Vote: Final-Fan

Forgot to bold it.

1) what? how? where? please point the post where wonk does that. (I've said that way too many times this round)

2) No, until we have reason to believe there is only 1 scum left, they are a non issue.

3) ? what massive page of evidence? And I used my role on Stefl cause I thought he was scum. the jump to LD came from a combination to his cool composture when I accused him, the "cop" like claim and the flavor I had that now clearly pointed at LD but that I missunderstood. The first 2 aspects I did not have before I jumped to the LD conclusion.

4) A) see 3, it's no mistake. B) evidence without context means nothing, to me all the evidence I had pointed he was scum C) Thinking I was outing a scum. The only "mistake" I accept is B as C derives directly from B. I'm still sorry for C though.

5) why not kill stefl directly?  your theory there is not fitting. Unless of course if the smart enough person knew all the people targeted were not scum... I disagree on this about the siblings (though they are a non issue) and on you (though you i'm studying :p), on trucks, I, unlike you, didn't see him clearly as a townie.

6) Not...I said the flavor was unusual to my role, surely Hobos are accostumed to it no?

7) I doubt we have many vanilla townies... Waiting on your answer for 1) though ^^

evidence of what?

1) your vagueness was puroseful

2) Linkz was my priority day 1, both of us called for the SK/vig to strike Vett if there were one.

3) that's day 2 once I understood his role. Why would I talk about RB?

4) yeah you admited to lying in the post crossing that one, remember? or should I quote it?

1) Yes. You say I was being vague, yet just a moment ago you said "requesting doc protection for 'such a vanilla role'". Which is it?

2. fair enough

3. Why wouldn't you consider one?

4. And you jumped on the train. I'm pointing out that assuming you're mafia, vette isn't the RB.

1. By suspecting him :P

2. Yet yesterday, you were all for going after linkz.

3.  The evidence you provided was amazingly concrete.

4. Based on what evidence? What was pointing you towards scum for him?

5. Because of the doc. Or because you could use the info to set yourself up a claim. Or because trucks was more important?

I agree that FF has been far too agreeable this game. He's usually on my ass. Whether that is because I'm no longer using gambits or what, I don't know. However, now that wonk has confirmed Vette as town :P, I could go for either GoW or FF (possibly Heph, but not today). I really really get suspcious around people who think I'm town. (Although in their defense, I completely see how I'm playing differently from last game).

Plus, I agree with Vette. The lovers are such a huge risk right now. The best thing to do today is somehow lynch the roleblocker, and get stefl to LD one of them. Even still though, even if we don't get the RB there still might be a way to pull off the LD. But, I agree that [the lovers] don't need to be lynched today, that can be put off til later. In that respect, sure it seems off to me that he's so insistent.

Here's the other thing on Heph. Heph could be anything. He said that his role he got flavour along with his role that told him that stefl was some scummy thing, but then he showed this massive page of evidence. Am I to believe that he had all this very convincing evidence beforehand? Furthermore, if you were going to use your role on someone, wouldn't you at least think it's important to have some idea of what that player is? When stef said, "to be honest, I did know his alignment". I, personally, thought cop. It was Heph who decided it was LD. If he had no previous inclination of stef, why the jump to LD? (I here also agree with linkz about scum tracker).

So, why would you have a big pile of evidence laying around going unused? IMO, he didn't need his role at all to figure that out, and I don't believe that he only looked for evidence AFTER stefl claimed.  AND his circumstances are a little strange. Special flavor, not figuring it out (yet having all the necessary info), or even how he said he wouldn't be getting special info on other nights, even going to the point where he thought ABC bent the balance specifically for him because of some previous error, etc. Now, he did say that it was "a mistake", and it seems genuine, but when I see people (like GoW) saying "the RB is either FF or Vette, because it's certainly not me, or theprof, or the lovers/wonk/heph&stef, it makes me nervous. It makes me nervous because:

...I do agree with GoW that Heph cannot be RB. Why? Because only the tracker would know who stef went to see at daybreak. I just also cannot imagine tracking stefl when you have a set of notes on him pointing at possible LD. I just don't see that happening. So, GoW is right, Heph is not the RB...is this a slip on GoW's part, or did he really just not factor in Heph. (So, to me, this is now three mistakes by Heph). Tracking someone he has no thoughts on, not interpreting his flavor despite a sheet of evidence, and outing stefl.

...if Heph DID already know that stefl was an LD, then all he had to do was kill one of the 4 players that answered stef's question. I admit, it's a stretch, but look at the two people hit by scum power, me and trucks. Two of those 4.We're looking at someone who was "smart enough" to think that I might be lying about having a role AND figure that I might be third party. (One of the reasons I'm on Vette is because I felt that his "maybe a kill was blocked" was an attempt to make it look like he blocked a kill. But back to the subject at hand, Heph could have used the opportunity at the start of the day to get stef to claim.

(And yes, I'm directly implying that RB is scum, I mean, look at the setup we had with Roman being able to redirect night actions from a target to himself, and RB, and LD. It sounds like a perfect balance combination. If LD outs someone, or soft-claims, they can either try to block or kill him. Roman can target him to allow free reign, and a kill or block on stefl would allow another night of investigation. Then with the doctor (yes, i do believe there is a doctor, and no it's not me), they can still RB him. This kind of goes against what I thought about stefl still being able to use his role unhampered tonight, but if it's true that the cop is actually just a lie detector, there will be other chances for him to use his power (IMO).

Also, I don't know if Heph is soft-claiming hobo or not, but keep in mind that the first instance of hobo appeared as a scum fakeclaim, in mafia history. It's a good cover...in fact, in my first game, I claimed something very similar without even knowing the hobo role (i claimed seer, who get's random information that I can't interpret properly).

Furthermore, GoW comes off as someone without fear of being killed at night. He's made a lot of contributions, and been very active. Perhaps he is just a vanilla townie...I don't know...but I'm willing and hoping the some of you will help me test out my theories.

Also, starting tonight, I'm asking for doc protection. There's a chance that stefl soft-claimed too thoroughly, and is of no use tonight. He is practically useless now. (Note that I'm not telling doc what to do. I'm simply giving myself more of an opportunity to make it to tomorrow)

I'm not sure if Gow is the right person to go after or not. If there is someone out there who can look at the information I've provided and throw some ideas out there, it'd be appreciated.

What will it take for you to understand that I'm not the roleblocker ?