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Forums - General Discussion - VGC Mafia Round 29 -Grand Theft Auto 4 edition!

Vetteman94 on 15 June 2011
A Bad Clown said:
theprof00 said:
One question for ABC, why did you give Heph that extra flavor?


If he didn't say the flavor was actually different than what he said:

For night 1:

"You saw Stefl go out tonight to visit TruckOSaurus, he mentioned something about asking some questions and he looked like he was in a hurry."

For night 2 (where he died):

"You took a look over at Vetteman, you don't think he could have done anything villanious considering he was doing lines of coke with lesbians in a shady bar like every night."

sounds like I had fun in this game.... sweet



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Baalzamon on 16 June 2011
Wonktonodi said:

but you were in on all the info to begin with

Actually, I only knew a couple of roles throughout the game.



Money can't buy happiness. Just video games, which make me happy.

Final-Fan on 16 June 2011
Vetteman94 said:
Baalzamon said:
Vetteman94 said:
If its so obvious then why was it misinterpreted by the person who recieved the information?

Its funny that you say that a simple PM from Stefl could have cleared up what the answer False ment,  but why couldnt the original PM have been more clear to not need such a thing.
It shouldn't have been, that is what I'm saying.  It was a completely and totally simple PM to understand.  I have absolutely no clue how it could have possibly been misinterpreted, but being that he clearly was having issues with something so simple, he should have done the extremely simple thing and ask for clarification (which shouldn't have been necessary in the first place).

Regardless, it is done with, I just think ABC is getting a little too much shit, when what he did really wasn't wrong.
Obviously it wasnt,  an without actually seeing the exact question that was asked to go with the answer nobody can say that it definitely wasnt either.  You sit there claiming there shouldnt have been anyway he misinterpreted the answer, but here we are, talking about someone who did.  

Well you could also say that ABC could have done the extremely simple thing and gave an answer that was not vague.

I was trying to stay out of this (hoping it would just die out) but I have to respond to this.  There is nothing so simple that it cannot be misunderstood.  Baal's obviously not saying it was IMPOSSIBLE to misinterpret, just that it could not be REASONABLY misinterpreted.  [edit:  And you apparently didn't read the dead thread because ABC actually did tell us the exact question.  See below.]  And from what I recall, Stefl's misinterpretation was unreasonable. 

ABC made mistakes this game, but I don't think this was one of them.

Wow stefl needs to read his Pms correctly.
he asked me
"did he lie when he said he is town?"
I put false...


"Did he lie" is a true/false question.  True, he lied; false, he didn't.

 



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

Final-Fan on 16 June 2011

Dammit. Will this work?

[edit: I give up.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKG07305CBs

IT'S ALL THERE, BLACK AND WHITE, CLEAR AS CRYSTAL!]



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

Hephaestos on 16 June 2011
Final-Fan said:

 

Wow stefl needs to read his Pms correctly.
he asked me
"did he lie when he said he is town?"
I put false...


"Did he lie" is a true/false question.  True, he lied; false, he didn't.

 

Consider this:

Is it true that he lied or that he is town?

the proper answer to the "did he lie when he said he is town?" question is Yes/no , definitely not true/false

It's a moot point anyways, GoW was deserving and the only person really harmed by this was prof... =)




OoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoOoO

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Final-Fan on 17 June 2011
Hephaestos said:
Final-Fan said:
Wow stefl needs to read his Pms correctly.
he asked me
"did he lie when he said he is town?"
I put false...
"Did he lie" is a true/false question.  True, he lied; false, he didn't.
Consider this:
Is it true that he lied or that he is town?
the proper answer to the "did he lie when he said he is town?" question is Yes/no , definitely not true/false
It's a moot point anyways, GoW was deserving and the only person really harmed by this was prof... =)

You're confusing the question. 

1.  "Linkzmax said he is town.  Is it true that he is town?"  The answer to this would be "True".  However, I don't think the Lie Detector works on direct questions of fact, only whether someone is being honest. 
2.  "Linkzmax said he is town.  Was he lying when he said this?"  This would be answered "False". 
3.  "Linkzmax said he is town.  Was he telling the truth when he said this?"  This would be answered "True". 

