By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics - Raise Taxes on Rich to Reward True Job Creators: Nick Hanauer

bannedagain on 06 December 2011
johnsobas said:
none of that matters in the end. If you don't end the fed it doesn't matter how much you raise or lower taxes on anybody.



AGREED!!!!!!!!!!!! another problem. You could also regulate it a lot better. this would produce better results then them giving 7,770,000,000,000 to the big banks. WHAT A JOKE>



Around the Network
bannedagain on 06 December 2011
HappySqurriel said:
Salnax said:
Marks said:
America got on perfectly fine from 1776-1913 without any income tax at all (except during wars when they were temporarily introduced and then repealed). I don't get why people think more taxes are the answer to everything.

How about we stop trying to make everyone equal, and let everyone be free to do what they will with their money.


The government needs way more money now than it did 100 years ago. Between a superpower military, helping the sick, mantaining infrastructure, and investing in the 1%'s companies, they need all the cash they can get.


As a percentage of the economy, why would they need more money?

While you need to spend more money on infrastructure and the military the increase in productivity has resulted in massive increases in GDP should more than compensate for these increased needs.

Beyond that, in every measureable way the poor have been far worse off because of the war on poverty that was started in the 1960s and everyone should question whether the government should really be in the charity business; especially being how much more efficient and effective charities are.



wow you are full of it. This is complete bull. No need to call it all out. GREED BUDDY GREED> your facts hold no weight. Because you say charities are more effective hum. Yea right. You want a me society and not we society. LEave to a third world country.



mrstickball on 06 December 2011
bannedagain said:



A Flat tax won't cut it. Plus the more money you make the more of it you don't need or should put back into the system because the system helped you make that money in the first place. If you make 25 million a year I'm sure you could get by on 25% let alone 50% of that money, I would say a fair tax is 38% for the ubber rich.

You are correct that the more money a person has, the less they need. The question I want to ask you is: What do they do with the money they don't spend? Please answer that.

People that make this much, pay between 1-15% while that money they made caused how many millions in damage to the enviroment, Roads, Bridges, Drinking water, eco systems. You didn't make your money off your roads you paid for. everyone paid for them. Your money moves millions of products around on those roads and rails and what ever else.

Actually, the uber-rich pay on average 23% of their income in taxes. The top 1% of income earners are responsible for 60% of the tax burden in the United States. Additionally, these rich people aren't the only ones damaging the said areas. If the roads are damaged, its because the business is employing middle-class truck drivers to drive on the roads. If the drinking water is being polluted, its because a worker is creating a chemical by-product going into the water... Not just the rich person.

This stuff is not cheap.  So you have to put back into what has allowed you to make that much. Regulations are good in many area's, it's usually to protect the consumers or the welfare of other people. So you don't give a crap if people  catch cancer from plants that produce mass polution but only about how much you make.  LEts also consider a regulation that would stop mothers that are on welfare from having more then 2 kids and if so have to get there tubes tide to keep getting welfare. However if someone with more kids falls on hard times and needs help which didn't before, they should also do the same. This would stop people from being lifers on the welfare system. However if there handicap or have severe Disabilities Then we should be the people to say. I will help you because thats what america is about. not selfish people that could care less. If so, go move to a third world country that operates that way and plays favorites.

You say that you will help someone because 'thats what America is about'. Let me ask you: When was the last time that YOU physically helped another person. Not through taxes, but through your own money or work?

Plus I'm willing to bet that you are middle wage earner, which in this case taxing the rich, well bring you tax's down and your pay up or just bring your pay up. Because that money will be pumped into our economy in the form of infrastructer and putting people to work that are unionised, which make good money and great health care.  They can afford a nice life, not rich but good. This in turn gives demand for products and employment. Employers compete for you, giving you have the right skills.

Alternatively, I could say that the money paid in taxes by the rich is no longer pumped into venture capital and investments which create new middle-class jobs, union jobs, and so on. Statistically speaking, money that is invested by government via taxes produces very poor results for the dollar. You argued against welfare cases earlier because of their abuses. Do you realize that in the same way, many companies have taken tax money and mal-invested it, creating no jobs and no products for people? Look at the Solyndra scandal. They took $500 million in taxpayer funding and hired about 100 people for 3 years. That is a horrible return on investment, and it was fully backed by government re-distribution of incomes.

TIme for you the 1% to pay. Only the greedy, greedy people own't agree with this action. I can tell who is in vgchartz.

