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Forums - General - Book Thread: VGChartz gotta start readin'!

haxxiy said:
Khuutra said:

Erikson has the advantage of providing an excellent sense of cultural diversity, as if he has created a world.

I do not think I would compare Jordan to either him or Martin.


Yeah but Sanderson for instance also does it very well and it didn't keep Way of Kings to be a complete disappointment. The same can be said for FFXII and the likes if tou are among those who hated it. And that's leaving expanded SW alone...

To actually be a good writer asf far as characters, plot etc. are concerned is harder and matters more than worldbuilding IMO.

FFXII is the best game in the series with the best writing and the best characters but that's savagely off-topic.

Robert Jordan (may he rest in peace) couldn't write women. Period. I can only assume that his understanding of the relationships between men and women was not accurately communicated in his portrayals of them. I liked the first few Wheel of Time books, but Jordan is not in any way comparable to Erikson or Martin.

And yes, characters are more important than worldbuilding - unless, ah, the world becomes something so grand, so wonderful, as to match the means of characters who walk other worlds.



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Khuutra said:
haxxiy said:
Khuutra said:

Erikson has the advantage of providing an excellent sense of cultural diversity, as if he has created a world.

I do not think I would compare Jordan to either him or Martin.


Yeah but Sanderson for instance also does it very well and it didn't keep Way of Kings to be a complete disappointment. The same can be said for FFXII and the likes if tou are among those who hated it. And that's leaving expanded SW alone...

To actually be a good writer asf far as characters, plot etc. are concerned is harder and matters more than worldbuilding IMO.

FFXII is the best game in the series with the best writing and the best characters but that's savagely off-topic.

Robert Jordan (may he rest in peace) couldn't write women. Period. I can only assume that his understanding of the relationships between men and women was not accurately communicated in his portrayals of them. I liked the first few Wheel of Time books, but Jordan is not in any way comparable to Erikson or Martin.

And yes, characters are more important than worldbuilding - unless, ah, the world becomes something so grand, so wonderful, as to match the means of characters who walk other worlds.


Haha I'm glad you agree about FFXII, I mentioned it because so many unfortunately hated it and I thought you might be one of them. Go check my FFXII rating if you have any doubts. 

And you are right about Jordan, of course. Every single woman on WoT cross her arms under the breasts and call men woolheads... Sanderson is similar in a way since all his characters roll eyes and frown. As to the worldbuilding argument I have not much to say since I mainly agree - with the difference I think Erikson is not quite there. Yet.



 

 

 

 

 

haxxiy said:
Khuutra said:

FFXII is the best game in the series with the best writing and the best characters but that's savagely off-topic.

Robert Jordan (may he rest in peace) couldn't write women. Period. I can only assume that his understanding of the relationships between men and women was not accurately communicated in his portrayals of them. I liked the first few Wheel of Time books, but Jordan is not in any way comparable to Erikson or Martin.

And yes, characters are more important than worldbuilding - unless, ah, the world becomes something so grand, so wonderful, as to match the means of characters who walk other worlds.

Haha I'm glad you agree about FFXII, I mentioned it because so many unfortunately hated it and I thought you might be one of them. Go check my FFXII rating if you have any doubts. 

And you are right about Jordan, of course. Every single woman on WoT cross her arms under the breasts and call men woolheads... Sanderson is similar in a way since all his characters roll eyes and frown. As to the worldbuilding argument I have not much to say since I mainly agree - with the difference I think Erikson is not quite there. Yet.

In fairness, Sanderson is kind of trapped doing that way of writing women now, otherwise it wouldn't be the Wheel of Time.

I wonder how Way of Kings is.

Confession: I stopped reading partway through the eighth or ninth book of hte Wheel of Time. I'll wait until Sanderson really truly well and finishes the thing before picking it up again - yes, from the very beginning - and trying once more.



Khuutra said:
haxxiy said:
Khuutra said:

FFXII is the best game in the series with the best writing and the best characters but that's savagely off-topic.

Robert Jordan (may he rest in peace) couldn't write women. Period. I can only assume that his understanding of the relationships between men and women was not accurately communicated in his portrayals of them. I liked the first few Wheel of Time books, but Jordan is not in any way comparable to Erikson or Martin.

And yes, characters are more important than worldbuilding - unless, ah, the world becomes something so grand, so wonderful, as to match the means of characters who walk other worlds.

Haha I'm glad you agree about FFXII, I mentioned it because so many unfortunately hated it and I thought you might be one of them. Go check my FFXII rating if you have any doubts. 

And you are right about Jordan, of course. Every single woman on WoT cross her arms under the breasts and call men woolheads... Sanderson is similar in a way since all his characters roll eyes and frown. As to the worldbuilding argument I have not much to say since I mainly agree - with the difference I think Erikson is not quite there. Yet.

In fairness, Sanderson is kind of trapped doing that way of writing women now, otherwise it wouldn't be the Wheel of Time.

I wonder how Way of Kings is.

Confession: I stopped reading partway through the eighth or ninth book of hte Wheel of Time. I'll wait until Sanderson really truly well and finishes the thing before picking it up again - yes, from the very beginning - and trying once more.

Well I was talking more about Mistborn and Way of Kings than his writing on Wheel of Time.

