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Forums - Microsoft - Sony: Kinect is a bunch of tech problems

welshbloke on 12 February 2011

You forgot one; 8 million kinect sales and rising, I guess like Sony and its view on whether the product was ready the public did not give a rats arse about your selected Technical criteria either.

   

W.L.B.B. Member, Portsmouth Branch.

(Welsh(Folk) Living Beyond Borders)

Winner of the 2010 VGC Holiday sales prediction thread with an Average 1.6% accuracy rating. I am indeed awesome.

Kinect as seen by PS3 owners ...if you can pick at it   ...post it ... Did I mention the 360 was black and Shinny? Keeping Sigs obscure since 2007, Passed by the Sig police 5July10.
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osamanobama on 12 February 2011
MikeB said:

It's true, quoting myself from a couple of months before Kinect launched:

"The IMO top three biggest problems with Kinect is:

1) A very noticeable response lag. This kills the potential of fast paced accurate gaming. In part this is due to the too slow camera and in part due to the additional processing going on taking too much time.

2) No analog stick/buttons or triggers. It can't recognize seperate fingers, so even pretending you are pulling an imaginary trigger on an imaginary gun won't work (which IMO would be ackward anyway, holding nothing and pretending). Also look at the Starwars game under development, you can't rotate your view nor manually walk this while lightsaber slashes display notieable lag...

3) The camera is IMO far too big and ugly and pretty expensive for what you get.

Technical specifications Playstation Eye vs Kinect cameras:

Kinect in addition to normal camera also includes an infrared camera, which could allow it to do better in different light situations, but likely not in the case of Playstation Eye Playstation Move cases for most games.

Horizontal field of view:

Kinect: 57 degrees
Playstation Eye: 75 degrees

Vertical field of view:

Kinect: 43 degrees
Playstation Eye: 56 degrees

With 16 bit color depth:

Kinect: 320 x 240 @ 30 FPS
Playstation Eye: 320 x 240 @ 120 FPS

With 32 bit color depth:

Kinect: - (not supported)
Playstation Eye: 640 x 480 @ 60 FPS

Audio:

Kinect: 16 bit audio @ 16 kHz
Playstation Eye: 16 bit audio @ 48 kHz"

I tried to warn people, but many were just too hyped (like for the fake Milo demo). I find Kinect to be pretty destructive for hardcore gaming on the XBox. Half of the XBox game shelf space here is now dedicated to predominantly crappy Kinect-only games.

I also mentioned the additional resource requirement compared to Move and I find his comments interesting that he just like me thinks Kinect is mostly usefull for dancing/exercises games/programs, that's exactly what I once wrote. IMO don't expect much hardcore game support for Kinect, unlike for Playstation Move.

very insitefull, and when you factor in the Move....

i dont understand have the kinect has been so hugely successful, and probably has double the move install base (individual owners).

you simply cant play more complecated games than pet the tiger, and heavily assisted air driving, with peddels.

not saying those games cant be fun, but they just dont have much depth to them, and arent for a lack of a better word, hardcore



Edgeoflife on 13 February 2011
osamanobama said:
MikeB said:

It's true, quoting myself from a couple of months before Kinect launched:

"The IMO top three biggest problems with Kinect is:

1) A very noticeable response lag. This kills the potential of fast paced accurate gaming. In part this is due to the too slow camera and in part due to the additional processing going on taking too much time.

2) No analog stick/buttons or triggers. It can't recognize seperate fingers, so even pretending you are pulling an imaginary trigger on an imaginary gun won't work (which IMO would be ackward anyway, holding nothing and pretending). Also look at the Starwars game under development, you can't rotate your view nor manually walk this while lightsaber slashes display notieable lag...

3) The camera is IMO far too big and ugly and pretty expensive for what you get.

Technical specifications Playstation Eye vs Kinect cameras:

Kinect in addition to normal camera also includes an infrared camera, which could allow it to do better in different light situations, but likely not in the case of Playstation Eye Playstation Move cases for most games.

Horizontal field of view:

Kinect: 57 degrees
Playstation Eye: 75 degrees

Vertical field of view:

Kinect: 43 degrees
Playstation Eye: 56 degrees

With 16 bit color depth:

Kinect: 320 x 240 @ 30 FPS
Playstation Eye: 320 x 240 @ 120 FPS

With 32 bit color depth:

Kinect: - (not supported)
Playstation Eye: 640 x 480 @ 60 FPS

Audio:

Kinect: 16 bit audio @ 16 kHz
Playstation Eye: 16 bit audio @ 48 kHz"

I tried to warn people, but many were just too hyped (like for the fake Milo demo). I find Kinect to be pretty destructive for hardcore gaming on the XBox. Half of the XBox game shelf space here is now dedicated to predominantly crappy Kinect-only games.

I also mentioned the additional resource requirement compared to Move and I find his comments interesting that he just like me thinks Kinect is mostly usefull for dancing/exercises games/programs, that's exactly what I once wrote. IMO don't expect much hardcore game support for Kinect, unlike for Playstation Move.

very insitefull, and when you factor in the Move....

i dont understand have the kinect has been so hugely successful, and probably has double the move install base (individual owners).

you simply cant play more complecated games than pet the tiger, and heavily assisted air driving, with peddels.

not saying those games cant be fun, but they just dont have much depth to them, and arent for a lack of a better word, hardcore

Kinect sucess is due to marketing and consumer perception almost exclusively, after the holidays it had a huge drop in sales, and I think it will continue dropping the longer it is out



osamanobama on 13 February 2011
Edgeoflife said:
osamanobama said:
MikeB said:

It's true, quoting myself from a couple of months before Kinect launched:

"The IMO top three biggest problems with Kinect is:

1) A very noticeable response lag. This kills the potential of fast paced accurate gaming. In part this is due to the too slow camera and in part due to the additional processing going on taking too much time.

2) No analog stick/buttons or triggers. It can't recognize seperate fingers, so even pretending you are pulling an imaginary trigger on an imaginary gun won't work (which IMO would be ackward anyway, holding nothing and pretending). Also look at the Starwars game under development, you can't rotate your view nor manually walk this while lightsaber slashes display notieable lag...

3) The camera is IMO far too big and ugly and pretty expensive for what you get.

Technical specifications Playstation Eye vs Kinect cameras:

Kinect in addition to normal camera also includes an infrared camera, which could allow it to do better in different light situations, but likely not in the case of Playstation Eye Playstation Move cases for most games.

Horizontal field of view:

Kinect: 57 degrees
Playstation Eye: 75 degrees

Vertical field of view:

Kinect: 43 degrees
Playstation Eye: 56 degrees

With 16 bit color depth:

Kinect: 320 x 240 @ 30 FPS
Playstation Eye: 320 x 240 @ 120 FPS

With 32 bit color depth:

Kinect: - (not supported)
Playstation Eye: 640 x 480 @ 60 FPS

Audio:

Kinect: 16 bit audio @ 16 kHz
Playstation Eye: 16 bit audio @ 48 kHz"

I tried to warn people, but many were just too hyped (like for the fake Milo demo). I find Kinect to be pretty destructive for hardcore gaming on the XBox. Half of the XBox game shelf space here is now dedicated to predominantly crappy Kinect-only games.

I also mentioned the additional resource requirement compared to Move and I find his comments interesting that he just like me thinks Kinect is mostly usefull for dancing/exercises games/programs, that's exactly what I once wrote. IMO don't expect much hardcore game support for Kinect, unlike for Playstation Move.

very insitefull, and when you factor in the Move....

i dont understand have the kinect has been so hugely successful, and probably has double the move install base (individual owners).

you simply cant play more complecated games than pet the tiger, and heavily assisted air driving, with peddels.

not saying those games cant be fun, but they just dont have much depth to them, and arent for a lack of a better word, hardcore

Kinect sucess is due to marketing and consumer perception almost exclusively, after the holidays it had a huge drop in sales, and I think it will continue dropping the longer it is out

but its still selling like crazy, and kinect advantures is always top 3 sold per week (its already sold more than 8 million, thats insane, sports champions will be luck to get that lifetime) also kinect is more expensive and the games cost more.

and its pretty limited iin the types of games and genres it can do



Edgeoflife on 13 February 2011
osamanobama said:
Edgeoflife said:
osamanobama said:
MikeB said:

It's true, quoting myself from a couple of months before Kinect launched:

"The IMO top three biggest problems with Kinect is:

1) A very noticeable response lag. This kills the potential of fast paced accurate gaming. In part this is due to the too slow camera and in part due to the additional processing going on taking too much time.

2) No analog stick/buttons or triggers. It can't recognize seperate fingers, so even pretending you are pulling an imaginary trigger on an imaginary gun won't work (which IMO would be ackward anyway, holding nothing and pretending). Also look at the Starwars game under development, you can't rotate your view nor manually walk this while lightsaber slashes display notieable lag...

3) The camera is IMO far too big and ugly and pretty expensive for what you get.

Technical specifications Playstation Eye vs Kinect cameras:

Kinect in addition to normal camera also includes an infrared camera, which could allow it to do better in different light situations, but likely not in the case of Playstation Eye Playstation Move cases for most games.

Horizontal field of view:

Kinect: 57 degrees
Playstation Eye: 75 degrees

Vertical field of view:

Kinect: 43 degrees
Playstation Eye: 56 degrees

With 16 bit color depth:

Kinect: 320 x 240 @ 30 FPS
Playstation Eye: 320 x 240 @ 120 FPS

With 32 bit color depth:

Kinect: - (not supported)
Playstation Eye: 640 x 480 @ 60 FPS

Audio:

Kinect: 16 bit audio @ 16 kHz
Playstation Eye: 16 bit audio @ 48 kHz"

I tried to warn people, but many were just too hyped (like for the fake Milo demo). I find Kinect to be pretty destructive for hardcore gaming on the XBox. Half of the XBox game shelf space here is now dedicated to predominantly crappy Kinect-only games.

I also mentioned the additional resource requirement compared to Move and I find his comments interesting that he just like me thinks Kinect is mostly usefull for dancing/exercises games/programs, that's exactly what I once wrote. IMO don't expect much hardcore game support for Kinect, unlike for Playstation Move.

very insitefull, and when you factor in the Move....

i dont understand have the kinect has been so hugely successful, and probably has double the move install base (individual owners).

you simply cant play more complecated games than pet the tiger, and heavily assisted air driving, with peddels.

not saying those games cant be fun, but they just dont have much depth to them, and arent for a lack of a better word, hardcore

Kinect sucess is due to marketing and consumer perception almost exclusively, after the holidays it had a huge drop in sales, and I think it will continue dropping the longer it is out

but its still selling like crazy, and kinect advantures is always top 3 sold per week (its already sold more than 8 million, thats insane, sports champions will be luck to get that lifetime) also kinect is more expensive and the games cost more.

and its pretty limited iin the types of games and genres it can do

http://gamrreview.vgchartz.com/sales/45608/kinect-adventures/

look at the graph, the second the holidays were over the thing dropped in sales massively and the sales continue to drop, and frankly I don't see them ever getting the sales anywhere near to where they were even with a price drop 



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osamanobama on 13 February 2011
Edgeoflife said:
osamanobama said:
Edgeoflife said:
osamanobama said:
MikeB said:

It's true, quoting myself from a couple of months before Kinect launched:

"The IMO top three biggest problems with Kinect is:

1) A very noticeable response lag. This kills the potential of fast paced accurate gaming. In part this is due to the too slow camera and in part due to the additional processing going on taking too much time.

2) No analog stick/buttons or triggers. It can't recognize seperate fingers, so even pretending you are pulling an imaginary trigger on an imaginary gun won't work (which IMO would be ackward anyway, holding nothing and pretending). Also look at the Starwars game under development, you can't rotate your view nor manually walk this while lightsaber slashes display notieable lag...

3) The camera is IMO far too big and ugly and pretty expensive for what you get.

Technical specifications Playstation Eye vs Kinect cameras:

Kinect in addition to normal camera also includes an infrared camera, which could allow it to do better in different light situations, but likely not in the case of Playstation Eye Playstation Move cases for most games.

Horizontal field of view:

Kinect: 57 degrees
Playstation Eye: 75 degrees

Vertical field of view:

Kinect: 43 degrees
Playstation Eye: 56 degrees

With 16 bit color depth:

Kinect: 320 x 240 @ 30 FPS
Playstation Eye: 320 x 240 @ 120 FPS

With 32 bit color depth:

Kinect: - (not supported)
Playstation Eye: 640 x 480 @ 60 FPS

Audio:

Kinect: 16 bit audio @ 16 kHz
Playstation Eye: 16 bit audio @ 48 kHz"

I tried to warn people, but many were just too hyped (like for the fake Milo demo). I find Kinect to be pretty destructive for hardcore gaming on the XBox. Half of the XBox game shelf space here is now dedicated to predominantly crappy Kinect-only games.

I also mentioned the additional resource requirement compared to Move and I find his comments interesting that he just like me thinks Kinect is mostly usefull for dancing/exercises games/programs, that's exactly what I once wrote. IMO don't expect much hardcore game support for Kinect, unlike for Playstation Move.

very insitefull, and when you factor in the Move....

i dont understand have the kinect has been so hugely successful, and probably has double the move install base (individual owners).

you simply cant play more complecated games than pet the tiger, and heavily assisted air driving, with peddels.

not saying those games cant be fun, but they just dont have much depth to them, and arent for a lack of a better word, hardcore

Kinect sucess is due to marketing and consumer perception almost exclusively, after the holidays it had a huge drop in sales, and I think it will continue dropping the longer it is out

but its still selling like crazy, and kinect advantures is always top 3 sold per week (its already sold more than 8 million, thats insane, sports champions will be luck to get that lifetime) also kinect is more expensive and the games cost more.

and its pretty limited iin the types of games and genres it can do

http://gamrreview.vgchartz.com/sales/45608/kinect-adventures/

look at the graph, the second the holidays were over the thing dropped in sales massively and the sales continue to drop, and frankly I don't see them ever getting the sales anywhere near to where they were even with a price drop 

it still sells a ton.

gosh dangit, whats up with Americans (i am american) flocking to kinect and xbox 360 for that matter and buying it in droves, but not Move and ps3. i dont get it, its agravating



Oblivion86 on 13 February 2011
osamanobama said:
Edgeoflife said:
osamanobama said:
Edgeoflife said:
osamanobama said:
MikeB said:

It's true, quoting myself from a couple of months before Kinect launched:

"The IMO top three biggest problems with Kinect is:

1) A very noticeable response lag. This kills the potential of fast paced accurate gaming. In part this is due to the too slow camera and in part due to the additional processing going on taking too much time.

2) No analog stick/buttons or triggers. It can't recognize seperate fingers, so even pretending you are pulling an imaginary trigger on an imaginary gun won't work (which IMO would be ackward anyway, holding nothing and pretending). Also look at the Starwars game under development, you can't rotate your view nor manually walk this while lightsaber slashes display notieable lag...

3) The camera is IMO far too big and ugly and pretty expensive for what you get.

Technical specifications Playstation Eye vs Kinect cameras:

Kinect in addition to normal camera also includes an infrared camera, which could allow it to do better in different light situations, but likely not in the case of Playstation Eye Playstation Move cases for most games.

Horizontal field of view:

Kinect: 57 degrees
Playstation Eye: 75 degrees

Vertical field of view:

Kinect: 43 degrees
Playstation Eye: 56 degrees

With 16 bit color depth:

Kinect: 320 x 240 @ 30 FPS
Playstation Eye: 320 x 240 @ 120 FPS

With 32 bit color depth:

Kinect: - (not supported)
Playstation Eye: 640 x 480 @ 60 FPS

Audio:

Kinect: 16 bit audio @ 16 kHz
Playstation Eye: 16 bit audio @ 48 kHz"

I tried to warn people, but many were just too hyped (like for the fake Milo demo). I find Kinect to be pretty destructive for hardcore gaming on the XBox. Half of the XBox game shelf space here is now dedicated to predominantly crappy Kinect-only games.

I also mentioned the additional resource requirement compared to Move and I find his comments interesting that he just like me thinks Kinect is mostly usefull for dancing/exercises games/programs, that's exactly what I once wrote. IMO don't expect much hardcore game support for Kinect, unlike for Playstation Move.

very insitefull, and when you factor in the Move....

i dont understand have the kinect has been so hugely successful, and probably has double the move install base (individual owners).

you simply cant play more complecated games than pet the tiger, and heavily assisted air driving, with peddels.

not saying those games cant be fun, but they just dont have much depth to them, and arent for a lack of a better word, hardcore

Kinect sucess is due to marketing and consumer perception almost exclusively, after the holidays it had a huge drop in sales, and I think it will continue dropping the longer it is out

but its still selling like crazy, and kinect advantures is always top 3 sold per week (its already sold more than 8 million, thats insane, sports champions will be luck to get that lifetime) also kinect is more expensive and the games cost more.

and its pretty limited iin the types of games and genres it can do

http://gamrreview.vgchartz.com/sales/45608/kinect-adventures/

look at the graph, the second the holidays were over the thing dropped in sales massively and the sales continue to drop, and frankly I don't see them ever getting the sales anywhere near to where they were even with a price drop 

it still sells a ton.

gosh dangit, whats up with Americans (i am american) flocking to kinect and xbox 360 for that matter and buying it in droves, but not Move and ps3. i dont get it, its agravating


I'm sorry but stop trolling, take your bullshit opinions and leave. Move is a technical flop that blatantly and deliberately copies dated technology, those figures presented are entirely skewed. It is already stated that Kinect's RGB and Depth cameras are capable of 640x480 @ 60 FPS. Also, the PS eye is running off of only one camera and cannot track depth or head-tracking, all it can do is follow an IR sensor just like the Wii. So please once again take your skewed facts and GTFO.