Do you realize that a rich man created this website for you to post on? Maybe some people out there are hard workers, and are entitled to the fruits of their labor. Rather, most rich people want a simple flat tax that ensures that the uber-rich cannot take advantage of the system. The most egregious violations of tax code happen because we have deductions and loopholes. A flat tax prevents that.





Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

bannedagain on 06 December 2011
mrstickball said:
bannedagain said:



A Flat tax won't cut it. Plus the more money you make the more of it you don't need or should put back into the system because the system helped you make that money in the first place. If you make 25 million a year I'm sure you could get by on 25% let alone 50% of that money, I would say a fair tax is 38% for the ubber rich.

You are correct that the more money a person has, the less they need. The question I want to ask you is: What do they do with the money they don't spend? Please answer that.------------- ( PUT IT INTO OFF SHORE BANK ACCOUNTS OR THEY FIND LOOP HOLE'S TO INVEST INTO OR BUSINESS OUT OF UNITED STATES. IF THE DEMAND IS NOT THERE THEN THEY WON'T HIRE ANYONE.)

People that make this much, pay between 1-15% while that money they made caused how many millions in damage to the enviroment, Roads, Bridges, Drinking water, eco systems. You didn't make your money off your roads you paid for. everyone paid for them. Your money moves millions of products around on those roads and rails and what ever else.

Actually, the uber-rich pay on average 23% of their income in taxes. The top 1% of income earners are responsible for 60% of the tax burden in the United States. Additionally, these rich people aren't the only ones damaging the said areas. If the roads are damaged, its because the business is employing middle-class truck drivers to drive on the roads. If the drinking water is being polluted, its because a worker is creating a chemical by-product going into the water... Not just the rich person. -------------(yep but the rich are paying for this to happen. there company profits off of it. The top 1% pay that much money beacause they have all the money) They pay between 1% -15% OF THE ACTUAL MONEY THEY MAKE, SO LETS NOT TRY TO SPIN THE NUMBERS. OTHERS HAVE NO MONEY SO THEY COULDN'T ACCOUNT FOR THE MONEY THESE BIG WIGS MAKE. 30 TOP CORPORATIONS MADE  OVER 160 BILLION WHILE THEY PAID NO TAXES IN THE LAST THREE YEARS. I PAID MORE THEN THEM AND SO DID YOU)

This stuff is not cheap.  So you have to put back into what has allowed you to make that much. Regulations are good in many area's, it's usually to protect the consumers or the welfare of other people. So you don't give a crap if people  catch cancer from plants that produce mass polution but only about how much you make.  LEts also consider a regulation that would stop mothers that are on welfare from having more then 2 kids and if so have to get there tubes tide to keep getting welfare. However if someone with more kids falls on hard times and needs help which didn't before, they should also do the same. This would stop people from being lifers on the welfare system. However if there handicap or have severe Disabilities Then we should be the people to say. I will help you because thats what america is about. not selfish people that could care less. If so, go move to a third world country that operates that way and plays favorites.

You say that you will help someone because 'thats what America is about'. Let me ask you: When was the last time that YOU physically helped another person. Not through taxes, but through your own money or work?( ACTUALLY YEA I  DRIVE AROUND AND HELP A DIABETIC LADY AND DONATE MONEY ANY TIME I SEE DONATIONS THAT ARE LEGIT, MAYBE CHANGE BUT IT'S WHAT I GOT. OH YEA, I HAVE TO HELP HER OUT BECAUSE THEY GIVE HER NOTING FOR HELP, SHE'S WORKED AND PAID TAX'S ALL HER LIFE. NOW SHE'S DISABLED AND DOESN'T GET AROUND FAST.  I BRING HER MY LEFT OVERS BECAUSE SHE SOMETIMES CAN'T AFFORD FOOD. SHE HAS NO CABLE AND INTERNET. SO SHE IS NOT WASTEFUL BUT HEY, WHO HAVE YOU HELPED? THATS ONE OF THE PEOPLE I HAVE HELPED OUT. NO NEED TO RIGHT YOU A BOOK ON WHY I CARE MORE THEN YOU DO.

Plus I'm willing to bet that you are middle wage earner, which in this case taxing the rich, well bring you tax's down and your pay up or just bring your pay up. Because that money will be pumped into our economy in the form of infrastructer and putting people to work that are unionised, which make good money and great health care.  They can afford a nice life, not rich but good. This in turn gives demand for products and employment. Employers compete for you, giving you have the right skills.

