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Forums - PC - PrimeSense's Kinect Technology Finds a New Home on the PC

daroamer on 04 January 2011
snakenobi said:
AussieGecko said:
snakenobi said:
AussieGecko said:

I thought MS put a shite load of money into Kinect... how would this be allowed without MS having a bit of the profits?


they just licensed their tech

AND most of the moeny MS put into KINECT is marketing


Wasnt talking about market, I said the product itself

I know but what they are spending on marketing far outstrips what they have spent on kinect hardware itself

and the main tech is from primsense was already ready so MS just had to license it

I love how people always try to downplay Microsofts role in Kinect by saying "oh, they just bought it" when that's far from the truth.  A lot of the software that drives Kinect (including much of the skeletal recognition algorithms) was developed by Microsoft and much of it had been in development for many years before there was a "Project Natal".

Do you have any kind of source on what Microsoft spent on R&D for the device?



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Mr Puggsly on 04 January 2011
ssj12 said:

I wonder if you could just buy the Asus version and plug it into the 360... might be cheaper as Asus is a good manufacturer that will get costs down fast.

Ofcourse it'll work. A long with any random wifi adapter.

I imagine the Kinect will get price cuts probably as soon as fall of 2011. Apparently each unit is being sold at a large profit.



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daroamer on 04 January 2011
ssj12 said:

I wonder if you could just buy the Asus version and plug it into the 360... might be cheaper as Asus is a good manufacturer that will get costs down fast.


Another person who thinks Microsoft bought the entire Kinect peripheral from PrimeSense.

Not only is this missing the RGB camera and microphone array it's missing most of the software that drives Kinect.  The only thing it shares is the depth camera.  PrimeSense has their own body tracking software.

You can read http://www.wired.co.uk/magazine/archive/2010/11/features/the-game-changer to find out more about what PrimeSense's role was with regards to the current Kinect hardware.



snakenobi on 04 January 2011
daroamer said:
snakenobi said:
AussieGecko said:
snakenobi said:
AussieGecko said:

I thought MS put a shite load of money into Kinect... how would this be allowed without MS having a bit of the profits?


they just licensed their tech

AND most of the moeny MS put into KINECT is marketing


Wasnt talking about market, I said the product itself

I know but what they are spending on marketing far outstrips what they have spent on kinect hardware itself

and the main tech is from primsense was already ready so MS just had to license it

I love how people always try to downplay Microsofts role in Kinect by saying "oh, they just bought it" when that's far from the truth.  A lot of the software that drives Kinect (including much of the skeletal recognition algorithms) was developed by Microsoft and much of it had been in development for many years before there was a "Project Natal".

Do you have any kind of source on what Microsoft spent on R&D for the device?

i didn't downplay anything

also i agree that MS did alot of the software but the main part is the detection part,the software part is also done by the game developers

 

and you don't know anything if you are saying it was in development by microsft many years before Project natal.



daroamer on 04 January 2011
snakenobi said:
daroamer said:
snakenobi said:
AussieGecko said:
snakenobi said:
AussieGecko said:

I thought MS put a shite load of money into Kinect... how would this be allowed without MS having a bit of the profits?


they just licensed their tech

AND most of the moeny MS put into KINECT is marketing


Wasnt talking about market, I said the product itself

I know but what they are spending on marketing far outstrips what they have spent on kinect hardware itself

and the main tech is from primsense was already ready so MS just had to license it

I love how people always try to downplay Microsofts role in Kinect by saying "oh, they just bought it" when that's far from the truth.  A lot of the software that drives Kinect (including much of the skeletal recognition algorithms) was developed by Microsoft and much of it had been in development for many years before there was a "Project Natal".

Do you have any kind of source on what Microsoft spent on R&D for the device?

i didn't downplay anything

also i agree that MS did alot of the software but the main part is the detection part,the software part is also done by the game developers

 

and you don't know anything if you are saying it was in development by microsft many years before Project natal.

"Most of the money Microsoft put into Kinect was marketing", that's not downplaying? Come on.

And I said much of the software inside Kinect was around before Project Natal started, which is true.  For example the speech recognition tech is based of the software that's been in Windows OSes for years.

From the article I linked to in the other post:

"Still, fragments of the solution did already seem in place. Microsoft Research's Beijing bureau had collected tomes on the successes (and failings) of facial-recognition technology. Redmond's speech-recognition software  --  which now ships in Windows 7 and the Ford Focus -- had already been in development for decades."

Kinect was about bringing various different technologies together to create a unique experience.  The PrimeSense depth camera, while obviously one of the biggest components in the system, is still only a part of the whole.  There are decades worth of research and technology in there, even if some of them weren't developed specifically for Kinect.



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snakenobi on 04 January 2011
daroamer said:

"Most of the money Microsoft put into Kinect was marketing", that's not downplaying? Come on.

And I said much of the software inside Kinect was around before Project Natal started, which is true.  For example the speech recognition tech is based of the software that's been in Windows OSes for years.

From the article I linked to in the other post:

"Still, fragments of the solution did already seem in place. Microsoft Research's Beijing bureau had collected tomes on the successes (and failings) of facial-recognition technology. Redmond's speech-recognition software  --  which now ships in Windows 7 and the Ford Focus -- had already been in development for decades."

Kinect was about bringing various different technologies together to create a unique experience.  The PrimeSense depth camera, while obviously one of the biggest components in the system, is still only a part of the whole.  There are decades worth of research and technology in there, even if some of them weren't developed specifically for Kinect.

speech recognition is from MS but it wasn't done for kinect(that isn't money poured into kinect,that is money poured into Windows)

again facial recognition(it wasn't Kinect's R&D but Windows R&d)

 

talk about what was put into kinect not windows.

 

and $500m marketing for kinect,that seems to be more than anything MS would do for kinect itself



daroamer on 04 January 2011
snakenobi said:
daroamer said:

"Most of the money Microsoft put into Kinect was marketing", that's not downplaying? Come on.

And I said much of the software inside Kinect was around before Project Natal started, which is true.  For example the speech recognition tech is based of the software that's been in Windows OSes for years.

From the article I linked to in the other post:

"Still, fragments of the solution did already seem in place. Microsoft Research's Beijing bureau had collected tomes on the successes (and failings) of facial-recognition technology. Redmond's speech-recognition software  --  which now ships in Windows 7 and the Ford Focus -- had already been in development for decades."

Kinect was about bringing various different technologies together to create a unique experience.  The PrimeSense depth camera, while obviously one of the biggest components in the system, is still only a part of the whole.  There are decades worth of research and technology in there, even if some of them weren't developed specifically for Kinect.

speech recognition is from MS but it wasn't done for kinect(that isn't money poured into kinect,that is money poured into Windows)

again facial recognition(it wasn't Kinect's R&D but Windows R&d)

 

talk about what was put into kinect not windows.

 

and $500m marketing for kinect,that seems to be more than anything MS would do for kinect itself

Over how many months/years?  The 500 million figure came from one sentence in newspaper article, I think the NY Post.  If the figure is accurate it will likely be allocated over a year or more.

It doesn't matter if research was done directly for Kinect or not, it was developed and paid for by Microsoft.  You can't say how much the total R&D for features developed BY MICROSOFT has gone into the unit.  Again, your original statement implied most of the tech was licensed from PrimeSense and all MS did was spend a boatload of money marketing it.



snakenobi on 05 January 2011
daroamer said:
snakenobi said:
daroamer said:

"Most of the money Microsoft put into Kinect was marketing", that's not downplaying? Come on.

And I said much of the software inside Kinect was around before Project Natal started, which is true.  For example the speech recognition tech is based of the software that's been in Windows OSes for years.

From the article I linked to in the other post:

"Still, fragments of the solution did already seem in place. Microsoft Research's Beijing bureau had collected tomes on the successes (and failings) of facial-recognition technology. Redmond's speech-recognition software  --  which now ships in Windows 7 and the Ford Focus -- had already been in development for decades."

Kinect was about bringing various different technologies together to create a unique experience.  The PrimeSense depth camera, while obviously one of the biggest components in the system, is still only a part of the whole.  There are decades worth of research and technology in there, even if some of them weren't developed specifically for Kinect.

speech recognition is from MS but it wasn't done for kinect(that isn't money poured into kinect,that is money poured into Windows)

again facial recognition(it wasn't Kinect's R&D but Windows R&d)

 

talk about what was put into kinect not windows.

 

and $500m marketing for kinect,that seems to be more than anything MS would do for kinect itself

Over how many months/years?  The 500 million figure came from one sentence in newspaper article, I think the NY Post.  If the figure is accurate it will likely be allocated over a year or more.

It doesn't matter if research was done directly for Kinect or not, it was developed and paid for by Microsoft.  You can't say how much the total R&D for features developed BY MICROSOFT has gone into the unit.  Again, your original statement implied most of the tech was licensed from PrimeSense and all MS did was spend a boatload of money marketing it.

i never said it will be allocated all at once so why do you even try to make a fight on itand it will used in a single year's time or less.if you follow business news,people don't go and say that we will spend this much for 2 years

 

again just to justify what you think you don't care whether it was done for kinect.Windows is MS's biggest weapon so they do a whole lot of things for it,you can't just go and say MS did this for Kinect.

yeah the main tech is aquired by primesense thats what my original statement was,you are taking is way off track.

 

keep a distance between opinion and truth



AussieGecko on 05 January 2011
snakenobi said:

i never said it will be allocated all at once so why do you even try to make a fight on itand it will used in a single year's time or less.if you follow business news,people don't go and say that we will spend this much for 2 years

 

again just to justify what you think you don't care whether it was done for kinect.Windows is MS's biggest weapon so they do a whole lot of things for it,you can't just go and say MS did this for Kinect.

yeah the main tech is aquired by primesense thats what my original statement was,you are taking is way off track.

 

keep a distance between opinion and truth


I love the bolded especially, read your own advice. Read any of squilliams response to the 500million dollar advertising amount then you will relent on that I would assume. Also you said it was going to be allocated for only Kinect, this has yet to be proven for all we know it could be for the whole Xbox360 as a whole.

You do realise that what he is saying that it wasnt solely done for Kinect but his point was that the tech was in the making. For whatever purpose. You disputed it... ahh it appears he would be right in this matter, yes no? choose one

The whole thing was in response to mine where I asked if MS should be asked about this, then you said the money was advertising. And I responded by saying I didnt ask about advertising but Kinect itself. So it appears I was right in the sense that MS had done a lot for it, but as thing will not be Kinect it won't really matter in the end of the day, so as long as they don't advertise it as such.

 



 

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snakenobi on 05 January 2011
AussieGecko said:


I love the bolded especially, read your own advice. Read any of squilliams response to the 500million dollar advertising amount then you will relent on that I would assume. Also you said it was going to be allocated for only Kinect, this has yet to be proven for all we know it could be for the whole Xbox360 as a whole.

You do realise that what he is saying that it wasnt solely done for Kinect but his point was that the tech was in the making. For whatever purpose. You disputed it... ahh it appears he would be right in this matter, yes no? choose one

The whole thing was in response to mine where I asked if MS should be asked about this, then you said the money was advertising. And I responded by saying I didnt ask about advertising but Kinect itself. So it appears I was right in the sense that MS had done a lot for it, but as thing will not be Kinect it won't really matter in the end of the day, so as long as they don't advertise it as such.

 

i never said it was only for kinect,please go back and follow my posts in this thread

i was just referring to the $500m geared towards making Kinect popular for xbox.it to change the branding like SONY did with PS3 slim.

just saying we don't know this we don't know that does nothing for you,you can keep saying that all your life to run away from things but we debate on what information we have got now

 

i understand what he is trying to say but he also means that MS was working towards kinect and that should be counted towards MS's contribution.

i am not taking the credit away from Microsoft,just saying that it wasn't done with kinect in mind.we can give the credit to microsft for the amazing tech but we shouldn't say that Kinect development was done for so many years before Project natal came in.

MS has done alot but main thing after they started working on project natal was done by Primesense tech and much older tech for windows developed by Microsoft.