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Forums - Gaming - The risks of next generation multi-platform games

Mr Khan said:

We can get back to the whole "they just hate Nintendo" thing, which i would say is valid for Western Third Parties, who have ignored DS as vigorously as they've ignored Wii, but that would derail this discussion hideously

on topic: I am afraid of that as well. This generation has seemed so bland because you have two consoles whose libraries basically clone one another, and the first parties are the only differentiating factor, this could get all the worse if we expand more onto these platforms where the platform proprietors don't even care about creating first party titles, leading to greater homogenization and boredom, though i do doubt that they're waiting specifically for smartphones to catch up.

 

On topic: If you ask me thngs may just get worse because knowing Sony, whatever MS/Nintendo put out will easily be matched by them, which will result in a scenario simmilar to last gen where everything was on all systems. If we get all 3 systems close in power, things may get boring just like you said.  The only way things change again is if somone pulls another "Wii" in which they use weaker hardware, but I doubt that will happen.



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HappySqurriel said:

Except, I believe it can be shown that games that take advantage of the strengths of the platforms they are released upon while minimizing the weaknesses of those platforms generally sell far better; and that it is nearly impossible to take advantage of the strengths of a diverse group of very different platforms.

Effectively, consider what would happen if you have to develop a game that supports a keyboard & mouse, conventional controller, Kinect (like) device, Wiimote/Playstation move, and a touch screen compared to developing a game designed around a sub-set of related user interfaces. The game that supports a small set of similar user interface devices is (probably) going to be able to provide a more unique, interesting, and compelling gameplay experience than the game that has to support all of those user interfaces; and (as a result) will likely end up being a better game that sells better.

Now, I'm not saying that multiplatform games are a bad idea but that it is possible that adding additional platforms can end up with lower game quality and (potentially) lower game sales.

Games which take advantage of the 'strengths of a platform' are not the default. They are all computers at heart, all turing complete so at the heart of it any computer which is fast enough can run effectively any program which can run on other architectures which leaves controls as the default means of differentiation.

In this generation of consoles even with various motion controllers to add further differentiation there are very few titles which are truly differentiated by the controls used to play the games. I don't see it as a significant factor as the majority of what can be achieved on a motion controller can be achieved on a regular controller and touch screen games have a tendency to be developed separately.



Tease.

I somehow doubt they are waiting for smartphone too as the concept of 1-2$ games on the phone has totally destroyed any opportunity they could have to release cross platforms games with the consoles.



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

its basic bad analysts.

all analysts thought ps3 woudl destroy, seemingly how 360 is simialr it too would do good and nintendo would suck in sales.

 

Nintendo destroyed in sales and so the company heads looked and went "hmm these games sole 10 million, make a shit ton of those types of games"   meanwhiel continue making the games you were working on, which were for 360/ps3

Then needless to say the shitty shovelware that was released on Wii did not seel 10 million, meanwhile a hit or two such as call of duty sold big on hd systems.  Thus they continue to do great support on those thinking that the audience is there and wii sucks. 



irstupid said:

its basic bad analysts.

all analysts thought ps3 woudl destroy, seemingly how 360 is simialr it too would do good and nintendo would suck in sales.

 

Nintendo destroyed in sales and so the company heads looked and went "hmm these games sole 10 million, make a shit ton of those types of games"   meanwhiel continue making the games you were working on, which were for 360/ps3

Then needless to say the shitty shovelware that was released on Wii did not seel 10 million, meanwhile a hit or two such as call of duty sold big on hd systems.  Thus they continue to do great support on those thinking that the audience is there and wii sucks. 

It's easy to blame third parties but Nintendo didn't do a good job before the launch of the Wii to try to get third parties on board.

And from a publisher point of view I can understand how some of them were reticent to spend development money developing new games on a platform which aside from controls did not differentiate itself enough from the previous gen, especially when at the time the average PS2 game was selling for 40$ or less. There was a risk that customer would not consider that those games were different enough from those still selling on the PS2 and would not accept the price difference...



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

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Ail said:
irstupid said:

its basic bad analysts.

all analysts thought ps3 woudl destroy, seemingly how 360 is simialr it too would do good and nintendo would suck in sales.

 

Nintendo destroyed in sales and so the company heads looked and went "hmm these games sole 10 million, make a shit ton of those types of games"   meanwhiel continue making the games you were working on, which were for 360/ps3

Then needless to say the shitty shovelware that was released on Wii did not seel 10 million, meanwhile a hit or two such as call of duty sold big on hd systems.  Thus they continue to do great support on those thinking that the audience is there and wii sucks. 

It's easy to blame third parties but Nintendo didn't do a good job before the launch of the Wii to try to get third parties on board.

And from a publisher point of view I can understand how some of them were reticent to spend development money developing new games on a platform which aside from controls did not differentiate itself enough from the previous gen, especially when at the time the average PS2 game was selling for 40$ or less. There was a risk that customer would not consider that those games were different enough from those still selling on the PS2 and would not accept the price difference...


how is it not easy to blame 3rd parties.  we could see easy that no matter how much nintnedo begged or stated their sales taht 3rd parties were still not announcing games for the system.  It was a couple years before any Real games came out.

and then even games that started coming out never seemed to have full comittment.  All the big games seemed to be on hd systems.  everythign felt like it was just slopped together quickly or ported or thrown to some unkown develeoper to make the wii version.  when a ps2 game last gen was being made it felt like the teams were giving their all to make the game.  i never feel that for wii games side nintendo games.  there are a few exceptions like monster hunter or lost story or some others.  But hell even when a game gets ported from Wii to a hd system it feels like they put more time and effort into doing the port than they did doing the original

it feels liek they think wii owners are second class citizens, and then they come out with some bullshit statement like "we are going to test this game on wii to see if their is an audience there"  talk about degrading.  its like F You developer i'm not goign to buy your game now



irstupid said:
Ail said:
irstupid said:

its basic bad analysts.

all analysts thought ps3 woudl destroy, seemingly how 360 is simialr it too would do good and nintendo would suck in sales.

 

Nintendo destroyed in sales and so the company heads looked and went "hmm these games sole 10 million, make a shit ton of those types of games"   meanwhiel continue making the games you were working on, which were for 360/ps3

Then needless to say the shitty shovelware that was released on Wii did not seel 10 million, meanwhile a hit or two such as call of duty sold big on hd systems.  Thus they continue to do great support on those thinking that the audience is there and wii sucks. 

It's easy to blame third parties but Nintendo didn't do a good job before the launch of the Wii to try to get third parties on board.

And from a publisher point of view I can understand how some of them were reticent to spend development money developing new games on a platform which aside from controls did not differentiate itself enough from the previous gen, especially when at the time the average PS2 game was selling for 40$ or less. There was a risk that customer would not consider that those games were different enough from those still selling on the PS2 and would not accept the price difference...


how is it not easy to blame 3rd parties.  we could see easy that no matter how much nintnedo begged or stated their sales taht 3rd parties were still not announcing games for the system.  It was a couple years before any Real games came out.

and then even games that started coming out never seemed to have full comittment.  All the big games seemed to be on hd systems.  everythign felt like it was just slopped together quickly or ported or thrown to some unkown develeoper to make the wii version.  when a ps2 game last gen was being made it felt like the teams were giving their all to make the game.  i never feel that for wii games side nintendo games.  there are a few exceptions like monster hunter or lost story or some others.  But hell even when a game gets ported from Wii to a hd system it feels like they put more time and effort into doing the port than they did doing the original

it feels liek they think wii owners are second class citizens, and then they come out with some bullshit statement like "we are going to test this game on wii to see if their is an audience there"  talk about degrading.  its like F You developer i'm not goign to buy your game now

As a console maker it is your job to ensure you get proper support from software developers, especially when you get a cut of every $ they make selling software on your platform, it's basic business sense..

The Mac almost died 25 years ago for the same reason, all the software was on the PC, and last I checked noone blamed the software publishers back then...



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Ail said:
irstupid said:
Ail said:
irstupid said:

its basic bad analysts.

all analysts thought ps3 woudl destroy, seemingly how 360 is simialr it too would do good and nintendo would suck in sales.

 

Nintendo destroyed in sales and so the company heads looked and went "hmm these games sole 10 million, make a shit ton of those types of games"   meanwhiel continue making the games you were working on, which were for 360/ps3

Then needless to say the shitty shovelware that was released on Wii did not seel 10 million, meanwhile a hit or two such as call of duty sold big on hd systems.  Thus they continue to do great support on those thinking that the audience is there and wii sucks. 

It's easy to blame third parties but Nintendo didn't do a good job before the launch of the Wii to try to get third parties on board.

And from a publisher point of view I can understand how some of them were reticent to spend development money developing new games on a platform which aside from controls did not differentiate itself enough from the previous gen, especially when at the time the average PS2 game was selling for 40$ or less. There was a risk that customer would not consider that those games were different enough from those still selling on the PS2 and would not accept the price difference...


how is it not easy to blame 3rd parties.  we could see easy that no matter how much nintnedo begged or stated their sales taht 3rd parties were still not announcing games for the system.  It was a couple years before any Real games came out.

and then even games that started coming out never seemed to have full comittment.  All the big games seemed to be on hd systems.  everythign felt like it was just slopped together quickly or ported or thrown to some unkown develeoper to make the wii version.  when a ps2 game last gen was being made it felt like the teams were giving their all to make the game.  i never feel that for wii games side nintendo games.  there are a few exceptions like monster hunter or lost story or some others.  But hell even when a game gets ported from Wii to a hd system it feels like they put more time and effort into doing the port than they did doing the original

it feels liek they think wii owners are second class citizens, and then they come out with some bullshit statement like "we are going to test this game on wii to see if their is an audience there"  talk about degrading.  its like F You developer i'm not goign to buy your game now

As a console maker it is your job to ensure you get proper support from software developers, especially when you get a cut of every $ they make selling software on your platform, it's basic business sense..

The Mac almost died 25 years ago for the same reason, all the software was on the PC, and last I checked noone blamed the software publishers back then...

so do you know waht nintendo offers publishers on the games?  waht does sony or microsoft offer?

all i know is for a couple years at every e3 event nintendo was practically begging for 3rd partys to come and jump on board, but they never gave them the respect, and just tossed shovelware party games or spinoffs on the system or ports.

so please tell me, what did sony or microsoft offer taht was such a big incentive to make on their system over the wii?  and i'm not talking about buying million dollar exclusive contracts, because there are barely any of them cmpared to the hundreds of other multiplat games



irstupid said:
Ail said:
irstupid said:
Ail said:
irstupid said:

its basic bad analysts.

all analysts thought ps3 woudl destroy, seemingly how 360 is simialr it too would do good and nintendo would suck in sales.

 

Nintendo destroyed in sales and so the company heads looked and went "hmm these games sole 10 million, make a shit ton of those types of games"   meanwhiel continue making the games you were working on, which were for 360/ps3

Then needless to say the shitty shovelware that was released on Wii did not seel 10 million, meanwhile a hit or two such as call of duty sold big on hd systems.  Thus they continue to do great support on those thinking that the audience is there and wii sucks. 

It's easy to blame third parties but Nintendo didn't do a good job before the launch of the Wii to try to get third parties on board.

And from a publisher point of view I can understand how some of them were reticent to spend development money developing new games on a platform which aside from controls did not differentiate itself enough from the previous gen, especially when at the time the average PS2 game was selling for 40$ or less. There was a risk that customer would not consider that those games were different enough from those still selling on the PS2 and would not accept the price difference...


how is it not easy to blame 3rd parties.  we could see easy that no matter how much nintnedo begged or stated their sales taht 3rd parties were still not announcing games for the system.  It was a couple years before any Real games came out.

and then even games that started coming out never seemed to have full comittment.  All the big games seemed to be on hd systems.  everythign felt like it was just slopped together quickly or ported or thrown to some unkown develeoper to make the wii version.  when a ps2 game last gen was being made it felt like the teams were giving their all to make the game.  i never feel that for wii games side nintendo games.  there are a few exceptions like monster hunter or lost story or some others.  But hell even when a game gets ported from Wii to a hd system it feels like they put more time and effort into doing the port than they did doing the original

it feels liek they think wii owners are second class citizens, and then they come out with some bullshit statement like "we are going to test this game on wii to see if their is an audience there"  talk about degrading.  its like F You developer i'm not goign to buy your game now

As a console maker it is your job to ensure you get proper support from software developers, especially when you get a cut of every $ they make selling software on your platform, it's basic business sense..