And if you want to know how Way of Kings is, well... maybe you won't like it too much if Erikson and Martin are your standards instead of the likes of Jordan or (going a lot lower and dare I say their accursed names) Goodking and Paolini.

Sadly the book is filled with useless and endless flashbacks and interludes and story arches dragging and being redudant. You can skip hundreds of pages and still understand the story, and the worldbuilding is massive and worthy of applause but too often gets in your nerves (I had enough of safehands and lighteyes for a lifetime). Maybe with a massive editing job we'd be looking at a new Gardens of Moon.



 

 

 

 

 

Khuutra said:
sapphi_snake said:
Khuutra said:

Steven Erikson beggars every other fantasy writer in terms of sheer, horrifying scope and import and the vast ideas that he throws around like so much rice at a wedding.

I'll finish Toll the Hounds tomorrow, but when a savage, 11,000 page story like this one is the barest footnote in the context of an enormous, never-ending conflict, and the story keeps hitting you over and over and over with nre revelations

The Jaghut, my God the Jaghut.

O_o

Are you serious???

Yes. It is a ten-book series, the first nine of which total 10k-11k pages.


It'a arguably one of the top 3 fantasy serie of the last 20 years, and what is more remarkable is the author didn't drag his feet writing the last books but kept delivering a new book every 16 months or so.

 

I loved Martin until he pulled his crap of not releasing the later books and delaying again and again....

A song of ice and fire is going to end like the Wheel of time. Except Martin has no idea where it's going so he won't be able to leave notes for anyone to take over....

 

The only reproach I have to make to Erikson is that Kalam isn't in the last 4 books !!! I want him back damned...



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Khuutra said:

FFXII is the best game in the series with the best writing and the best characters but that's savagely off-topic.

Robert Jordan (may he rest in peace) couldn't write women. Period. I can only assume that his understanding of the relationships between men and women was not accurately communicated in his portrayals of them. I liked the first few Wheel of Time books, but Jordan is not in any way comparable to Erikson or Martin.

And yes, characters are more important than worldbuilding - unless, ah, the world becomes something so grand, so wonderful, as to match the means of characters who walk other worlds.

Interesting, I absolutely love the relationships in a Wheel of Time, and think that the humor that they add is, in my mind, one of the cool parts about the series.



Money can't buy happiness. Just video games, which make me happy.

Baalzamon said:
Khuutra said:

FFXII is the best game in the series with the best writing and the best characters but that's savagely off-topic.

Robert Jordan (may he rest in peace) couldn't write women. Period. I can only assume that his understanding of the relationships between men and women was not accurately communicated in his portrayals of them. I liked the first few Wheel of Time books, but Jordan is not in any way comparable to Erikson or Martin.

And yes, characters are more important than worldbuilding - unless, ah, the world becomes something so grand, so wonderful, as to match the means of characters who walk other worlds.

Interesting, I absolutely love the relationships in a Wheel of Time, and think that the humor that they add is, in my mind, one of the cool parts about the series.

So which one w as your favorite woman?

Which one was your favorite dude/lady relationship?

Which one was your favorite relationship between two women?



haxxiy said:

And if you want to know how Way of Kings is, well... maybe you won't like it too much if Erikson and Martin are your standards instead of the likes of Jordan or (going a lot lower and dare I say their accursed names) Goodking and Paolini.

I'm not as harsh as all that, I'd probably like it. I just tend to find thhe best things I ccan and read on. I'm hgoing to need to fill in this gap when the Crippled God lands.

But Goodkind. Goodkind.

I read one book in the Sword of Truth series out of sequence - Pillars of Creation, I think - which was a sidestory about two of the protagonist's sibllings. Goodkind has problems, man. He has all of the problems.



I just finished Starquake, a terrific hard SF sequel to terrific hard SF novel. It tells about life on a neutron star, where creatures live million times faster than humans. The science is elaborated thoroughly and doesn't violate anything too serious, but it is clearly false (FTL e.g.).

Now I'm beginning Don Quixote. I've heard lots of good things about it and have great expectations.



Khuutra said:
Baalzamon said:
Khuutra said:

FFXII is the best game in the series with the best writing and the best characters but that's savagely off-topic.

Robert Jordan (may he rest in peace) couldn't write women. Period. I can only assume that his understanding of the relationships between men and women was not accurately communicated in his portrayals of them. I liked the first few Wheel of Time books, but Jordan is not in any way comparable to Erikson or Martin.

And yes, characters are more important than worldbuilding - unless, ah, the world becomes something so grand, so wonderful, as to match the means of characters who walk other worlds.

Interesting, I absolutely love the relationships in a Wheel of Time, and think that the humor that they add is, in my mind, one of the cool parts about the series.

So which one w as your favorite woman?

Which one was your favorite dude/lady relationship?

Which one was your favorite relationship between two women?

1.) Well, in the earlier books, I'd have to say Morraine is my favorite...but of the main girls, I'd defiantly have to say Egwene.  But later on in the books, each time, Nynaeve, surprisingly, as I don't much like her in the earlier novels comes out to be my favorite.

2.) I don't really have a favorite dude/lady relationship until slightly further into the series (4 or 5 books), and then it is defiantly Perrin and Faile.

3.) My favorite relationship between 2 women would defiantly have to be Nynaeve and Morraine.  Just Nynaeve's apparent hatred towards Morraine makes me chuckle.



Money can't buy happiness. Just video games, which make me happy.