Also to Edge, then why is it still the top selling peripheral and why the hell is 360 consistently out-selling PS3 almost every week since June of last year, go ahead and try to answer I'll wait.



Edgeoflife on 13 February 2011
Oblivion86 said:
Edgeoflife said:

Kinect sucess is due to marketing and consumer perception almost exclusively, after the holidays it had a huge drop in sales, and I think it will continue dropping the longer it is out

 


I'm sorry but stop trolling, take your bullshit opinions and leave. Move is a technical flop that blatantly and deliberately copies dated technology, those figures presented are entirely skewed. It is already stated that Kinect's RGB and Depth cameras are capable of 640x480 @ 60 FPS. Also, the PS eye is running off of only one camera and cannot track depth or head-tracking, all it can do is follow an IR sensor just like the Wii. So please once again take your skewed facts and GTFO.

Also to Edge, then why is it still the top selling peripheral and why the hell is 360 consistently out-selling PS3 almost every week since June of last year, go ahead and try to answer I'll wait.

I already did it's in the massive block you quoted from here I'll make it easier for you, and 360 hasn't been outselling ps3 that much, not even close, as for the rest of your post you are obviously bias and know nothing about the technical limitations or capabilities about either device 



osamanobama on 13 February 2011
Oblivion86 said:
osamanobama said:

I

Kinect sucess is due to marketing and consumer perception almost exclusively, after the holidays it had a huge drop in sales, and I think it will continue dropping the longer it is out

but its still selling like crazy, and kinect advantures is always top 3 sold per week (its already sold more than 8 million, thats insane, sports champions will be luck to get that lifetime) also kinect is more expensive and the games cost more.

and its pretty limited iin the types of games and genres it can do

http://gamrreview.vgchartz.com/sales/45608/kinect-adventures/

look at the graph, the second the holidays were over the thing dropped in sales massively and the sales continue to drop, and frankly I don't see them ever getting the sales anywhere near to where they were even with a price drop 

it still sells a ton.

gosh dangit, whats up with Americans (i am american) flocking to kinect and xbox 360 for that matter and buying it in droves, but not Move and ps3. i dont get it, its agravating


I'm sorry but stop trolling, take your bullshit opinions and leave. Move is a technical flop that blatantly and deliberately copies dated technology, those figures presented are entirely skewed. It is already stated that Kinect's RGB and Depth cameras are capable of 640x480 @ 60 FPS. Also, the PS eye is running off of only one camera and cannot track depth or head-tracking, all it can do is follow an IR sensor just like the Wii. So please once again take your skewed facts and GTFO.

Also to Edge, then why is it still the top selling peripheral and why the hell is 360 consistently out-selling PS3 almost every week since June of last year, go ahead and try to answer I'll wait.


why are you quoting me, i havent posted any facts, trying to make kinect look bad. i dont think any one doubts that kinect is a better body tracker than the ps eye. also where did you get that kinect is 640x480 @ 60fps. its always been reported  320 x 240 @ 30 FPS. the bolded is a lie, move has always been able to do head tracking (it does it in this little game called GT5) and did you not reaf the OP and story at all. he said the eye can do depth through algarithems, but kinect gets it for free. also how is move based on old tech and is copying. from every major reviewer (also digital foundry and modern science) say it the most advanced and accurate motion tech. 

also

 

                                   

2003     2010

 



MikeB on 13 February 2011

@ Oblivion86

> Also, the PS eye is running off of only one camera and cannot track depth or head-tracking, all it can do is follow an IR sensor just like the Wii

You clearly don't understand the Playstation Eye and Playstation Move technologies, nor its origin. I recommend you to do some research on this before further commenting.

With regard to Eyetoy/PS Eye not being able to do headtracking:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58hfb9ZxzK8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFN8cW1mSVY

One day though we will have a superior virtual reality solution.



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