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Forums - Politics - so theres actually 3.2 million jobs available in america

Kasz216 said:
thetonestarr said:

=|

Yeah, y'all are right. Silly me.

The rate is still pretty high.

 

edit: The number categorized as "unemployed" in the US is currently 14 million. So it's still vastly greater than the 3.2m and the point absolutely still stands.

The point doesn't stand as much as you'd think.

Thing is... 5% unemployment is standard. When times were GREAT we had 5% unemployment.  (And really 5% unemployment is way better then say, basically all of europe was back when times were good.)

Unemployment is currently at 9.1%. 

So around 7.4 million of those people would be unemployed when times were good.

Leaving us with 6.6 million... so by filling those 3.2 million jobs we'd cut the "problem" unemployment nearly in half.

Though it'd likely rise again as the drop in the unemployment rate would lead to more people who aren't currently looking for jobs begin looking again.


Yes, but you can't look at it like that. We have 14m unemployed. Filling those spots would still leave at least 10.8 million unemployed, assuming NOBODY else loses their jobs. That would leave us at an unemployment rate of 7.02%, which is still considered high and, again, is assuming that NOBODY is ADDED to the ranks of the unemployed, which is beyond impossible.



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thetonestarr said:
Kasz216 said:
thetonestarr said:

=|

Yeah, y'all are right. Silly me.

The rate is still pretty high.

 

edit: The number categorized as "unemployed" in the US is currently 14 million. So it's still vastly greater than the 3.2m and the point absolutely still stands.

The point doesn't stand as much as you'd think.

Thing is... 5% unemployment is standard. When times were GREAT we had 5% unemployment.  (And really 5% unemployment is way better then say, basically all of europe was back when times were good.)

Unemployment is currently at 9.1%. 

So around 7.4 million of those people would be unemployed when times were good.

Leaving us with 6.6 million... so by filling those 3.2 million jobs we'd cut the "problem" unemployment nearly in half.

Though it'd likely rise again as the drop in the unemployment rate would lead to more people who aren't currently looking for jobs begin looking again.


Yes, but you can't look at it like that. We have 14m unemployed. Filling those spots would still leave at least 10.8 million unemployed, assuming NOBODY else loses their jobs. That would leave us at an unemployment rate of 7.02%, which is still considered high and, again, is assuming that NOBODY is ADDED to the ranks of the unemployed, which is beyond impossible.

It's high, but it's not THAT high.

You might not consider it high at all depending on why you think our unemployment is naturally lower then Europeon unemployment.



mrstickball said:
We lack a lot of smart, responsible, intelligent people to fill those vacancies.

SpaceX alone has 130 vacancies. Unfortunately, there are few Americans that went to college for the kind of careers that they need...Rather, we have a huge number of people credentialed in useless fields like Women's Studies, MBAs, and the like.

What does it say about MBAs being a useless degree when it is THE degree program that is often used by corporations to select people for management positions?



richardhutnik said:
mrstickball said:
We lack a lot of smart, responsible, intelligent people to fill those vacancies.

SpaceX alone has 130 vacancies. Unfortunately, there are few Americans that went to college for the kind of careers that they need...Rather, we have a huge number of people credentialed in useless fields like Women's Studies, MBAs, and the like.

What does it say about MBAs being a useless degree when it is THE degree program that is often used by corporations to select people for management positions?


It says that they are useless if there are vastly more degrees than jobs available in corporations.

Here is the data:

Now think about the likelihood of careers available in these fields.

Here is an additional list that is more exhaustive:

http://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d10/tables/dt10_282.asp?referrer=list

Looking at the list, you find the top 5 types of degrees granted at the bachelors level in comparison to 1980's as follows:

  1. Transportation & Material Moving - 1,877% (I think this is because colleges barely existed to serve this field in 1980)
  2. Parks, Recreational Studies and Fitness - 446%
  3. Legal Studies - 387%
  4. Gender Studies - 203%
  5. Communication Technology - 183%

And the worst-growing (the total number of bachelors degrees given since 1980 has increased 50%, so that is the average among all fields):

  1. Library Science -   -80%
  2. Physical Sciences -   -6%
  3. Education - -6%
  4. Architecture - 7%
  5. Engineering - 9%

 

And growth in terms of raw numbers of degrees given - 1980 vs. 2009:

  1. Business - 147,000
  2. Social Sciences & History - 69,000
  3. Psycology - 53,000
  4. Journalism & Communications - 49,000
  5. Visual & Performing Arts - 47,000

 

What does that tell you? It tells me that the growth of degrees is heavily skewed to specific fields that likely did not grow with the number of degrees given, thus a major issue in terms of job availability vs. available population.



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

Yakuzaice said:
steverhcp02 said:
This is why I have always believed the best way for the government long term to help with the employment and future of our economy and country is to spend money funding college education. A tuition reimbursment program aside from PELL in which the government invests in repaying your student loans AFTER graduation regardless of employment and after grades are established to ensure theyre not footing the bill for a potential dropout would go a long way, imo.

Not everyone is meant to go to college.  A lot of people would be better off going to a technical school than wasting time and money on a degree.  The more people with college degrees, the more worthless they become.

From the article

"Matching talent to position is notoriously difficult in high-tech fields. Yet these execs aren’t talking tech.  They’re talking about manufacturing workers, trades people and truck drivers."

Do you really want a world where you need a four year college degree for these jobs?

The first company mentioned, Siemens, has laid off over 21,000 people worldwide over the past three years.  I don't know if those line up with their open positions now, but there is probably a reason the jobs aren't filling.  They are probably offering entry level salaries and hoping to get people with decades of experience.


You can go to trade/tech schools for free? Im not saying everyones "meant" to go to college, but your quote is a little sad as you seem to imply not everyone should have the chance to make that decision. Which is why i said reimbursment upon graduation as to not front a bunch of money for people who can either not stay in school or cant cut it or contributing to your community while having education of any kind paid for.

Implying that offering assistance financially for people with initiative to educate themselves is equivalant to saying i feel all jobs should be 4 year degree jobs is a bit sensational, i feel its a pretty practical way to offer someone with a financial hurdle with a reward rather than a check before accomplishing something.



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mrstickball said:

Now think about the likelihood of careers available in these fields.

Here is an additional list that is more exhaustive:

http://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d10/tables/dt10_282.asp?referrer=list

Looking at the list, you find the top 5 types of degrees granted at the bachelors level in comparison to 1980's as follows:

  1. Transportation & Material Moving - 1,877% (I think this is because colleges barely existed to serve this field in 1980)
  2. Parks, Recreational Studies and Fitness - 446%
  3. Legal Studies - 387%
  4. Gender Studies - 203%
  5. Communication Technology - 183%

And the worst-growing (the total number of bachelors degrees given since 1980 has increased 50%, so that is the average among all fields):

  1. Library Science -   -80%
  2. Physical Sciences -   -6%
  3. Education - -6%
  4. Architecture - 7%
  5. Engineering - 9%

 

And growth in terms of raw numbers of degrees given - 1980 vs. 2009:

  1. Business - 147,000
  2. Social Sciences & History - 69,000
  3. Psycology - 53,000
  4. Journalism & Communications - 49,000
  5. Visual & Performing Arts - 47,000

 

What does that tell you? It tells me that the growth of degrees is heavily skewed to specific fields that likely did not grow with the number of degrees given, thus a major issue in terms of job availability vs. available population.

The theory of a business degree is that it is universal enough, it should enable someone to land a job somewhere.  That is the theory.



richardhutnik said:
mrstickball said:

Now think about the likelihood of careers available in these fields.

Here is an additional list that is more exhaustive:

http://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d10/tables/dt10_282.asp?referrer=list

Looking at the list, you find the top 5 types of degrees granted at the bachelors level in comparison to 1980's as follows:

  1. Transportation & Material Moving - 1,877% (I think this is because colleges barely existed to serve this field in 1980)
  2. Parks, Recreational Studies and Fitness - 446%
  3. Legal Studies - 387%
  4. Gender Studies - 203%
  5. Communication Technology - 183%

And the worst-growing (the total number of bachelors degrees given since 1980 has increased 50%, so that is the average among all fields):

  1. Library Science -   -80%
  2. Physical Sciences -   -6%
  3. Education - -6%
  4. Architecture - 7%
  5. Engineering - 9%

 

And growth in terms of raw numbers of degrees given - 1980 vs. 2009:

  1. Business - 147,000
  2. Social Sciences & History - 69,000
  3. Psycology - 53,000
  4. Journalism & Communications - 49,000
  5. Visual & Performing Arts - 47,000

 

What does that tell you? It tells me that the growth of degrees is heavily skewed to specific fields that likely did not grow with the number of degrees given, thus a major issue in terms of job availability vs. available population.

The theory of a business degree is that it is universal enough, it should enable someone to land a job somewhere.  That is the theory.

Sure, but has the number of businesses in America risen by a similar percentage to those with the degrees?



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

steverhcp02 said:

You can go to trade/tech schools for free? Im not saying everyones "meant" to go to college, but your quote is a little sad as you seem to imply not everyone should have the chance to make that decision. Which is why i said reimbursment upon graduation as to not front a bunch of money for people who can either not stay in school or cant cut it or contributing to your community while having education of any kind paid for.

Implying that offering assistance financially for people with initiative to educate themselves is equivalant to saying i feel all jobs should be 4 year degree jobs is a bit sensational, i feel its a pretty practical way to offer someone with a financial hurdle with a reward rather than a check before accomplishing something.

Not free, but they are generally cheaper and don't take as long.  The problem is people who go to expensive schools and get worthless degrees just to have the 'college experience'.  Then they get into the real world, can't get a decent job and want the taxpayer to foot the bill for their mistake.  There isn't really a lack of people going to college.  Enrollment jumped 38% between 1999 and 2009.  70% of high school graduates in 2009 were enrolled in college the next fall.

The government needs to work on improving primary and secondary schooling, not shoving more people into college.  Although considering how much the department of education has failed the country over the past 30 or so years, I don't know how wise it would be to give them this burden.  The amount we spend per student has outpaced inflation significantly, yet our math and science scores have stagnated.

I'd be curious to see how much of that stagnation is due to so much focus being put on educating females over males.  Despite female enrollment being 33% higher than male enrollment in 2009, engineering and science degrees often have males outnumbering females four to one.

Anyways, I've kind of gone off on a tangent here.  My main point is that there aren't huge barriers to entry if you wish to go to college.  Work hard in high school, get some scholarships, live at home and go to a cheap local college, get a degree with job prospects, work a part-time job, etc.  All of these are things you can do to get into college, not rack up huge amounts of debt, and have a chance at a job when you graduate.



The system is broken. They cut funds to technical schools, and they expect college as the "golden path" to everything, eventhough it is way too bloated and doesn't deliver on anything. Check this article out:
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7384501n