers will have had the final WiiU dev kits for more than 1 year and will be more comfortable and used to develop for WiiU than for the other consoles, giving them the extra knowledge to get that bit more from the console to compensate the lack of raw power compared to its counterparts..

IF the console is 50 or 100 €/$/£ cheaper than the other ones. Why should you buy the other consoles for that game when you can buy the WiiU and the game for the price of those consoles?

IF they make good use of the Gamepad. In the game the character uses a tablet/smartphone to hack or control other devices. Devs could use the gamepad's screen to do that, making the players feel more involved in the game. Will the other consoles do that? Not that we know (and don't say the smartglass thing of Microsoft because that means buying 2 devices as well as having to let the pad to use the tablet and then pick up the pad again, something wouldn't happen with WiiU)


If Watchdogs comes to Wii U it will be severely gimped visually. 1 because of disc size and 2 because it only has 1 gbram for games. Watchdogs will not look like the PC game on Wii U. 1080p native rayman is one thing. 1080p native Watchdogs is another. I would expect 720p native with texture and draw distance drops on Wii U bare minimum. Ram is now so important, as devs wanted 1 gig on 360 and PS3 te last 2 years not 1 gig for a new console.

Disc size won't limit the game as WiiU uses 25GB discs (maybe 50Gb with dual layer discs), which will be enough. And why do you bring to this discussion the PC? The PC version will look miles better than any other version of the game, being the WiiU or the PS4/nextbox ones, no surprise here.

Will the game run at 720p on WiiU? Maybe. Will it run at 1080p on the other next gen consoles? Maybe. We don't know because we know almost nothing about it, therefore asuming that the WiiU version will look worse is only your opinion, and I disagree.

And those 1GB (by now) of RAM won't be a limit now. In 3 years it probably will, but not so early in the gen.



Please excuse my bad English.

Former gaming PC: i5-4670k@stock (for now), 16Gb RAM 1600 MHz and a GTX 1070

Current gaming PC: R5-7600, 32GB RAM 6000MT/s (CL30) and a RX 9060XT 16GB

Steam / Live / NNID : jonxiquet    Add me if you want, but I'm a single player gamer.

JEMC said:
selnor said:
JEMC said:

Actually, a lot of people will care, given the appropiate "ifs", being the most important one if the game launches on WiiU (after all it hasn't been announced and at E3 they were very vague when asked about a possible WiiU version of the game).

IF the game looks as good as the nextbox/PS4 versions. There is no reason to belive that it will look worse than the other versions, after all developers will have had the final WiiU dev kits for more than 1 year and will be more comfortable and used to develop for WiiU than for the other consoles, giving them the extra knowledge to get that bit more from the console to compensate the lack of raw power compared to its counterparts..

IF the console is 50 or 100 €/$/£ cheaper than the other ones. Why should you buy the other consoles for that game when you can buy the WiiU and the game for the price of those consoles?

IF they make good use of the Gamepad. In the game the character uses a tablet/smartphone to hack or control other devices. Devs could use the gamepad's screen to do that, making the players feel more involved in the game. Will the other consoles do that? Not that we know (and don't say the smartglass thing of Microsoft because that means buying 2 devices as well as having to let the pad to use the tablet and then pick up the pad again, something wouldn't happen with WiiU)


If Watchdogs comes to Wii U it will be severely gimped visually. 1 because of disc size and 2 because it only has 1 gbram for games. Watchdogs will not look like the PC game on Wii U. 1080p native rayman is one thing. 1080p native Watchdogs is another. I would expect 720p native with texture and draw distance drops on Wii U bare minimum. Ram is now so important, as devs wanted 1 gig on 360 and PS3 te last 2 years not 1 gig for a new console.

Disc size won't limit the game as WiiU uses 25GB discs (maybe 50Gb with dual layer discs), which will be enough. And why do you bring to this discussion the PC? The PC version will look miles better than any other version of the game, being the WiiU or the PS4/nextbox ones, no surprise here.

Will the game run at 720p on WiiU? Maybe. Will it run at 1080p on the other next gen consoles? Maybe. We don't know because we know almost nothing about it, therefore asuming that the WiiU version will look worse is only your opinion, and I disagree.

And those 1GB (by now) of RAM won't be a limit now. In 3 years it probably will, but not so early in the gen.

he brought PC into it because that is the only platform we have seen Watch Dogs running on and Superchunk claimed that "Wii U can easily run what you saw in WatchDogs." implying that the Wii U could match the game running on a super high end PC at 1080p. 



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There are movies and movies. The textures used in the Naruto games on PS3 and 360 are good enough for a Naturo Movie. The quote is actually meaningless without a movie to put in context.



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."

