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Forums - General - Separation of Church and State? Screw That... Proselytism FTW!

Kasz216 on 24 January 2011
sapphi_snake said:
pizzahut451 said:
Rath said:
pizzahut451 said:
 

I didnt said they should. As for Thomas Jefferson, he believed in God, did he not? He also admired teachings of Jesus Christ a LOT and he was very bound to them. Doesnt chnage the fact that religion/God was in american politics from the beginning, so people shouldn't get so butthurt over this guy's statement. America IS a CHRISTIAN country, and just because you are not christian, doesnt mean you should get offended because someone said he/she is, especially if you live in christian country like America.

People aren't offended by him saying he's Christian. Of course not, almost all of your politicians do that.

It's him explicitly saying he wants people in his state to convert that is offending people.

No, he never tried to convert people to his fate, he said he wishes to be your brother, and that means he wishes you WERE Christian not that you ARE christian. Thats not even an attempt to convertion and if that offends you, than you have some really easy and spoiled life. What do you do if someone insults directly  you or your family. Kill yourself?

 

Also America is not a Christian country, it really isn't. It's a secular country with a Christian majority - their is a very important and very explicit different between the two. Interstingly despite being largely secular in nature England actually is a Christian nation - it has a defined state religion in the Church of England.

try spinning stuff to please you, it doesnt change anything. Most of people in america are christians, and if you get offended by someone is trying to speak for the country's major religion than you should definitly GTFO of there (im not talking about you).

 

Edit: Also admiring the teachings of Jesus doesn't make you a Christian, most Muslims respect his teachings - they even consider him a prophet.

All american founding politicains believed in abrahamic God.The belief in God can clearly be seen in Constitiution and Declaration of Independece, THE END. Dont know why this fact troubles you so much.



HAve you ever heard of deism? Look it up!

Eh, honestly though I disagree with him.   As it was, I'm pretty sure most if not all of the founding fathers were Christian Deists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Deism



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sapphi_snake on 24 January 2011
Kasz216 said:
sapphi_snake said:

HAve you ever heard of deism? Look it up!

Eh, honestly though I disagree with him.   As it was, I'm pretty sure most if not all of the founding fathers were Christian Deists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Deism

I'm pretty sure actual Christians wouldn't consider "Christian deists" to be real Christians.

Also, I never really got the importance of the religon of those guys, or what they beleived etc. They were also slave owners and racists. Should people strive to live up to that? They're dead. All that matters today is what the living want.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

Kasz216 on 24 January 2011
sapphi_snake said:
Kasz216 said:
sapphi_snake said:

HAve you ever heard of deism? Look it up!

Eh, honestly though I disagree with him.   As it was, I'm pretty sure most if not all of the founding fathers were Christian Deists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Deism

I'm pretty sure actual Christians wouldn't consider "Christian deists" to be real Christians.

Also, I never really got the importance of the religon of those guys, or what they beleived etc. They were also slave owners and racists. Should people strive to live up to that? They're dead. All that matters today is what the living want.

A lot of actual christians didn't consider each other christians back then.  That's why a lot of them left for the "New World" in the first place.

Though actually the founding fathers people hold up to acclaim were actually all abolishonists... and really that in of itself is worthy of lots of praise and respect... since back then owning slaves was more advantageous and culturally accepted.

Though some of them owned slaves they wished to get rid of them, but due to the laws at the time they couldn't.



sapphi_snake on 25 January 2011
Kasz216 said:
sapphi_snake said:
Kasz216 said:
sapphi_snake said:

HAve you ever heard of deism? Look it up!

Eh, honestly though I disagree with him.   As it was, I'm pretty sure most if not all of the founding fathers were Christian Deists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Deism

I'm pretty sure actual Christians wouldn't consider "Christian deists" to be real Christians.

Also, I never really got the importance of the religon of those guys, or what they beleived etc. They were also slave owners and racists. Should people strive to live up to that? They're dead. All that matters today is what the living want.

A lot of actual christians didn't consider each other christians back then.  That's why a lot of them left for the "New World" in the first place.

Though actually the founding fathers people hold up to acclaim were actually all abolishonists... and really that in of itself is worthy of lots of praise and respect... since back then owning slaves was more advantageous and culturally accepted.

Though some of them owned slaves they wished to get rid of them, but due to the laws at the time they couldn't.

A lot of actual Christians don't consider eachother Christians even today. Guess some things never change, no?

As for the founding fathers, I guess they shouldn't necessarily be judged by today's standards. It does kinda bug me how you guys seem to worship them like some sort of deities though. That can't possibly be healthy.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

Rath on 25 January 2011

Yeah I have some mates, Open Brethren I think, who don't consider Catholics to be Christians. No matter how much I try to explain that surely people who believe that Jesus is the son of God and the messiah surely must qualify.



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pizzahut451 on 25 January 2011
sapphi_snake said:
pizzahut451 said:
Rath said:
pizzahut451 said:
 

I didnt said they should. As for Thomas Jefferson, he believed in God, did he not? He also admired teachings of Jesus Christ a LOT and he was very bound to them. Doesnt chnage the fact that religion/God was in american politics from the beginning, so people shouldn't get so butthurt over this guy's statement. America IS a CHRISTIAN country, and just because you are not christian, doesnt mean you should get offended because someone said he/she is, especially if you live in christian country like America.

People aren't offended by him saying he's Christian. Of course not, almost all of your politicians do that.

It's him explicitly saying he wants people in his state to convert that is offending people.

No, he never tried to convert people to his fate, he said he wishes to be your brother, and that means he wishes you WERE Christian not that you ARE christian. Thats not even an attempt to convertion and if that offends you, than you have some really easy and spoiled life. What do you do if someone insults directly  you or your family. Kill yourself?

 

Also America is not a Christian country, it really isn't. It's a secular country with a Christian majority - their is a very important and very explicit different between the two. Interstingly despite being largely secular in nature England actually is a Christian nation - it has a defined state religion in the Church of England.

try spinning stuff to please you, it doesnt change anything. Most of people in america are christians, and if you get offended by someone is trying to speak for the country's major religion than you should definitly GTFO of there (im not talking about you).

 

Edit: Also admiring the teachings of Jesus doesn't make you a Christian, most Muslims respect his teachings - they even consider him a prophet.

All american founding politicains believed in abrahamic God.The belief in God can clearly be seen in Constitiution and Declaration of Independece, THE END. Dont know why this fact troubles you so much.



HAve you ever heard of deism? Look it up!

I did. And?



sapphi_snake on 26 January 2011
pizzahut451 said:
sapphi_snake said:
pizzahut451 said:

HAve you ever heard of deism? Look it up!

I did. And?

I guess you didn't understand what it's all about.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

pizzahut451 on 26 January 2011
sapphi_snake said:
pizzahut451 said:
sapphi_snake said:
pizzahut451 said:

HAve you ever heard of deism? Look it up!

I did. And?

I guess you didn't understand what it's all about.

I did.