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theprof00 said:

Additionally, Gnizmo, what you call "twisting your words" is simply "taking an assumption".

As in, ASSUMING you are mafia, you responded to Sivler-Tiger in defense of someone who is mafia in that list.

Now, before you object by saying something like I am slanting my view of the situation, or, I'm altering examples to suit my own view in some self-fulfilling prophecy, I will tell you this.

I do this with every single person, and it is an easily forgettable and retrainable thought process.

It is like looking at a maze on paper. To solve even the most difficult of mazes, pick a direction and hug the wall, when you run into a dead-end, you realize that that direction was not the correct one. So too do I look at you and choose a direction (read: alignment), I follow everything you say with that direction in mind and follow it until I find the dead-end.

However, it isn't a matter of simply assuming you're one thing. If I do that, then I am ignoring other potential solutions. No, I have to look at you in three different paths: Mafia, townie, power role. I re-read the thread several times, and take pokes and prods into little nooks of the maze to see if I can rule them out immediately.

I know this example may have been a little academic, I feel that making assumptions and seeing how they pan out is an important process of discovering motives, solutions, and relationships.

There are other ways to play, I know, but this is the one that I find "most fun".


So to sum up your last two page long posts.

"Gnizmo, you are being kind of vague. Can you clear up the vague language in x, y, and z? Makes you seem pretty scummy. I know it might not seem like much, but following the vagueness in claims has worked really well for me in the past."

Mixed in with some more inaccuracies regarding what my one line statement about my health meant which, by the by, is still off limits so far as I am concerned. I will indulge here since it seems only tangentially related, and I brought it back somewhat.

Does that explain what I mean by a lot of words to say very little? Hopefully so. I am a very verbose person myself, but cluttering it up with non-sense makes it harder to discern any real point in it. Combined with the fact that you start off with an assumption then spin it out into scenarios rather than start with an observation and build up your assumption/scenario leads to wasted words.



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

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Gnizmo said:
theprof00 said:

Additionally, Gnizmo, what you call "twisting your words" is simply "taking an assumption".


An assumption fills in blanks. You replace words to alter the meaning. That is not an assumption. That is twisting words.

Well, I see your point because I now realize that the first time you mention "twisting words" was when I substituted "post" with "I".

I had previously been under the impression that you were calling my inference of your "defending", a twist of words.



Gnizmo said:


So to sum up your last two page long posts.

"Gnizmo, you are being kind of vague. Can you clear up the vague language in x, y, and z? Makes you seem pretty scummy. I know it might not seem like much, but following the vagueness in claims has worked really well for me in the past."

Mixed in with some more inaccuracies regarding what my one line statement about my health meant which, by the by, is still off limits so far as I am concerned. I will indulge here since it seems only tangentially related, and I brought it back somewhat.

Does that explain what I mean by a lot of words to say very little? Hopefully so. I am a very verbose person myself, but cluttering it up with non-sense makes it harder to discern any real point in it. Combined with the fact that you start off with an assumption then spin it out into scenarios rather than start with an observation and build up your assumption/scenario leads to wasted words.

You're easy to misinterpret. What can I say?

There's nothing wrong with taking an assumption before observation. That is the basis of the scientific method.

Define a problem;
>Hypothesis;
>>Observation



Gnizmo said:

Linkzmax said:
I would think that a consistently non-sketchy playstyle would serve just as well to keep scum guessing as to whether you are a vanilla townie or a power role. Is it because players with suspicions on them generally live longer and this allows you to gather more info regardless of role?

Yes, absolutely. I am incapable of playing that way it seems though. I have tried it. I got lynched. One time I tried it I was the deputy and still the town lynched me. I just suck at looking innocent.

Sympathy 1 (as requested )



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
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I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

theprof00 said:

There's nothing wrong with taking an assumption before observation. That is the basis of the scientific method.

Define a problem;
>Hypothesis;
>>Observation

Except the scientific method revolves around trying to DISPROVE the hypothesis.  If you go around looking for stuff that fits the hypothesis, you won't see the stuff that doesn't fit.  If you do it the first way, fine, but it seems like you'd be throwing doubt on every idea you had.  If you work the second way, that would be really bad science, and as for mafia, I expect you'll get plenty of false positives. 



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

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nen-suer said:
Final-Fan said:
nen-suer said:
As for SAK while i agree with you it really annoy me that i know we are most likely lynching a townie
Unvote:
Vote: SAK

facepalm
I don't know if this is a sign of scum or just terrible playing. 

Planting more seeds for tomorrow >_>
Don't know if this is a sign of scum or a case of paranoia

I'm not sure what you mean by the seeds line: 
--If you are accusing me of deliberately planting a thought with the intention to go after you with it tomorrow, I would happily lynch you today. 
--If ... I don't even know, please tell me what else it could mean. 

I agree with prof and linkzmax:  Why do you think SAK is most likely town, and if you do think so, why are you voting him instead of defending him? 



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

Final-Fan said:
theprof00 said:

There's nothing wrong with taking an assumption before observation. That is the basis of the scientific method.

Define a problem;
>Hypothesis;
>>Observation

Except the scientific method revolves around trying to DISPROVE the hypothesis.  If you go around looking for stuff that fits the hypothesis, you won't see the stuff that doesn't fit.  If you do it the first way, fine, but it seems like you'd be throwing doubt on every idea you had.  If you work the second way, that would be really bad science, and as for mafia, I expect you'll get plenty of false positives. 

I look for the stuff that doesn't fit, which is why I trust you and all of those other players that I thought gniz was "defending". I've cleared several players in my eyes.

Either way, I see your point, but I'm starting to get a headache from people telling me that my thought process is wrong. I believe what I believe and I have further evidence that I'm not willing to yet share, (more post behavior, etc etc).

It's like people keep coming up to me saying, "but if you think this, then you'll get tricked and fooled".

Don't you people think I know that? I'm not retarded...



Happy Christmas all :) I probably won't be around much tomorrow either - Boxing Day is basically Christmas part-2



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~~~~ Mario Kart 8 drove far past my expectations! Never again will I doubt the wheels of a Monster Franchise! :0 ~~~~

Merry Christmas all. Don't have time to make an informed vote today, so I'm just popping in really



Merry christmas and all, I'll defend my self later tommorow, as I was not expecting this backlash because I made an uninformed post and the dead man tells tales thing the lot of you are picking up now. 

Just letting you guys know for now that I havn't vanished from the face of the world, yet! ^^

Now, if you manage to find this post scummy, then all hope is lost, for me!