Jimi Hendrix

 

arx said:
JEMC said:
selnor said:

If Watchdogs comes to Wii U it will be severely gimped visually. 1 because of disc size and 2 because it only has 1 gbram for games. Watchdogs will not look like the PC game on Wii U. 1080p native rayman is one thing. 1080p native Watchdogs is another. I would expect 720p native with texture and draw distance drops on Wii U bare minimum. Ram is now so important, as devs wanted 1 gig on 360 and PS3 te last 2 years not 1 gig for a new console.

Disc size won't limit the game as WiiU uses 25GB discs (maybe 50Gb with dual layer discs), which will be enough. And why do you bring to this discussion the PC? The PC version will look miles better than any other version of the game, being the WiiU or the PS4/nextbox ones, no surprise here.

Will the game run at 720p on WiiU? Maybe. Will it run at 1080p on the other next gen consoles? Maybe. We don't know because we know almost nothing about it, therefore asuming that the WiiU version will look worse is only your opinion, and I disagree.

And those 1GB (by now) of RAM won't be a limit now. In 3 years it probably will, but not so early in the gen.

he brought PC into it because that is the only platform we have seen Watch Dogs running on and Superchunk claimed that "Wii U can easily run what you saw in WatchDogs." implying that the Wii U could match the game running on a super high end PC at 1080p. 

Ok, thanks for clarifying that.

No console version will look better than the PC version. The question is which, if any, differences will be between the console versions (if it ever comes to WiiU)



Please excuse my bad English.

Former gaming PC: i5-4670k@stock (for now), 16Gb RAM 1600 MHz and a GTX 1070

Current gaming PC: R5-7600, 32GB RAM 6000MT/s (CL30) and a RX 9060XT 16GB

Steam / Live / NNID : jonxiquet    Add me if you want, but I'm a single player gamer.

JEMC said:
selnor said:
JEMC said:

Actually, a lot of people will care, given the appropiate "ifs", being the most important one if the game launches on WiiU (after all it hasn't been announced and at E3 they were very vague when asked about a possible WiiU version of the game).

IF the game looks as good as the nextbox/PS4 versions. There is no reason to belive that it will look worse than the other versions, after all developers will have had the final WiiU dev kits for more than 1 year and will be more comfortable and used to develop for WiiU than for the other consoles, giving them the extra knowledge to get that bit more from the console to compensate the lack of raw power compared to its counterparts..

IF the console is 50 or 100 €/$/£ cheaper than the other ones. Why should you buy the other consoles for that game when you can buy the WiiU and the game for the price of those consoles?

IF they make good use of the Gamepad. In the game the character uses a tablet/smartphone to hack or control other devices. Devs could use the gamepad's screen to do that, making the players feel more involved in the game. Will the other consoles do that? Not that we know (and don't say the smartglass thing of Microsoft because that means buying 2 devices as well as having to let the pad to use the tablet and then pick up the pad again, something wouldn't happen with WiiU)


If Watchdogs comes to Wii U it will be severely gimped visually. 1 because of disc size and 2 because it only has 1 gbram for games. Watchdogs will not look like the PC game on Wii U. 1080p native rayman is one thing. 1080p native Watchdogs is another. I would expect 720p native with texture and draw distance drops on Wii U bare minimum. Ram is now so important, as devs wanted 1 gig on 360 and PS3 te last 2 years not 1 gig for a new console.

Disc size won't limit the game as WiiU uses 25GB discs (maybe 50Gb with dual layer discs), which will be enough. And why do you bring to this discussion the PC? The PC version will look miles better than any other version of the game, being the WiiU or the PS4/nextbox ones, no surprise here.

Will the game run at 720p on WiiU? Maybe. Will it run at 1080p on the other next gen consoles? Maybe. We don't know because we know almost nothing about it, therefore asuming that the WiiU version will look worse is only your opinion, and I disagree.

And those 1GB (by now) of RAM won't be a limit now. In 3 years it probably will, but not so early in the gen.

512 mb in 360 ps3 has been an issue for years. Because its one thing saying the entire screen res is 720p but half the problem of textures not being crisp and beautiful is the resolution of those textures. This all becomes so important the more the machine can do. By 2015 I fully expect even with the rumoured 8 gb ram the nextbox will have maybe 2016 that some devs will want more than that. 

All the big guns Crytek, Epic, ID Software, EA etc have asked for much more ram in the next generation than what they upped it to this gen. Hence why I firmly believe the several rumours that Nextbox is 8 gb ram and 12 cores of which 8 cores are for games.

As Watchdogs is being released next year, The nextbox with those specs will easily match the PC version and then some. The Wii U is not going to struggle on GPU. It will struggle as the HD consoles of this gen have the last 4 years. On Ram. Look at Skyrim on PS3. Look at Fallout 3 on PS3 and that was halfway through the generation.