Alternatively, I could say that the money paid in taxes by the rich is no longer pumped into venture capital and investments which create new middle-class jobs, union jobs, and so on. Statistically speaking, money that is invested by government via taxes produces very poor results for the dollar. You argued against welfare cases earlier because of their abuses. Do you realize that in the same way, many companies have taken tax money and mal-invested it, creating no jobs and no products for people? Look at the Solyndra scandal. They took $500 million in taxpayer funding and hired about 100 people for 3 years. That is a horrible return on investment, and it was fully backed by government re-distribution of incomes. (THIS IS ONE FAILURE OUT OF THE MANY INVESTMENTS THAT PAID OUT WELL. GLAD YOU WATCH FOX NEWS. iT'S NEW TECH AND THERE ARE PLENTY OF BUSINESS I CAN'T POINT TO THAT SHOWS THE OPPISITE OF WHAT YOU CLAIM.)

TIme for you the 1% to pay. Only the greedy, greedy people own't agree with this action. I can tell who is in vgchartz.

Do you realize that a rich man created this website for you to post on? Maybe some people out there are hard workers, and are entitled to the fruits of their labor. Rather, most rich people want a simple flat tax that ensures that the uber-rich cannot take advantage of the system. The most egregious violations of tax code happen because we have deductions and loopholes. A flat tax prevents that. -----(NO ONE IS ASKING FOR ALL THERE MONEY AND IF WE TAX THEM 38% WITH NO LOOP HOLES, THEY WILL GO HOME, DO THE SAME THINGS AND LIVE THE SAME WAY. PEOPLE DO DERSERVE WHAT THEY GET BUT THEY ALSO GOT TO GIVE BACK TO WHAT HELPED THEM GET THERE. OUR ROADS, SCHOOLS AND THINGS THAT WE PAID FOR. ROADS AND BRIDGES ARE EXPENSIVE AND THEY NEED TO BE KEPT UP OR YOU THINK ALL OF THIS FIXES IS SELF, IT DOESN'T AND THIS SHOWS YOUR SELFISHNESS. ONCE AGAIN A PROBLEM WITH THE NEW AGE OF PEOPLE. AFTER THE DEPRESSION YOU WHERE SEEN AS A PIG IF YOU DIDN'T GIVE BACK TO YOUR COUNTRY. THEY WHERE TAXED HEAVILY, 90% AND WE ARE NOT ASKING FOR THIS, 38% I PERSONALLY FEEL IS RIGHT WITH NO LOOP HOLES. HAVE SOME F'ING PRIDE IN YOUR COUNTRY, IF YOU JUST WANT TO USE AND ABUSE THE PEOPLE AND THE ENVIROMENT, FINE. GO SOME WHERE ELSE. YOUR NOT A PATRIOT. WE CAN ACCOUNT THIS TO  A ALL ABOUT ME ADDITUDE.)







mrstickball on 06 December 2011
bannedagain said:
mrstickball said:

bannedagain said:

PUT IT INTO OFF SHORE BANK ACCOUNTS OR THEY FIND LOOP HOLE'S TO INVEST INTO OR BUSINESS OUT OF UNITED STATES. IF THE DEMAND IS NOT THERE THEN THEY WON'T HIRE ANYONE.

And what does a bank account do with the money? They use the money for loans to help people found businesses. If you read the initial post, you'd know that this person in the 0.1% is a venture capitalist that invested in many American businesses. Not overseas. In fact, most VC stays right here in the US.

Lets go even further: If they aren't investing in businesses outside the US, why is that? Why not invest in businesses here? I'd argue a lot of it has to do with regulations. With significant regulations to the market, its harder to found and fund businesses. Therefore, reductions of regulations would likely benefit new American businesses, and fund a stronger middle class.

(yep but the rich are paying for this to happen. there company profits off of it. The top 1% pay that much money beacause they have all the money) They pay between 1% -15% OF THE ACTUAL MONEY THEY MAKE, SO LETS NOT TRY TO SPIN THE NUMBERS. OTHERS HAVE NO MONEY SO THEY COULDN'T ACCOUNT FOR THE MONEY THESE BIG WIGS MAKE. 30 TOP CORPORATIONS MADE  OVER 160 BILLION WHILE THEY PAID NO TAXES IN THE LAST THREE YEARS. I PAID MORE THEN THEM AND SO DID YOU)

Where is your data for this? Provide concrete aggregate information that states the top 1% pay betwen 1 and 15%, because the extensive research I've done into marginal rates in the US has the top 1% paying 23% on average, not betwen 1 and 15%. I am calling you out on this.

ACTUALLY YEA I  DRIVE AROUND AND HELP A DIABETIC LADY AND DONATE MONEY ANY TIME I SEE DONATIONS THAT ARE LEGIT. OH YEA I HAVE TO HELP HERE OUT BECAUSE THEY GIVE HER NOTING FOR HELP, SHE'S WORKED AND PAID TAX'S ALL HER LIFE. NOW SHE'S DISABLED AND DOESN'T GET AROUND FAST.  I BRING HER MY LEFT OVERS BECAUSE SHE SOMETIMES CAN'T AFFORD FOOD. SHE HAS NO CABLE AND INTERNET. SO SHE NOT WASTEFUL BUT HEY WHO HAVE YOU HELPED? THATS ONE OF THE PERSON I HAVE HELPED OUT. NO NEED TO RIGHT YOU A BOOK ON WHY I CARE MORE THEN YOU DO.

Good for you. I am not meaning that sarcastically, either. I am glad you help others. The reality is that many of the richest people in America also do much to help the poor and needy. Government taxation will merely take away their ability to help others. Data shows that when you, I, or anyone else engages in charity for the needy, it is far more effective than the government doing it. Personally, I'd rather keep my money and help the poor than the government taking it away and deciding to provide it to someone else that may or may not deserve it.

.(THIS IS ONE FAILURE OUT OF THE MANY INVESTMENTS THAT PAID OUT WELL. GLAD YOU WATCH FOX NEWS.)

Actually, I don't have cable TV. I can't say I've ever watched Fox News.


NO ONE IS ASKING FOR ALL THERE MONEY AND IF WE TAX THEM 38% WITH NO LOOP HOLES, THEY WILL GO HOME, DO THE SAME THINGS AND LIVE THE SAME WAY. PEOPLE DO DERSERVE WHAT THEY GET BUT THEY ALSO GOT TO GIVE BACK TO WHAT HELPED THEM GET THERE. OUR ROADS, SCHOOLS AND THINGS THAT WE PAID FOR. ROADS AND BRIDGES ARE EXPENSIVE AND THEY NEED TO BE KEPT UP OR YOU THINK ALL OF THIS FIXES IS SELF, IT DOESN'T AND THIS SHOWS YOUR SELFISHNESS. ONCE AGAIN A PROBLEM WITH THE NEW AGE OF PEOPLE. AFTER THE DEPRESSION YOU WHERE SEEN AS A PIG IF YOU DIDN'T GIVE BACK TO WHAT HELPED YOU GET RICH. THEY WHERE TAXES HEAVILY, 90% AND WE ARE NOT ASKING FOR THIS, 38% I PERSONALLY FEEL IS RIGHT WITH NO LOOP HOLES. HAVE SOME F'ING PRIDE IN YOUR COUNTRY, IF YOU JUST WON'T TO USE AND ABUSE THE PEOPLE AND IT ENVIROMENT, FINE. GO SOME WHERE ELSE. YOUR NOT A PATRIOT. WE CAN'T ACCOUNT THIS TO A ME ADDITUDE.

But why 38% What exactly does the government need 38% of top income earners' money for? The government spends significant amount of money for useless services. Why can't we demand the government stop its needless wars, corporate subsidies, tax breaks for everyone, and reform the pension systems?

In fact, let me give you a scenario: There was a time in this country, only the top 2% of income earners were taxed. Wouldn't you want that kind of tax rate again? I know I would. And guess what? That happened because the government stayed within its means, was very small, and was able to keep rates very low. We don't need a higher tax rate, because the government has shown that it cannot invest properly. That is why I believe we need a lower, flat, no-loophole tax rather than a higher one that allows the government to continue to mal-invest the money.





Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

Around the Network
JoeTheBro on 06 December 2011

@bannedagain
Just because a super rich guy can pay 50% taxes and be fine it doesn't mean he should. I understand you aren't directly saying something like "no taxes on first 100,000 you make with everything above going to the gov." but it is where your logic is headed. Sure $100 grand is enough to live a great life with but it gets rid of the reason to do any better. Why make a million only to get 100 grand? I think flat tax or atleast function tax needs to be used to keep the drive to be richer and richer.

Also you seem to forget that the rich guy isn't harming the environment or damaging roads, it's his company which already has to pay fees for those. Let's imagine someone that won a special lottery and gets 20 million a year. Are you saying you want to tax him extra for all these things the average rich guy is involved in even though he isn't?

Our different beliefs show why the gov. is so screwed up. You believe in super taxing the rich and welfare programs while I believe in the country's market running itself and people helping people during hard times. Both have potential to work great but instead we get half and half that loses all pros of the individual ideas.

