By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - PC - And you wonder why developers 'hate' PC gamers ...

only pirated 3 games. 

1 was Big rigs over the road racing because i couldn't find an real copy as its very rare. 

2. was mario alstars because i wanted to play it and my super nintendo broke down 

3. Donkey country: same as above 

But when downloading the last 2 i fought nintendo put them up on brothersoft because brothersoft didn't seem to be an torrent site, so i dont know about that. 

But i wont pirate any new release, and only old games 5 years that are hard to fine and get super high prices on ebay.



Of Course That's Just My Opinion, I Could Be Wrong

Around the Network
ssj12 said:
slowmo said:
bannedagain said:

This is why I buy my games new, Never trade in old games. I also don't support game stops used games selection. I would have to say that they have a hand in this too. If I buy a new game and it sucks well atleast I know to rent the game made by that company next time.

Start buying new.


I actually find used game stores massively insulting, they charge anything up to 90% of RRP for a used game which in some cases will have free codes/DLC missing.  To top all of that off they're making huge profit and none goes back to the developer.  To me it's a slap in the face to both their customers by charging those prices and even bigger insult to publishers and developers.  I've bought two games used this generation, Uncharted DF which I couldn't obtain new at the time (pre Greatest Hits) and Mass Effect 2 (wanted it one day and couldn't find a new version anywhere in the city I was in, got lucky that the Cerberus code wasn't used).  I still feel annoyed I didn't think in advance and get these new when I had the chance.


Ya, used game shops are pretty bad. Even my local PlaynTrade which is normally decent raised their prices and no longer have ANY decent games. They brought Afrika back up from $25 to $50.

they should give at least 5-10% of profits from used games to developers. 



Of Course That's Just My Opinion, I Could Be Wrong

naznatips said:

I am working on a real editorial response to this piracy craze btw, not just an anti-rant. My data in the rant was factual, but this will be a sourced and documented editorial. 


awesome, I've been half-tempted to just link your post to a destructoid comment, but a real editorial response will totally destroy Jim's bs in a way with more detail and less rant with some awesomesauce on the side.



PC gaming is better than console gaming. Always.     We are Anonymous, We are Legion    Kick-ass interview   Great Flash Series Here    Anime Ratings     Make and Play Please
Amazing discussion about being wrong
Official VGChartz Folding@Home Team #109453
 
bannedagain said:
Killy_Vorkosigan said:

 

 

Hey, if I want to look at the shite from Dtoid, I can go on VGC now.

 

Don't forget that KZ3 has just leaked as well on torrent, or that you could get the Black Ops and MW2 360 version on torrents before the PC version. 

Also, it's quite funny to see console based sites talk shit on the PC crowd by making more publicity of the availability of games on torrent games, while minimizing the leaks on consoles. After that, we'll see a lot of die hards 12yo fanboys who will say PR industry shite like 'oh noes, the poor developarz' while spreading this kind of info. That's a great advertising for piracy you pretend to loathe, morons !

 

If you want to pay 100€ or more on games in the future, go for it, and support the industry whose only goal is to make money. And whine while you can, we will see in ten years when you'll have a proper job and kids and no time to play games.

 

EDIT : Oh btw, please tell the truth , it's in fact a leak coming FROM Crytek. So don't bash everybody as an argument to ur holy crusade against piracy


What a way to explain Away that you are cheap and most likely don't have any respect for anyone. I bet you borrow money and never pay it back either. It's called having some Pride and paying for what you like.  It doesn't matter who steals more or not. It is the point of not doing it.  You will push the games to 100 dollars a game, you will. Not the person who pays out of pocket for what he loves.

Look how many studio's we lost because of people like you. You think your doing gods work. You are a thief and criminal and that is it.

I can download house tracks for my shows for free but I don't because I would rather see the DJ get the money.
Don't justify your reasons with bullsh-t. Then  you go on to  talk about the industry only wanting to make money well most of are not. have you looked at the earnings for software companies. It's so hard for them to turn a profit that they don't go out of there way to try new things anymore. Put out games that are shorter and why is this.

You f-cking pirates are making it harder to turn a dollar. So people that pay  hard earned cash get screwed because you pirates are cheap.

You come out saying sh-t like this and you expect anyone to agree with you, you pirates are pathetic.

How many companies went bankrupt because of PC pirates and not low sales and high costs on consoles this gen? You should look into it and be surprised (quite a few developers of phone games also died recently, hardly PC pirates' fault). This generation marked a movement where developers and publishers are moving farther and farther away from the PC as a gaming platform and they lose more and more money in doing so. Steam is also being attacked by many of them or boycotted all together, shunning the best digital alternative (let's be honest; MS and Apple are bitches to work with in development and distribution) on the PC market digs the grave ever deeper, reminds me of the music industry being so loathe to embrace digital distribution back in the day (some still are, and they're not doing so hot). They also release half-assed and gimped PC games for the sake of console gamers, effectively making their products useless and they have the audacity to whine about low sales. Crashing servers, lack of patches and horrible interfaces and menu solutions, limited visual and sound tech and base gameplay garnished with hollywoodesque stories to melt the brain and wrap the mediocrity or outright shit they publish in suitable paper.

Mind you, I'm not defending pirating by any means, I buy 90% of my PC games on Steam and the rest in bargain bins at the store (are you opposed to bargain bins as well by the way? They net the publisher and/or developer little to no money). My point is; you need to wake up and start seeing nuances, a lot of people do. This is like blaming video games for violent behavior and murder; the story usually goes deeper.

To those who don't like Gamestop and other, similar stores; I agree. Gamestop's philosophy and business model are unfair and cowardly and they are just as bad as pirates, almost worse seeing as how its all legal (for some reason). Why aren't developers on their ass as much as torrenters? I don't buy anything from Gamestop at any rate.



Well, hating pc gamers because there are people pirating on that platform is the same as hating console gamers because there are pirates. Why the special treatment?




              

Around the Network
SuperAdrianK said:

Well, hating pc gamers because there are people pirating on that platform is the same as hating console gamers because there are pirates. Why the special treatment?


we are the gaming GODS!!!!

 

honestly, have no clue why we are hated. Better games? cheap affordable amazing indie titles that other platforms will never get? the only part of the industry that wont crash if the console market crashes like it's looking like it might eventually happen again based on the number of console devs going out and failing? Couldn't tell you honestly.



PC gaming is better than console gaming. Always.     We are Anonymous, We are Legion    Kick-ass interview   Great Flash Series Here    Anime Ratings     Make and Play Please
Amazing discussion about being wrong
Official VGChartz Folding@Home Team #109453
 

I should start going to schools around the world showing how piracy affects the way of life so that our up and coming generations can stop this shenanigans and we can all be happy. 



markers said:

I should start going to schools around the world showing how piracy affects the way of life so that our up and coming generations can stop this shenanigans and we can all be happy. 


piracy is barely an issue. truly even if current numbers doubled it wouldn't be anything to worry about. Modern publishers just suck at budgeting.



PC gaming is better than console gaming. Always.     We are Anonymous, We are Legion    Kick-ass interview   Great Flash Series Here    Anime Ratings     Make and Play Please
Amazing discussion about being wrong
Official VGChartz Folding@Home Team #109453
 
ssj12 said:
markers said:

I should start going to schools around the world showing how piracy affects the way of life so that our up and coming generations can stop this shenanigans and we can all be happy. 


piracy is barely an issue. truly even if current numbers doubled it wouldn't be anything to worry about. Modern publishers just suck at budgeting.

Yea, it really has minimal to no effect on the amount of profits or losses a company has, as a majority of piraters weren't going to buy the game in the first place.  If anything, one may even argue that of the few lost sales for people that may have purchased a game but instead pirated it, the overall effect of people pirating a game and getting the word out that so and so is a sweet game may actually lead to more profits.

That's not to say that the idea of piracy is a good one, though, I just hate hearing people blaming these companies losing money on that as well, as it is absolute bull shit.



Money can't buy happiness. Just video games, which make me happy.

naznatips said:

I don't think I've ever seen a journalist post something so horrible in my life. I don't even know where to start.

Frist, let me get the disclaimer out of the way: I have, many years ago, pirated games before. I was a stupid kid, and didn't care. I don't do that anymore, but I was not the devil incarnate like Sterling and twesterm believe. I certainly wasn't trying to harm the industry in any way. I was just young and silly and broke, and couldn't afford many games any way. In my adulthood I legally bought all of the handful of games I pirated as a child, generally on Steam. I'm not defending piracy as a practice at all. It's a bad thing, you shouldn't do it. I'm saying pirates aren't little demon's trying to destroy the industry. Maybe Jim Sterling is, though. 

I'm going to havve to break this into parts, because this rant might be explosively long and I don't want to miss any of the stupid opinions in this article, much less the factually incorrect bits. 

First of all, in his opening paragraph he points out that both Crysis and Killzone 3 were leaked onto the internet recently. Does he ever bring up Killzone 3 again? Nope. Or the presence of piracy on consoles and handhelds? Nope. Well let's look at that. Sony claims the PSP's abysmal sales are almost entirely due to piracy. Do I believe this? No, but I do know certain games have been pirated more than even the biggest of PC games. For example, Dissidia was pirated more than 5 million times... in Japan alone. Even Starcraft 2 wasn't pirated that much. Did that stop Dissidia from being profitable? Absolutely not. Similarly, the R4 on the DS is the simplest piracy tool ever made. No system hacks, no firmware hacks or rewrites, people can literally drop a rom onto a microSD and pop it the device straight into their DS, and with it games have been pirated hundreds of millions of times over the gerenation. And now we have Killzone 3 leaked and PS3's being cracked everywhere for the purpose of piracy. Why are PC gamers being singled out in this ridiculous attack again?