Stefl asked #2, which was unfortunate because he most likely would not have misinterpreted the other way(s) of putting the same question, even though there was still no excuse to misinterpret the answer he got for the question he did ask.



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

Linkzmax on 17 June 2011
Final-Fan said:
Hephaestos said:
Final-Fan said:
Wow stefl needs to read his Pms correctly.
he asked me
"did he lie when he said he is town?"
I put false...
"Did he lie" is a true/false question.  True, he lied; false, he didn't.
Consider this:
Is it true that he lied or that he is town?
the proper answer to the "did he lie when he said he is town?" question is Yes/no , definitely not true/false
It's a moot point anyways, GoW was deserving and the only person really harmed by this was prof... =)

You're confusing the question. 

1.  "Linkzmax said he is town.  Is it true that he is town?"  The answer to this would be "True".  However, I don't think the Lie Detector works on direct questions of fact, only whether someone is being honest. 
2.  "Linkzmax said he is town.  Was he lying when he said this?"  This would be answered "False". 
3.  "Linkzmax said he is town.  Was he telling the truth when he said this?"  This would be answered "True". 

Stefl asked #2, which was unfortunate because he most likely would not have misinterpreted the other way(s) of putting the same question, even though there was still no excuse to misinterpret the answer he got for the question he did ask.

Heph is right. True/False applies to statements. Yes/No applies to questions.



VGC Mafia Archives

Final-Fan on 17 June 2011
Linkzmax said:
Final-Fan said:
Hephaestos said:
Final-Fan said:
Wow stefl needs to read his Pms correctly.
he asked me
"did he lie when he said he is town?"
I put false...
"Did he lie" is a true/false question.  True, he lied; false, he didn't.
Consider this:
Is it true that he lied or that he is town?
the proper answer to the "did he lie when he said he is town?" question is Yes/no , definitely not true/false
It's a moot point anyways, GoW was deserving and the only person really harmed by this was prof... =)

You're confusing the question. 

1.  "Linkzmax said he is town.  Is it true that he is town?"  The answer to this would be "True".  However, I don't think the Lie Detector works on direct questions of fact, only whether someone is being honest. 
2.  "Linkzmax said he is town.  Was he lying when he said this?"  This would be answered "False". 
3.  "Linkzmax said he is town.  Was he telling the truth when he said this?"  This would be answered "True". 

Stefl asked #2, which was unfortunate because he most likely would not have misinterpreted the other way(s) of putting the same question, even though there was still no excuse to misinterpret the answer he got for the question he did ask.

Heph is right. True/False applies to statements. Yes/No applies to questions.

OK, but IIRC ABC informed Stefl that all questions would be answered with "True" or "False", so IMO that grammatical point is irrelevant. 



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

Linkzmax on 17 June 2011
Final-Fan said:
Linkzmax said:

Heph is right. True/False applies to statements. Yes/No applies to questions.

OK, but IIRC ABC informed Stefl that all questions would be answered with "True" or "False", so IMO that grammatical point is irrelevant. 

The point is still valid. All that means is that ABC was handling it in a way that doesn't make sense from the start. It was improper and I can understand why Stefl came to the wrong conclusion, that is all.



VGC Mafia Archives

Final-Fan on 17 June 2011
Linkzmax said:
Final-Fan said:
Linkzmax said:

Heph is right. True/False applies to statements. Yes/No applies to questions.

OK, but IIRC ABC informed Stefl that all questions would be answered with "True" or "False", so IMO that grammatical point is irrelevant. 

The point is still valid. All that means is that ABC was handling it in a way that doesn't make sense from the start. It was improper and I can understand why Stefl came to the wrong conclusion, that is all.

I can agree now that ABC answering questions with T/F contributed to confusion, but considering that Stefl submitted a QUESTION, not a statement, for LD review I don't think significant fault can be moved from Stefl to ABC. 



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom!