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Forums - Sony - Judge delays ruling on Playstation Hack.

What I don't get is what ever happened to failoverflow?  It seems like everyone is giving credit to Geohot.  But all he did was use their hack, but also published the keys (failoverflow refused to do this for piracy reasons).  Geohot seems more interested in making a name for himself, rather than using Linux/homebrew on the PS3.

Also, if it's ok to hack the iPhone or PS3, which runs copyrighted works, why do we even have the DMCA? "The DMCA makes it either a civil or criminal offense to traffic in wares meant to circumvent devices protecting copyrighted works."  Isn't that what he is doing?  That's one thing I dislike about the US court system.  Congress may make laws that say something is illegal, but a judge may rule it is legal because of their personal opinion.  That's not the job of a judge.



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This ruling will change the face of the entire game industry. Go GeoHotz go! Win this thing!



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thismeintiel said:

What I don't get is what ever happened to failoverflow?  It seems like everyone is giving credit to Geohot.  But all he did was use their hack, but also published the keys (failoverflow refused to do this for piracy reasons).  Geohot seems more interested in making a name for himself, rather than using Linux/homebrew on the PS3.

Also, if it's ok to hack the iPhone or PS3, which runs copyrighted works, why do we even have the DMCA? "The DMCA makes it either a civil or criminal offense to traffic in wares meant to circumvent devices protecting copyrighted works."  Isn't that what he is doing?  That's one thing I dislike about the US court system.  Congress may make laws that say something is illegal, but a judge may rule it is legal because of their personal opinion.  That's not the job of a judge.

The DMCA is complete trash. It stifles innovation and creativity. Its just bs that gives the RIAA and MPAA ammo to stop the creation of home made music videos (Anime Music Videos, personal music videos, cover song videos, etc). It should never have been enacted, but Clinton was an idiot who folded to industry pressures (or bribes to fund his "causes" and his wife's election campaigns).

But sadly this nation is nothing but corporate greed, civil liberties and free thought has basically been banned in the Corporation of America which is why I am enjoying watching this empire fall around us.



PC gaming is better than console gaming. Always.     We are Anonymous, We are Legion    Kick-ass interview   Great Flash Series Here    Anime Ratings     Make and Play Please
Amazing discussion about being wrong
Official VGChartz Folding@Home Team #109453
 
ssj12 said:
thismeintiel said:

What I don't get is what ever happened to failoverflow?  It seems like everyone is giving credit to Geohot.  But all he did was use their hack, but also published the keys (failoverflow refused to do this for piracy reasons).  Geohot seems more interested in making a name for himself, rather than using Linux/homebrew on the PS3.

Also, if it's ok to hack the iPhone or PS3, which runs copyrighted works, why do we even have the DMCA? "The DMCA makes it either a civil or criminal offense to traffic in wares meant to circumvent devices protecting copyrighted works."  Isn't that what he is doing?  That's one thing I dislike about the US court system.  Congress may make laws that say something is illegal, but a judge may rule it is legal because of their personal opinion.  That's not the job of a judge.

The DMCA is complete trash. It stifles innovation and creativity. Its just bs that gives the RIAA and MPAA ammo to stop the creation of home made music videos (Anime Music Videos, personal music videos, cover song videos, etc). It should never have been enacted, but Clinton was an idiot who folded to industry pressures (or bribes to fund his "causes" and his wife's election campaigns).

But sadly this nation is nothing but corporate greed, civil liberties and free thought has basically been banned in the Corporation of America which is why I am enjoying watching this empire fall around us.

You do realize that without corporations, we wouldn't have any of the things we have today.  There would be nothing to hack.  There would be no companies that developed and manufactored CPU and GPU chips.  No companies to make phones, computers, or consoles.  Hundreds of millions of jobs lost.  These companies' rights have to be protected, as well.  Do they go too far in protecting these rights?  Yes, sometimes.  You see it all the time when things from Youtube are taken down that clearly fall under fair use.  Nintendo not allowing a fan made Zelda movie to be released is a more specific example.  But there is a process to go through to get those things back up.  Most people choose to not go through it, though.

But, let's be honest.  This has nothing to do with fair use.  Or what someone does with their own PS3 in their own time.  This has everything to do with someone discovering the security keys for the PS3 and publishing  them for ALL to see.  Something that will without a doubt lead to piracy.  Hell, there is already reports of people playing backed up games within a few days of this releasing.  So where are all these amazing apps and homebrew at?  Yea, they will be coming in months, maybe years, but piracy undoubedly  already here.



thismeintiel said:
ssj12 said:
thismeintiel said:

What I don't get is what ever happened to failoverflow?  It seems like everyone is giving credit to Geohot.  But all he did was use their hack, but also published the keys (failoverflow refused to do this for piracy reasons).  Geohot seems more interested in making a name for himself, rather than using Linux/homebrew on the PS3.

Also, if it's ok to hack the iPhone or PS3, which runs copyrighted works, why do we even have the DMCA? "The DMCA makes it either a civil or criminal offense to traffic in wares meant to circumvent devices protecting copyrighted works."  Isn't that what he is doing?  That's one thing I dislike about the US court system.  Congress may make laws that say something is illegal, but a judge may rule it is legal because of their personal opinion.  That's not the job of a judge.

The DMCA is complete trash. It stifles innovation and creativity. Its just bs that gives the RIAA and MPAA ammo to stop the creation of home made music videos (Anime Music Videos, personal music videos, cover song videos, etc). It should never have been enacted, but Clinton was an idiot who folded to industry pressures (or bribes to fund his "causes" and his wife's election campaigns).

But sadly this nation is nothing but corporate greed, civil liberties and free thought has basically been banned in the Corporation of America which is why I am enjoying watching this empire fall around us.

You do realize that without corporations, we wouldn't have any of the things we have today.  There would be nothing to hack.  There would be no companies that developed and manufactored CPU and GPU chips.  No companies to make phones, computers, or consoles.  Hundreds of millions of jobs lost.  These companies' rights have to be protected, as well.  Do they go too far in protecting these rights?  Yes, sometimes.  You see it all the time when things from Youtube are taken down that clearly fall under fair use.  Nintendo not allowing a fan made Zelda movie to be released is a more specific example.  But there is a process to go through to get those things back up.  Most people choose to not go through it, though.

But, let's be honest.  This has nothing to do with fair use.  Or what someone does with their own PS3 in their own time.  This has everything to do with someone discovering the security keys for the PS3 and publishing  them for ALL to see.  Something that will without a doubt lead to piracy.  Hell, there is already reports of people playing backed up games within a few days of this releasing.  So where are all these amazing apps and homebrew at?  Yea, they will be coming in months, maybe years, but piracy undoubedly  already here.

homebrew apps are fairly easy to make for the PS3 as the cell has basically already been mapped thanks to the other os feature that was removed. We will probably see a version of FireFox for PS3 soon.

Hacking the security for one's property and releasing how to do it is completely legal. Its like me developing a brand new piece of software that prevents windows from never blue-screening. I would release it as an open-source project and release the full source code. Would Microsoft like it? No I'd have the pants sued off me, or at least they would try. Its all a bunch of bs. I understand protecting your property and stuff. Trademarks, music, titles, etc. Software should not be patentable product, and the prevention from modifying software you own shouldn't be blocked. All there should be is a message saying that any illegal activity from modified products falls on your head. You will also be blocked from our services and systems for our own and our customers safety.

Seriously, we can jailbreak an iPhone and install anything we want on it without Apple having any control so what makes a console any different other than its bigger.



PC gaming is better than console gaming. Always.     We are Anonymous, We are Legion    Kick-ass interview   Great Flash Series Here    Anime Ratings     Make and Play Please
Amazing discussion about being wrong
Official VGChartz Folding@Home Team #109453
 
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thismeintiel said:
ssj12 said:
thismeintiel said:

What I don't get is what ever happened to failoverflow?  It seems like everyone is giving credit to Geohot.  But all he did was use their hack, but also published the keys (failoverflow refused to do this for piracy reasons).  Geohot seems more interested in making a name for himself, rather than using Linux/homebrew on the PS3.

Also, if it's ok to hack the iPhone or PS3, which runs copyrighted works, why do we even have the DMCA? "The DMCA makes it either a civil or criminal offense to traffic in wares meant to circumvent devices protecting copyrighted works."  Isn't that what he is doing?  That's one thing I dislike about the US court system.  Congress may make laws that say something is illegal, but a judge may rule it is legal because of their personal opinion.  That's not the job of a judge.

The DMCA is complete trash. It stifles innovation and creativity. Its just bs that gives the RIAA and MPAA ammo to stop the creation of home made music videos (Anime Music Videos, personal music videos, cover song videos, etc). It should never have been enacted, but Clinton was an idiot who folded to industry pressures (or bribes to fund his "causes" and his wife's election campaigns).

But sadly this nation is nothing but corporate greed, civil liberties and free thought has basically been banned in the Corporation of America which is why I am enjoying watching this empire fall around us.

You do realize that without corporations, we wouldn't have any of the things we have today.  There would be nothing to hack.  There would be no companies that developed and manufactored CPU and GPU chips.  No companies to make phones, computers, or consoles.  Hundreds of millions of jobs lost.  These companies' rights have to be protected, as well.  Do they go too far in protecting these rights?  Yes, sometimes.  You see it all the time when things from Youtube are taken down that clearly fall under fair use.  Nintendo not allowing a fan made Zelda movie to be released is a more specific example.  But there is a process to go through to get those things back up.  Most people choose to not go through it, though.

But, let's be honest.  This has nothing to do with fair use.  Or what someone does with their own PS3 in their own time.  This has everything to do with someone discovering the security keys for the PS3 and publishing  them for ALL to see.  Something that will without a doubt lead to piracy.  Hell, there is already reports of people playing backed up games within a few days of this releasing.  So where are all these amazing apps and homebrew at?  Yea, they will be coming in months, maybe years, but piracy undoubedly  already here.

You do realize with out the individuals in those corporations nothing would happen. Its the people that create and make things, not corporations. The world advanced with out them and can continue to do so if they fail. Its the people that matter. It has everything to do with fair use. Why can I not use the hardware I buy to run programs I make or my friends or other companies make? I payed for it didn't I? I agree with the not pirating, you do not have the right to software unless you buy it or it is given to you. But if you think scientific advancements will stop because mega corporations fail you are wrong. All it takes is one person with time and resources to create something.



ssj12 said:
thismeintiel said:
ssj12 said:
thismeintiel said:

What I don't get is what ever happened to failoverflow?  It seems like everyone is giving credit to Geohot.  But all he did was use their hack, but also published the keys (failoverflow refused to do this for piracy reasons).  Geohot seems more interested in making a name for himself, rather than using Linux/homebrew on the PS3.

Also, if it's ok to hack the iPhone or PS3, which runs copyrighted works, why do we even have the DMCA? "The DMCA makes it either a civil or criminal offense to traffic in wares meant to circumvent devices protecting copyrighted works."  Isn't that what he is doing?  That's one thing I dislike about the US court system.  Congress may make laws that say something is illegal, but a judge may rule it is legal because of their personal opinion.  That's not the job of a judge.

The DMCA is complete trash. It stifles innovation and creativity. Its just bs that gives the RIAA and MPAA ammo to stop the creation of home made music videos (Anime Music Videos, personal music videos, cover song videos, etc). It should never have been enacted, but Clinton was an idiot who folded to industry pressures (or bribes to fund his "causes" and his wife's election campaigns).

But sadly this nation is nothing but corporate greed, civil liberties and free thought has basically been banned in the Corporation of America which is why I am enjoying watching this empire fall around us.

You do realize that without corporations, we wouldn't have any of the things we have today.  There would be nothing to hack.  There would be no companies that developed and manufactored CPU and GPU chips.  No companies to make phones, computers, or consoles.  Hundreds of millions of jobs lost.  These companies' rights have to be protected, as well.  Do they go too far in protecting these rights?  Yes, sometimes.  You see it all the time when things from Youtube are taken down that clearly fall under fair use.  Nintendo not allowing a fan made Zelda movie to be released is a more specific example.  But there is a process to go through to get those things back up.  Most people choose to not go through it, though.

But, let's be honest.  This has nothing to do with fair use.  Or what someone does with their own PS3 in their own time.  This has everything to do with someone discovering the security keys for the PS3 and publishing  them for ALL to see.  Something that will without a doubt lead to piracy.  Hell, there is already reports of people playing backed up games within a few days of this releasing.  So where are all these amazing apps and homebrew at?  Yea, they will be coming in months, maybe years, but piracy undoubedly  already here.

homebrew apps are fairly easy to make for the PS3 as the cell has basically already been mapped thanks to the other os feature that was removed. We will probably see a version of FireFox for PS3 soon.

Hacking the security for one's property and releasing how to do it is completely legal. Its like me developing a brand new piece of software that prevents windows from never blue-screening. I would release it as an open-source project and release the full source code. Would Microsoft like it? No I'd have the pants sued off me, or at least they would try. Its all a bunch of bs. I understand protecting your property and stuff. Trademarks, music, titles, etc. Software should not be patentable product, and the prevention from modifying software you own shouldn't be blocked. All there should be is a message saying that any illegal activity from modified products falls on your head. You will also be blocked from our services and systems for our own and our customers safety.

Seriously, we can jailbreak an iPhone and install anything we want on it without Apple having any control so what makes a console any different other than its bigger.

Regardless of how soon we'll see Firefox, or any other app, the point is piracy already beat it.  Which usually is the case.

And Sony's security measures are not open source, though.  Nor are it's decryption keys.  And why shouldn't software be patentable?  Some companies spend millions of dollars creating said software.  You think their reward should be to just release it on the internet with no reimbersment at all.  They would go under very quickly.



thismeintiel said:
ssj12 said:
thismeintiel said:
ssj12 said:
thismeintiel said:

What I don't get is what ever happened to failoverflow?  It seems like everyone is giving credit to Geohot.  But all he did was use their hack, but also published the keys (failoverflow refused to do this for piracy reasons).  Geohot seems more interested in making a name for himself, rather than using Linux/homebrew on the PS3.

Also, if it's ok to hack the iPhone or PS3, which runs copyrighted works, why do we even have the DMCA? "The DMCA makes it either a civil or criminal offense to traffic in wares meant to circumvent devices protecting copyrighted works."  Isn't that what he is doing?  That's one thing I dislike about the US court system.  Congress may make laws that say something is illegal, but a judge may rule it is legal because of their personal opinion.  That's not the job of a judge.

The DMCA is complete trash. It stifles innovation and creativity. Its just bs that gives the RIAA and MPAA ammo to stop the creation of home made music videos (Anime Music Videos, personal music videos, cover song videos, etc). It should never have been enacted, but Clinton was an idiot who folded to industry pressures (or bribes to fund his "causes" and his wife's election campaigns).

But sadly this nation is nothing but corporate greed, civil liberties and free thought has basically been banned in the Corporation of America which is why I am enjoying watching this empire fall around us.

You do realize that without corporations, we wouldn't have any of the things we have today.  There would be nothing to hack.  There would be no companies that developed and manufactored CPU and GPU chips.  No companies to make phones, computers, or consoles.  Hundreds of millions of jobs lost.  These companies' rights have to be protected, as well.  Do they go too far in protecting these rights?  Yes, sometimes.  You see it all the time when things from Youtube are taken down that clearly fall under fair use.  Nintendo not allowing a fan made Zelda movie to be released is a more specific example.  But there is a process to go through to get those things back up.  Most people choose to not go through it, though.

But, let's be honest.  This has nothing to do with fair use.  Or what someone does with their own PS3 in their own time.  This has everything to do with someone discovering the security keys for the PS3 and publishing  them for ALL to see.  Something that will without a doubt lead to piracy.  Hell, there is already reports of people playing backed up games within a few days of this releasing.  So where are all these amazing apps and homebrew at?  Yea, they will be coming in months, maybe years, but piracy undoubedly  already here.

homebrew apps are fairly easy to make for the PS3 as the cell has basically already been mapped thanks to the other os feature that was removed. We will probably see a version of FireFox for PS3 soon.

Hacking the security for one's property and releasing how to do it is completely legal. Its like me developing a brand new piece of software that prevents windows from never blue-screening. I would release it as an open-source project and release the full source code. Would Microsoft like it? No I'd have the pants sued off me, or at least they would try. Its all a bunch of bs. I understand protecting your property and stuff. Trademarks, music, titles, etc. Software should not be patentable product, and the prevention from modifying software you own shouldn't be blocked. All there should be is a message saying that any illegal activity from modified products falls on your head. You will also be blocked from our services and systems for our own and our customers safety.

Seriously, we can jailbreak an iPhone and install anything we want on it without Apple having any control so what makes a console any different other than its bigger.

Regardless of how soon we'll see Firefox, or any other app, the point is piracy already beat it.  Which usually is the case.

And Sony's security measures are not open source, though.  Nor are it's decryption keys.  And why shouldn't software be patentable?  Some companies spend millions of dollars creating said software.  You think their reward should be to just release it on the internet with no reimbersment at all.  They would go under very quickly.

The ps3 hardware( opening the ps3 up to do what you want with it ) hack is what everyone here is talking about, unless i missed something. This is not about taking sony's software, its about utilizing the hardware you bought to do what you want with it



thismeintiel said:
ssj12 said:
thismeintiel said:
ssj12 said:
thismeintiel said:

What I don't get is what ever happened to failoverflow?  It seems like everyone is giving credit to Geohot.  But all he did was use their hack, but also published the keys (failoverflow refused to do this for piracy reasons).  Geohot seems more interested in making a name for himself, rather than using Linux/homebrew on the PS3.

Also, if it's ok to hack the iPhone or PS3, which runs copyrighted works, why do we even have the DMCA? "The DMCA makes it either a civil or criminal offense to traffic in wares meant to circumvent devices protecting copyrighted works."  Isn't that what he is doing?  That's one thing I dislike about the US court system.  Congress may make laws that say something is illegal, but a judge may rule it is legal because of their personal opinion.  That's not the job of a judge.

The DMCA is complete trash. It stifles innovation and creativity. Its just bs that gives the RIAA and MPAA ammo to stop the creation of home made music videos (Anime Music Videos, personal music videos, cover song videos, etc). It should never have been enacted, but Clinton was an idiot who folded to industry pressures (or bribes to fund his "causes" and his wife's election campaigns).

But sadly this nation is nothing but corporate greed, civil liberties and free thought has basically been banned in the Corporation of America which is why I am enjoying watching this empire fall around us.

You do realize that without corporations, we wouldn't have any of the things we have today.  There would be nothing to hack.  There would be no companies that developed and manufactored CPU and GPU chips.  No companies to make phones, computers, or consoles.  Hundreds of millions of jobs lost.  These companies' rights have to be protected, as well.  Do they go too far in protecting these rights?  Yes, sometimes.  You see it all the time when things from Youtube are taken down that clearly fall under fair use.  Nintendo not allowing a fan made Zelda movie to be released is a more specific example.  But there is a process to go through to get those things back up.  Most people choose to not go through it, though.

But, let's be honest.  This has nothing to do with fair use.  Or what someone does with their own PS3 in their own time.  This has everything to do with someone discovering the security keys for the PS3 and publishing  them for ALL to see.  Something that will without a doubt lead to piracy.  Hell, there is already reports of people playing backed up games within a few days of this releasing.  So where are all these amazing apps and homebrew at?  Yea, they will be coming in months, maybe years, but piracy undoubedly  already here.

homebrew apps are fairly easy to make for the PS3 as the cell has basically already been mapped thanks to the other os feature that was removed. We will probably see a version of FireFox for PS3 soon.

Hacking the security for one's property and releasing how to do it is completely legal. Its like me developing a brand new piece of software that prevents windows from never blue-screening. I would release it as an open-source project and release the full source code. Would Microsoft like it? No I'd have the pants sued off me, or at least they would try. Its all a bunch of bs. I understand protecting your property and stuff. Trademarks, music, titles, etc. Software should not be patentable product, and the prevention from modifying software you own shouldn't be blocked. All there should be is a message saying that any illegal activity from modified products falls on your head. You will also be blocked from our services and systems for our own and our customers safety.

Seriously, we can jailbreak an iPhone and install anything we want on it without Apple having any control so what makes a console any different other than its bigger.

Regardless of how soon we'll see Firefox, or any other app, the point is piracy already beat it.  Which usually is the case.

And Sony's security measures are not open source, though.  Nor are it's decryption keys.  And why shouldn't software be patentable?  Some companies spend millions of dollars creating said software.  You think their reward should be to just release it on the internet with no reimbersment at all.  They would go under very quickly.

I really don't see how we can argue or discuss things if you have no idea what this issues are.

Download the video on this site. Its about 30 - 40 minutes long and comes with a number of different file sizes or you can watch the video on the site. I just recommend downloading as it allows few better viewing. Afterward, maybe you will better understand the issues that surround software patents and they cripple the industry as a whole.

http://patentabsurdity.com/



PC gaming is better than console gaming. Always.     We are Anonymous, We are Legion    Kick-ass interview   Great Flash Series Here    Anime Ratings     Make and Play Please
Amazing discussion about being wrong
Official VGChartz Folding@Home Team #109453
 
thranx said:

You do realize with out the individuals in those corporations nothing would happen. Its the people that create and make things, not corporations. The world advanced with out them and can continue to do so if they fail. Its the people that matter. It has everything to do with fair use. Why can I not use the hardware I buy to run programs I make or my friends or other companies make? I payed for it didn't I? I agree with the not pirating, you do not have the right to software unless you buy it or it is given to you. But if you think scientific advancements will stop because mega corporations fail you are wrong. All it takes is one person with time and resources to create something.

Yes, I realize that corporations are made up of individuals.  Do you?  See this is what I don't get when people talk about the "evil" corparations (not that you used that word, but your post gives me the impression you may feel that way).  Those same companies employ millions of people.  They create millions of products to meet the demand of millions of people.  What would happen if they have no protection under law, lose money, and then go under.  The economy and job market suffer greatly.  And the world may have advanced without them, but the world of technology would not be this far without them.  Someone invents something incredible, what does he do with it?  He sells it.  Now, how does he do so?  He creates a shop/small company.  Now if demand for his product rises, what does he do?  Stay small and do the best he can?  Of course not.  He expands.  Creating new shops in new areas, while hiring new people to run said stores.  And while demand is increasing, he keeps expanding.  Maybe pouring money into new products or just upgrading the previous one.  Then before you know it, he has himself a "mega corporation."  Of course, to keep doing well he needs to be protected by law from those who can do him harm, whether intentionally or not.

Again this what I don't get when some demonize corporations.  They need to realise that all started very small, usually as one store.  There was just a great demand for their products/services so they expanded.  That doesn't make them anymore evil than the local mom and pop store down the street.  Because trust me, if they were booming and there was need for them to expand, they would.