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Forums - General - What % of tax revenues should the rich (top 5%) pay?

It needs to be raised to at least 50%.



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40%

depending on what things government is wasting money on



rocketpig said:

I used to scream "flat tax! flat tax!" but it's just not a reasonable stance. With the wealthiest 1% controlling more and more of America every year, it's gone completely out of control. The gap between even the middle class and the wealthiest Americans is red shifting far more than it ever should.

When 5% of Americans own nearly 2/3rds of our wealth, something isn't right with this country. It's gone from "work hard and you'll succeed" to "put yourself further in debt every year to maintain an equivalent lifestyle to your parents".

OT: if they earn 33% of all income, they should probably be paying somewhere around 66% of all taxes. They're making all that money on the backs of the American public. Giving some of it back to maintain the infrastructure that supports them won't kill their pocketbooks.

With that said, the entire government structure should be aggressively sliced down so EVERYBODY pays less in taxes.

Or you could just switch to a flat wealth tax.

Though that'd probably impact growth and investment.

Really though, the rich getting richer is something you can only slow and never stop.   No matter how progressive the taxation. (outside of like... 95%).

The rich drive the economic growth, and if they aren't going to get the lionshare of those riches, are they really going to risk so much for so little?

When you look at it, practically every countries gini coefficent is growing.

 

Outside of like China anyway.

Edit: No, wait... looks like their Ginicoefficent is rising too... go figure.  Even in a controlled economy it doesn't work.



Hrm... personally, I'm a fan of a huge simplification of the system. This is what I would do:

-Remove all deductions. There are way too many loopholes here. No bonuses for people who pop out kids and live on welfare. The only thing that can remain is single vs "partnered" (married needs to be removed for same-sex couples), in which case, all numbers except for percentages are doubled.

-Create a simple tax ladder, of the following:

  • $0-$36,000: Not taxed. (Up to $3000/month is tax-free.)
  • $36,001-$120,000: 20% in excess of $36,000. (Up to $10,000/month covers all middle classes.)
  • $120,001-$480,000: $16,800, plus 35% of excess of $120,000.
  • $480,001-$1,000,000: $142,800, plus 45% of excess of $480,000.
  • >$1,000,000: $376,800, plus 55% of excess of $1,000,000.

-Impose a penalty on those found to be using an overseas tax shelter. Money recovered from a tax shelter is to be taxed at the rate of 98%.

-Money put into a retirement plan IS taxed at entry, however, upon qualified retirement, any interest earned is NOT taxable. As taxes were paid at entry, this can be accessed without taxation if eligible. Interest is added to one's personal earnings if there is an early withdrawal. (Thus, this can also be tapped in an economic crisis, where someone just got laid off and needs to pay their bills.)



-dunno001

-On a quest for the truly perfect game; I don't think it exists...

rocketpig said:

I used to scream "flat tax! flat tax!" but it's just not a reasonable stance. With the wealthiest 1% controlling more and more of America every year, it's gone completely out of control. The gap between even the middle class and the wealthiest Americans is red shifting far more than it ever should.

When 5% of Americans own nearly 2/3rds of our wealth, something isn't right with this country. It's gone from "work hard and you'll succeed" to "put yourself further in debt every year to maintain an equivalent lifestyle to your parents".

OT: if they earn 33% of all income, they should probably be paying somewhere around 66% of all taxes. They're making all that money on the backs of the American public. Giving some of it back to maintain the infrastructure that supports them won't kill their pocketbooks.

With that said, the entire government structure should be aggressively sliced down so EVERYBODY pays less in taxes.

There are two (main) reasons why the "rich" are getting further ahead while the "poor" are falling further behind, and neither is that the "rich" pay too little taxes ...

First and foremost, the government is being run to benefit large corporations and unions; and this is coming at the expense of small business and individuals. I could go into detail on this, but (essentially) the problem is that the tax code, regulations, oversight, and government grants are mostly set up to give large corporations a massive advantage over the small business man.

Secondly, for the past several decades inflation has been under-reported and the higher your income is the more likely you were able to get a raise at the real rate of inflation; while poorer individuals tended to have difficulty getting raises that matched the reported rate of inflation. A 1% or 2% discrepancy may not seem like that much, but compounded over 20 or 30 years it makes a massive difference.

 



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rocketpig said:
Zlejedi said:

Everyone should pay the same tax rate. People shouldn't be punished by system because they are smart enough to earn more.

Unless that system is artificially maintaining a work force that is underpaid, under-insured, and generally bankrupt compared to previous generations.

That's what socialist were saying in early 20th century.

Somehow their solution to it created poverty on unmatched scale never seen in capitalistic countries with their "unfair" systems.



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Soleron said:

Currently the problem isn't the rate but the fact that high earners pay good accountants to transfer income around so the actual amount paid is MUCH less than it should be.


They know all the loopholes. Meanwhile, the rest of the world pay full tax.

Maybe tax should be based on wealth, rather than income. That'll probably push people to spend instead of stuffing in the banks.



Galaki said:
Soleron said:

Currently the problem isn't the rate but the fact that high earners pay good accountants to transfer income around so the actual amount paid is MUCH less than it should be.


They know all the loopholes. Meanwhile, the rest of the world pay full tax.

Maybe tax should be based on wealth, rather than income. That'll probably push people to spend instead of stuffing in the banks.

And that's another reason for flat tax rate without any loopholes to exploit.

Not to mention huge reduction in amount of people needed to keep and check tax system from the goverment side.



PROUD MEMBER OF THE PSP RPG FAN CLUB

Quite a lot depending on the income.

Something like all income under $15k tax free

all income between $15k and $30k at 20% tax

$30k and $50k at 30% tax

$50k and $90k at 40% tax

$90k and $150k at 50% tax

over $150k and 60% tax

 

So the very top earners are paying 60%. I don't know what it currently is however.



Zlejedi said:
Galaki said:
Soleron said:

Currently the problem isn't the rate but the fact that high earners pay good accountants to transfer income around so the actual amount paid is MUCH less than it should be.


They know all the loopholes. Meanwhile, the rest of the world pay full tax.

Maybe tax should be based on wealth, rather than income. That'll probably push people to spend instead of stuffing in the banks.

And that's another reason for flat tax rate without any loopholes to exploit.

Not to mention huge reduction in amount of people needed to keep and check tax system from the goverment side.

I've always thought that the tax system is there to scam unaware/lazy people. (I am one of the lazy ones)

You'd actually have to dig into the rules and all that mumble jumble and exploit it. I hate tax returns.