Now he goes on to examine how "cutthroat" the game industry is, and how if you aren't selling multi-millions, you don't make money. Wait, what? We're blaming PC, by far the cheapest HD development option, for the high barriers of entry now? Do you people have any idea what's been going on this generation? EA has lost billions of dollars, fired 1,500 people (more than the entire staff of Eidos). Speaking of Eidos, they would have been completely bankrupt if it weren't for SE buying them out. 2K has only ever made money two years (GTAIV and RDR) the entire generation and even then it wasn't much. Activision even lost money last year, and they're practically printing money with Call of Duty. The last two years EA has lost more than $1 billion. Ubisoft is barely scraping by breaking even, and only because of Assassin's Creed and their casual games like Just Dance. 

Those are by far console focused Western developers. The Japanese tend to do better, because they aren't functionally retarded. Okay, a little harsh, but seriously, what the hell is wrong with this side of the world that we can't budget our games for reasonable sales expectations? It's become exactly like the movie industry. The only people who can afford to make games are those who can afford to lose millions of dollars on them! With this, dozens of publishers have closed, thousands of developers are out of work, and the industry has shrunk signifficantly in the number of people making games. All of this is completely due to console development. So how about this devlish PC, with these stupid PC gamers that these ever so brilliant dying publishers are ignoring?

Valve just announced that they make more money per employee than Google or Apple. Judgingn by Forbes estimates of their profits, it's a lot more. Forbes estimates Steam made $1-$2 BILLION for Valve last year. That's just Valve's profits on the service alone. They take a 30% cut on every game sold, and people pay them for advertising on the front page. Just those factors, and the games they themselves have sold, have caused them to make $1-$2 billion, while EA lost $750 million. EA, the publisher who is actively avoiding Steam. Who refused to put Dragon Age II on it in time for the Signature Edition sale. The Sims bombed on consoles, but sold 4.6 million copies on PC. It was one of EA's only profitable pieces of software in 2009, a year in which they only lost $350 million. How about Blizzard? They sold over 4.5 million copies of Starcraft 2. World of Warcraft is the most profitable piece of entertainment in the history of mankind. 

But that's just big guys. Let's talk about the kind of environment, and potential profits available for the little ones. Jim Sterling, in his infinite wisdom, decided to use World of Goo as an example of the doom of PC. World of Goo made more than 50% of its money, by 2009, on the 2D Boy Website, and Steam (thanks to a Steam sale). About 30% of their total money was WiiWare, which is a pretty solid cut. Then they did the Humble Indie Bundle, which alone made $1.3 million. about 1/4 of which went to 2D Boy. In the end they made the vast majority of their profits on PC, and PC is where it's still selling. 2D Boy themselves are staunch defenders of PC, and Steam, and very vocal against the effectiveness of DRM and the silliness of blaming piracy for the inability to make profit. Or how about Outerlight, a small indie developer who made a clever game, only to have their company destroyed by Ubisoft and their ideas stolen for AC:B source. Outerlight wished they had just ignored publishers, and worked with Steam alone, which brings me to my real point:

You want to know what's destroying this industry? It's publishers. It's EA, Activision, 2K, and Ubisoft. It is the companies who strived so hard to set up gaming into an oligarchy, where only the rich and powerful survive and the indie developer has no chance. You want to know why they hate PC? Because it's where the indie games thrive. It's where Magicka can sell 30,000 copies in one day on Steam and makes a profit, and sells 200,000 copies in 2 weeks and already funds the little guys' next 3 games. It's where Super Meat Boy can double its sales on all consoles combined. It's where Minecraft, made by one man, can make more money than Mass Effect 2 and its tens of millions of dollars in budget. It's where those huge publishers, those massive companies who want gaming to be like the movie industry, have no control. It is the great equalizer. The place where they have to compete with the little guys. Where they have to sell on a platform (Steam) which is supportive of those little guys. It's the place where they can't turn the gaming industry into the movie industry, ruled by the strong and impossible for the weak to enter.   

You want to blame piracy for the lack of publisher support on PC? Ridiculous. Blame fear. Fear that the horrible business models that those giant publishers created under the assumption that they could shut out the little guys forever, are now causing their impending doom. PC is an open platform. It's a platform that supports creativity, and quality, and small budget games better than anywhere else in the industry. Where people can make money without getting a publisher at all. So don't give me this crap. Don't tell me PC is inconsequential. Steam is the largest digitial distribution software service in the world. PC is stronger than ever, and far more profitable than consoles now. Piracy is bad. But this article is a crime in itself. 

Wow, just wow! Excellent reply.



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")
A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.
TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW!