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Linkzmax on 08 January 2011

hatmoza said:

I'm just not ready to believe he's town yet yet, I'm sorry, but his big gigantic parrot post followed by his pursuit to paint me as scum ever since is the most suspicious thing I've seen all game.

How do you find scum? Mainly from their posts. The more posts, the more they share their thoughts. For us to be  the more we can find contradictions, slips, and suspicions. If you focus all your attention on one thing for a long period of time, the less people are going to have on you. Which is basically what Wonk has gotten away with for so long. Even now, As I catch up on the game, he yet uses all my  posts ( recent before today) against me...

And you, Linkz, are the only person to really acknowledge him, which I can't help but admire you for because I almost feel sorry for him. The way he clinged on you and thanked you afterwords was pathetic, and I honestly don't see how anyone or yourself mentioned how desperate that was ... unless you were really desperate to keep this game active?

The second paragraph is just one of many baseless accusations Wonk has thrown at me. I really really don't feel like reading back into the thread, but I'm sure I can debunk many of the accusations you find interesting against me.

That goes to everyone. Questions? Ask. Tomorrow I promise I'll be back to contribute and not just defend myself. I'm back home and I'm back at work so I should be online for hours tomorrow.

I didn't mean to imply that I think he's town. I was pretty neutral with Wonk.

I said quite a while ago that I wanted to look into you and Wonk, but at the time I still had to take another look at prof and Gniz. With things dying down so much I was trying quite hard to keep the game active. I was responding to nearly everyone, and without having to spend so much time just catching up I did take a glance back. I wasn't nearly as thorough as the p/G recap and so I missed some things, but like I've said I'm not really focused on either of you. I'm keeping my eyes open for things that jump out, but not assuming either of you are scum and seeing how things fit given that.



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Wonktonodi on 08 January 2011
hatmoza said:
Wonktonodi said:
hatmoza said:
Linkzmax said:

The "200 posts later" is certainly hyperbole, but it really doesn't make sense given the posts were fairly close to each other, both in number and in time. I can't imagine why hat would try to create the idea of a significant gap like that.

 

And I think you have points in the third link that they deserved a response from hat. Some of it is trivial, and some self-defense, but overall at the very least it should have prompted a "nice try, but you're still scum."


exaggerating? I'm pretty sure the post count between my argument with zex and that post was well over a hundred posts. 

I believe I answered all of his questions fairly. They included stuff like the "math fail joke" and "me and nordlead always do this" they're quite long responses before I got sick of the same questions and realized my lynch wagon on Wonk wasn't going anywhere.

I'll remember, or try to remember to pull them up. And as you said, most of those questions are trivial anyway, a sign of grasping at straws.


It was 2 posts latter that you first responed to zex with the numbers with pleanty more after so hardly the 200 you said before or the 100 you say now. If comenting on how you distance yourself from something with information that false and then even when called out on it continue to say such things then you and I have very different notions of grasping at straws.

 

 

I said well over 100, not 100.

A mafia player really can't be this stupid... If you are town; dear lord at your drop of play since your last game.

By the way, Linkz confirmed it was actually over 200 posts.

Linkzmax said:

As for the 200 posts thing. It does seem like you're talking about the original argument over the numbers(page 1 by 100) and this one(page 4 by 100). You did have some posts on page 2 relating to the numbers, but I'd now agree that it wasn't an exaggeration. I was going by Wonk's point that you responded(to the original point) two posts later. So I apologize for that and though I didn't think much of it since it didn't make sense to do, it's absolutely stricken as any kind of evidence. The argument itself could still be up for debate, but so much has happened since then that there has to be more for a convincing case.

Then what is the point of your original 200 coment?  I was suspicious of you for keeping the numbers discussion going and your defense is that you didn't go after zexen for it till 200 posts latter? I mean what kind of defence is that?  If it was about you being inthe debate is wrong and if it's about your post going after zex it's serves no purpose and isn't a defence at all.



Linkzmax on 08 January 2011
Stefl1504 said:

So.. how has your opinion changed now that MG surely turned out to be Mafia... and if I am correct this bolded 'he' reffers to SAK, my suspect of the day... what if they realy have been trying to get the lynchtrain on the rails onto nen... whats your thought about that...

I'm not sure yet. I know MG hasn't said a whole lot, but I'm going to have to go back and see if there's anything in the thread.

It's certainly a possibility, but I don't recall nen being onto MG before MG tried to raise suspicion on nen. So I don't think that fits the "methods of killing" or whatever. Maybe SAK is scum though and MG was trying to change today's target since SAK was second in line day two. nen was third-most suspicious yesterday, so that would fit.

But then again nen was also sure ST and Wonk were scum, and now ST is a confirmed townie.

I'm still suspicious of you, but a SAK lynch would be extremely telling now. I'm going to hold off on the switch until the reread though.



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Wonktonodi on 08 January 2011
c03n3nj0 said:

You know, hatmoza is moss probably going to be modkilled soon, unless he decides to post. 

This will... this will pretty much answer your entire point, depending on what he comes up as.  


He's active now so the modkill is unlikely what are your thoughts?



Linkzmax on 08 January 2011
Wonktonodi said:

Then what is the point of your original 200 coment?  I was suspicious of you for keeping the numbers discussion going and your defense is that you didn't go after zexen for it till 200 posts latter? I mean what kind of defence is that?  If it was about you being inthe debate is wrong and if it's about your post going after zex it's serves no purpose and isn't a defence at all.

hat: "Then you squeeze that  flag raising stunt about ME  prolonging an argument I didn't even respond to until 200 posts later in the game when I wasn't even arguing about it, just using it as as a means  to support my SK theory. And the way you snuck that fos in the middle of repeated observation was really sneaky Wonk."

Look back at the posts I provided. hat isn't denying he was part of the numbers argument. He is saying that since he dropped it,(as in no longer prolonging it) the post about zex/SK was 200 posts later.

myself:"The argument itself could still be up for debate, but so much has happened since then that there has to be more for a convincing case."

If you're going to attack on grounds that hat dragged out the argument you're going to have to show that's true. IMO the whole thing as far as hat is concerned went down within an hour of zex's post. There are a few comments on page 2(by 100); however, similar to the page 4 SK thing are more about other aspects even if it's based on 'how many mafia are there?'

 

@SAK
I find it odd that you might be asking for a modkill. Either you post or die basically.
I do appreciate the notice that you're busy though. Everyone seems to be, but it's nice that you're not one of the guys that just disappears without a word.

@ST
First, good luck with the girl. RL certainly is far more important than internet, but jeez you were posting all over the place instead of here! Finally, good luck with the girl. :)

@Gnizmo
Another thank you for the notice. Obviously it's noname's decision, but I for one don't have a problem with keeping people around if they give a date they can be active by. Now if it's something you can't commit to then in the interest of keeping the game moving, a modkill probably is for the best. Good luck with the home life stuff.

@noname/theRepublic
This is nitpicky, but with 14 players left shouldn't it be 8 votes to lynch? When we went down to 20 after GoW's modkill it was still 11 to lynch as a reference.



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Wonktonodi on 08 January 2011

What's the count of active players? We have 2 more that might want out SAK and GNIZ.  WE have ZEX out of town for a while and NORD has been sick.  Kantor just joined but really should start saying something soon. So out of 14 of us that's around 9 participating.  That leaves too much of a chance that scum could have big sway. I don't like the game going on forever but I think it might be a little too soon for a time limit.  I'm not saying wait till everyone is back but at least till we might know more on potential mod kills.



Wonktonodi on 08 January 2011
Linkzmax said:
Wonktonodi said:

Then what is the point of your original 200 coment?  I was suspicious of you for keeping the numbers discussion going and your defense is that you didn't go after zexen for it till 200 posts latter? I mean what kind of defence is that?  If it was about you being inthe debate is wrong and if it's about your post going after zex it's serves no purpose and isn't a defence at all.

hat: "Then you squeeze that  flag raising stunt about ME  prolonging an argument I didn't even respond to until 200 posts later in the game when I wasn't even arguing about it, just using it as as a means  to support my SK theory. And the way you snuck that fos in the middle of repeated observation was really sneaky Wonk."

Look back at the posts I provided. hat isn't denying he was part of the numbers argument. He is saying that since he dropped it,(as in no longer prolonging it) the post about zex/SK was 200 posts later.

myself:"The argument itself could still be up for debate, but so much has happened since then that there has to be more for a convincing case."

If you're going to attack on grounds that hat dragged out the argument you're going to have to show that's true. IMO the whole thing as far as hat is concerned went down within an hour of zex's post. There are a few comments on page 2(by 100); however, similar to the page 4 SK thing are more about other aspects even if it's based on 'how many mafia are there?'

 

I think I got to fucsed on hat bringing up the numbers part and didn't think about the SK part.  It seemed hypocritical to be so suspicios zex and call it a ridiculous debate about numbers he had been such a key part in, but it was more about zex not being willing to think that a SK could be a vanilla role. 

So the 200 post latter was him reffering to something different from what I was reffering to not an outright lie to distance himself from it. 

UNVOTE HAT



Wonktonodi on 08 January 2011
SuperAdrianK said:

I'm not sure how you can say theres a connenction with me and mg, because, he barely made any connections besides the fact that I said that every time hes been mafia (even though he said once he's been mafia), he plays like that, and then suspects me for saying it (now, I know the concept of mafia throwing each other out, thing is I'm not mafia, so its an entirely different story.)

I'm going to be looking into this discussion about hat and wonk, need to reread it to understand whats going on and stuff. ...>_>

ps.I might request for a mod kill due to unsuspecting circumstances and to much studying going on so just going to leave that out there. This isn't an excuse to why I'm not focused and particapting as much as I would in the game.

If you could decide sooner than latter that would be very helpful.  You are next on my list of people I would like to look at and if you just are just going to leave I'd really rather not waste the effort.



Linkzmax on 08 January 2011

MG recap:
Suspicious of SAK - Could be "bussing" or just a set-up
Possible defense of FF to Heph - I have to wonder why MG would point this out if FF is a townie
hat/Zex SK "interesting" - Could be a roundabout defense of Zex
Take on Heph's death - I'm inclined to believe MG was trying to steer town in the wrong direction(Heph's suspects)
Reason for scottie vote / Stefl response / MG clarification - Part of why my vote is on Stefl now, and with MG flipping scum I find the being defensive even more suspicious
Suspicious of nen - See first link above

Quotes of MG:
Stefl's response to Heph's death - Makes a similar list to Truck's, but only after MG mentions it
radish on MG's scottie vote - Very interesting. Defense of MG and a push for scottie
I call MG a hypocrite - Seems I was right. It's too bad scottie couldn't handle the accusations.
radish on MG's list of previous lurker mafia - Couple of oddities here. Implies radish isn't mafia because he'd have pushed scottie to talk more. Also, somewhat conflicts with his vote because that points to scottie can't be scum because teammates would've helped him.

MG mentions:
j0's list - 'MG has short posts'
Stefl agrees - 'with most people, MG and nen [are suspicious]'
made GNiz's list - for 'posting for the sake of saying they posted'
Stefl FoS's MG
Gniz lists - MG as being sketchy
prof - gives a possible tie with other mafia through truck(3rd paragraph)
nen - Already mentioned recently, but implies a relationship between MG and SAK

Everything else is post-modkill.

 

At the moment, I'm sticking with my vote for Stefl as I have a feeling that both SAK and nen were being set up for future mislynches. Radish and FF have risen on my radar. I'll look more into them soon.



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Wonktonodi on 08 January 2011
Linkzmax said:

MG recap:
Suspicious of SAK - Could be "bussing" or just a set-up
Possible defense of FF to Heph - I have to wonder why MG would point this out if FF is a townie
hat/Zex SK "interesting" - Could be a roundabout defense of Zex
Take on Heph's death - I'm inclined to believe MG was trying to steer town in the wrong direction(Heph's suspects)
Reason for scottie vote / Stefl response / MG clarification - Part of why my vote is on Stefl now, and with MG flipping scum I find the being defensive even more suspicious
Suspicious of nen - See first link above

Quotes of MG:
Stefl's response to Heph's death - Makes a similar list to Truck's, but only after MG mentions it
radish on MG's scottie vote - Very interesting. Defense of MG and a push for scottie
I call MG a hypocrite - Seems I was right. It's too bad scottie couldn't handle the accusations.
radish on MG's list of previous lurker mafia - Couple of oddities here. Implies radish isn't mafia because he'd have pushed scottie to talk more. Also, somewhat conflicts with his vote because that points to scottie can't be scum because teammates would've helped him.

MG mentions:
j0's list - 'MG has short posts'
Stefl agrees - 'with most people, MG and nen [are suspicious]'
made GNiz's list - for 'posting for the sake of saying they posted'
Stefl FoS's MG
Gniz lists - MG as being sketchy
prof - gives a possible tie with other mafia through truck(3rd paragraph)
nen - Already mentioned recently, but implies a relationship between MG and SAK

Everything else is post-modkill.

 

At the moment, I'm sticking with my vote for Stefl as I have a feeling that both SAK and nen were being set up for future mislynches. Radish and FF have risen on my radar. I'll look more into them soon.


I'm thinking that SAK was saved by mafia going after Scottie, however Scottie mostly got himself lynched by his own replys and the timing of them.  What are your thoutghs on nord then for being IIRC the one who started the votes on SAK?