@richardhutnik
Well for some poor sure. As long as it's fair and equal for all incomes I'm fine with it. The market should do its thing because what does a company want to do? Sell stuff. They will figure out a way to make money and inturn the consumer will continue to have money to spend as they get a steady paycheck.



Links

HappySqurriel on 06 December 2011
bannedagain said:
HappySqurriel said:
Salnax said:
Marks said:
America got on perfectly fine from 1776-1913 without any income tax at all (except during wars when they were temporarily introduced and then repealed). I don't get why people think more taxes are the answer to everything.

How about we stop trying to make everyone equal, and let everyone be free to do what they will with their money.


The government needs way more money now than it did 100 years ago. Between a superpower military, helping the sick, mantaining infrastructure, and investing in the 1%'s companies, they need all the cash they can get.


As a percentage of the economy, why would they need more money?

While you need to spend more money on infrastructure and the military the increase in productivity has resulted in massive increases in GDP should more than compensate for these increased needs.

Beyond that, in every measureable way the poor have been far worse off because of the war on poverty that was started in the 1960s and everyone should question whether the government should really be in the charity business; especially being how much more efficient and effective charities are.



wow you are full of it. This is complete bull. No need to call it all out. GREED BUDDY GREED> your facts hold no weight. Because you say charities are more effective hum. Yea right. You want a me society and not we society. LEave to a third world country.

http://mises.org/journals/jls/21_2/21_2_1.pdf

“[Government] income redistribution agencies are estimated to absorb about two-thirds of each dollar budgeted to them in overhead costs, and in some cases as much as three-quarters of each dollar. Using government data, Robert L. Woodson (1989, p. 63) calculated that, on average, 70 cents of each dollar budgeted for government assistance goes not to the poor, but to the members of the welfare bureaucracy and others serving the poor. Michael Tanner (1996, p. 136 n. 18) cites regional studies supporting this 70/30 split.

“In contrast, administrative and other operating costs in private charities absorb, on average, only one-third or less of each dollar donated, leaving the other two-thirds (or more) to be delivered to recipients. Charity Navigator, the newest of several private sector organizations that rate charities by various criteria and supply that information to the public on their web sites, found that, as of 2004, 70 percent of charities they rated spent at least 75 percent of their budgets on the programs and services they exist to provide, and 90 percent spent at least 65 percent. The median administrative expense among all charities in their sample was only 10.3 percent.”

On top of that, since private charities often help people by supplying them with goods/services that are donated or sold at near to cost and the government gives people cash to buy these goods from businesses at a profit, per dollar spent on these goods charities can (once again) be far more efficient and effective. Locally, the food bank claims that (due to their arrangement with food producers) for every $1 in donations they can buy the equivalent of $4 worth of food from a store. 

 

You really need to inform yourself and learn how to argue ...



radishhead on 06 December 2011

The amount that the US taxes their rich is shockingly low - anything made over ~$100k should be taxed at 50% - that leaves more than enough for them to live their lives



Click this button, you know you want to!  [Subscribe]

Watch me on YouTube!

http://www.youtube.com/user/TheRadishBros

~~~~ Mario Kart 8 drove far past my expectations! Never again will I doubt the wheels of a Monster Franchise! :0 ~~~~

Mr Khan on 06 December 2011
mrstickball said:
bannedagain said:



You say that you will help someone because 'thats what America is about'. Let me ask you: When was the last time that YOU physically helped another person. Not through taxes, but through your own money or work?



That would be economically non-productive. Most efficient is to empower individuals who specialize in aiding others. So long as you don't breed a huge bureaucracy by the wayside, of course...



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

KillerMan on 06 December 2011
Marks said:
Salnax said:
Marks said:
America got on perfectly fine from 1776-1913 without any income tax at all (except during wars when they were temporarily introduced and then repealed). I don't get why people think more taxes are the answer to everything.

How about we stop trying to make everyone equal, and let everyone be free to do what they will with their money.


The government needs way more money now than it did 100 years ago. Between a superpower military, helping the sick, mantaining infrastructure, and investing in the 1%'s companies, they need all the cash they can get.


They only "need" more money because they spend more money. The size of government needs to be cut massively, they should be focusing on national defence, police/fire departments and maintaining roads/bridges (which should be outsourced privately of course). We need to get rid of social programs and government departments and just let the market handle everything. 


So you born poor you are destined to be poor rest of your life because even basic education would cost money? Society completely handled by market is anything but free.