The more I look at the Wii U the more I realise its gonna suffer in Hardware. Because the ram is just to much of an issue. Devs were saying 3 years ago they wish PS3 and 360 had 1 gb ram and that that would help games be much better. 3 years on from that Wii U is releasing with the same ram available that console devs were asking for 3 years ago. Not enough. Wii U should have had at least 4 gb ram for games. At least. 



selnor said:

512 mb in 360 ps3 has been an issue for years. Because its one thing saying the entire screen res is 720p but half the problem of textures not being crisp and beautiful is the resolution of those textures. This all becomes so important the more the machine can do. By 2015 I fully expect even with the rumoured 8 gb ram the nextbox will have maybe 2016 that some devs will want more than that. 

All the big guns Crytek, Epic, ID Software, EA etc have asked for much more ram in the next generation than what they upped it to this gen. Hence why I firmly believe the several rumours that Nextbox is 8 gb ram and 12 cores of which 8 cores are for games.

As Watchdogs is being released next year, The nextbox with those specs will easily match the PC version and then some. The Wii U is not going to struggle on GPU. It will struggle as the HD consoles of this gen have the last 4 years. On Ram. Look at Skyrim on PS3. Look at Fallout 3 on PS3 and that was halfway through the generation.

The more I look at the Wii U the more I realise its gonna suffer in Hardware. Because the ram is just to much of an issue. Devs were saying 3 years ago they wish PS3 and 360 had 1 gb ram and that that would help games be much better. 3 years on from that Wii U is releasing with the same ram available that console devs were asking for 3 years ago. Not enough. Wii U should have had at least 4 gb ram for games. At least. 

The major difference is the Wii U is very capable of texture streaming.  This means you don't need nearly as much RAM.

Say a stage or scene has 300 MB's of textures.   That's a lot of RAM to eat up.  But if you just stream the necessary textures that actually need rendering, you can reduce that load significantly.    In other words, you can have a stage or scene that requires more texture capacity than the RAM you actually have and it won't matter.

And don't forget the massive eDRAM.   That also reduces the need for a lot of standard RAM.



The rEVOLution is not being televised

Viper1 said:
selnor said:

512 mb in 360 ps3 has been an issue for years. Because its one thing saying the entire screen res is 720p but half the problem of textures not being crisp and beautiful is the resolution of those textures. This all becomes so important the more the machine can do. By 2015 I fully expect even with the rumoured 8 gb ram the nextbox will have maybe 2016 that some devs will want more than that. 

All the big guns Crytek, Epic, ID Software, EA etc have asked for much more ram in the next generation than what they upped it to this gen. Hence why I firmly believe the several rumours that Nextbox is 8 gb ram and 12 cores of which 8 cores are for games.

As Watchdogs is being released next year, The nextbox with those specs will easily match the PC version and then some. The Wii U is not going to struggle on GPU. It will struggle as the HD consoles of this gen have the last 4 years. On Ram. Look at Skyrim on PS3. Look at Fallout 3 on PS3 and that was halfway through the generation.

The more I look at the Wii U the more I realise its gonna suffer in Hardware. Because the ram is just to much of an issue. Devs were saying 3 years ago they wish PS3 and 360 had 1 gb ram and that that would help games be much better. 3 years on from that Wii U is releasing with the same ram available that console devs were asking for 3 years ago. Not enough. Wii U should have had at least 4 gb ram for games. At least. 

The major difference is the Wii U is very capable of texture streaming.  This means you don't need nearly as much RAM.

Say a stage or scene has 300 MB's of textures.   That's a lot of RAM to eat up.  But if you just stream the necessary textures that actually need rendering, you can reduce that load significantly.    In other words, you can have a stage or scene that requires more texture capacity than the RAM you actually have and it won't matter.

And don't forget the massive eDRAM.   That also reduces the need for a lot of standard RAM.

That still doesnt compensate for a loss of 7 gb ram compred to competiton. Lets say nextbox has 2 gb for system and games has 6 gb available. Thats still 5x the amount of ram. Not forgetting the same 5 rumours of Nextbox devkits have said 512 mb EDRam also. 

I am worried for the Wii U for certain games from 3rd paties. For example I dont expect to see my fave RPG Elder Scrolls on it. Definately not Elder Scrolls 6 anyway. I believe the ram issue will bite it. 

I hope Im wrong. But theres quite a few developers I feel will just not build a Wii U version due to the cuts it will need because of ram. 

Another thing that caught my attention was how inferior the Nintendo Graphics demos were of Wii U compared to CryEngine 3 next gen demos and Unreal Engine 4. The latter 2 killed the Zelda demo and the wierd lake with bird demo Nintendo had. Not to mention the Samaritan demo running on realtime Unreal 4 development. 

I am worried.