The Mac almost died 25 years ago for the same reason, all the software was on the PC, and last I checked noone blamed the software publishers back then...

so do you know waht nintendo offers publishers on the games?  waht does sony or microsoft offer?

all i know is for a couple years at every e3 event nintendo was practically begging for 3rd partys to come and jump on board, but they never gave them the respect, and just tossed shovelware party games or spinoffs on the system or ports.

so please tell me, what did sony or microsoft offer taht was such a big incentive to make on their system over the wii?  and i'm not talking about buying million dollar exclusive contracts, because there are barely any of them cmpared to the hundreds of other multiplat games

The huge majority of third parties had PS3 and 360 toolkits in their hands 16 months before the release of the console.

Nintendo waited 6 months before its release to even tell people what the console was about and what was inside...



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Ail said:
irstupid said:
Ail said:
irstupid said:
Ail said:
irstupid said:

its basic bad analysts.

all analysts thought ps3 woudl destroy, seemingly how 360 is simialr it too would do good and nintendo would suck in sales.

 

Nintendo destroyed in sales and so the company heads looked and went "hmm these games sole 10 million, make a shit ton of those types of games"   meanwhiel continue making the games you were working on, which were for 360/ps3

Then needless to say the shitty shovelware that was released on Wii did not seel 10 million, meanwhile a hit or two such as call of duty sold big on hd systems.  Thus they continue to do great support on those thinking that the audience is there and wii sucks. 

It's easy to blame third parties but Nintendo didn't do a good job before the launch of the Wii to try to get third parties on board.

And from a publisher point of view I can understand how some of them were reticent to spend development money developing new games on a platform which aside from controls did not differentiate itself enough from the previous gen, especially when at the time the average PS2 game was selling for 40$ or less. There was a risk that customer would not consider that those games were different enough from those still selling on the PS2 and would not accept the price difference...


how is it not easy to blame 3rd parties.  we could see easy that no matter how much nintnedo begged or stated their sales taht 3rd parties were still not announcing games for the system.  It was a couple years before any Real games came out.

and then even games that started coming out never seemed to have full comittment.  All the big games seemed to be on hd systems.  everythign felt like it was just slopped together quickly or ported or thrown to some unkown develeoper to make the wii version.  when a ps2 game last gen was being made it felt like the teams were giving their all to make the game.  i never feel that for wii games side nintendo games.  there are a few exceptions like monster hunter or lost story or some others.  But hell even when a game gets ported from Wii to a hd system it feels like they put more time and effort into doing the port than they did doing the original

it feels liek they think wii owners are second class citizens, and then they come out with some bullshit statement like "we are going to test this game on wii to see if their is an audience there"  talk about degrading.  its like F You developer i'm not goign to buy your game now

As a console maker it is your job to ensure you get proper support from software developers, especially when you get a cut of every $ they make selling software on your platform, it's basic business sense..

The Mac almost died 25 years ago for the same reason, all the software was on the PC, and last I checked noone blamed the software publishers back then...

so do you know waht nintendo offers publishers on the games?  waht does sony or microsoft offer?

all i know is for a couple years at every e3 event nintendo was practically begging for 3rd partys to come and jump on board, but they never gave them the respect, and just tossed shovelware party games or spinoffs on the system or ports.

so please tell me, what did sony or microsoft offer taht was such a big incentive to make on their system over the wii?  and i'm not talking about buying million dollar exclusive contracts, because there are barely any of them cmpared to the hundreds of other multiplat games

The huge majority of third parties had PS3 and 360 toolkits in their hands 16 months before the release of the console.

Nintendo waited 6 months before its release to even tell people what the console was about and what was inside...

isn't htat like the reverse of the 3DS and NGP right now?

but still, i know that argument.  Wii owners sat around for a couple years thinking "ok soon they will finally announce or release a game.  they have had time to see teh Wii's success and had dev kits long enough for even FF13 to come out, lol."  but then NO, nothing, still no announcements for another year or later. 

They still took the wii for granted, they still sat on it thinking ITS a fad, or kiddy or our shovelware didn't sell ect.  by the time any decent games announced it was almost laughably late