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Forums - General Discussion - Mafia Round 23 - Sign-up Thread

hey, is this a non-themed game? I'm all for a power game with a bunch of vanilla players. If so, sign me up. Plain old just doctor, cop, and mafia is ok, but a handful of power roles is a lot better in my opinion. However, I'm not big into the theme games like DBZ or Sailor Moon.

Oh, and if anyone posts their role PM (as I gather was a problem last game) i'll gladly just ban them from the website for ruining the fun




If you drop a PS3 right on top of a Wii, it would definitely defeat it. Not so sure about the Xbox360. - mancandy
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nordlead said:

hey, is this a non-themed game? I'm all for a power game with a bunch of vanilla players. If so, sign me up. Plain old just doctor, cop, and mafia is ok, but a handful of power roles is a lot better in my opinion. However, I'm not big into the theme games like DBZ or Sailor Moon.

Oh, and if anyone posts their role PM (as I gather was a problem last game) i'll gladly just ban them from the website for ruining the fun

Yay nordlead is playing! It's been a long time!



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I got a great idea for a mafia game, and I'm interested in hosting this one (as it requires less time than playing).

Jester-town. I have a great flavour in mind too

Its for 13 players.

There is a team of jesters who win when they all die. (I'm thinking 2)

There is a team of mafia.

And obviously some townies.

I will keep it vanilla.

Think about it, people will have to think twice in their lynches...mafia will have to do the same thing for night kills...it'll be an interesting game I think. The jesters can't win by saying "I'm mafia....lynch me !" and I'm giving them nightkill immunity. So they'd have to work hard to win.

If theres any interest in this, I'm willing to host. (please say yes...or I'll hate you forever....)



Also, I got the idea from mafiascum...not gonna take credit for something that isn't my idea... from the dude who gave me the idea -

"The jester role is almost universally reviled on this site, and mods who use them are usually accused of bastarding. While I understand the reasons behind this attitude, I think there is an enormous potential for interesting game dynamics that has not been fully explored. This is because players with jester roles have the unique objective of trying to appear like mafia, meaning there is a whole dimension of play that could arise revolving around "jester-tells", as opposed to "scum-tells".

I think the biggest reason that jesters have been mostly disliked so far on this site is the manner in which they have been implemented. As a role, jesters appear infrequently and typically only one at a time, meaning that no advanced strategies of play have emerged to deal with them. Players who have been assigned to play as jesters have typically used very primitive attention getting tactics (such as claiming scum or committing deliberately obvious scumtells), which, for the most part, have accomplished little more than significantly deteriorating the quality of play in those games where jesters were used. It is my belief that with more regular usage of jesters, and a more intelligent implementation of the jester role, they could provide some interesting and enjoyable dimensions to a game.

In this setup, I have two non-town teams: the scum-team, and the jester team. Yes, friends, the jester team. This means they can talk to each other at night in a quick-topic. In addition, they are NK immune, and they all have role-blocking abilities at night which can target both town and mafia. They win when they are all lynched.

What are the implications of this setup? Well, there are many interesting strategical possibilities for each of the factions involved. For example, if a player were to act aggressively scummy in this game, how should the town react? In one case, they might be a jester, meaning the town does not want to lynch them. However, they could also be a scum player trying to act like a jester, precisely to avoid a lynch. It could even be a town PR, who, by imitating a jester, hopes to dissuade scum from targeting them with their NK. 

In the end, it'd all be wifom, and gameplay would boil down to the same basic elements that exist in all normal mafia games today; just with a new dimension added. Players would look for things in other player's posts that betray a mindset of wanting to be lynched in the same way that they already would for a mindset of wanting to mislynch. In addition to a too scummy to be scum principle, you might have a not scummy enough to be jester one. There's no fundamental difference between a jester trying to look scummy and a scum trying to look townish; it's just a different dimension to the gameplay that has already long existed on this site.

Since jesters cannot be NKd, and can only win by being lynched, it is naturally in their interest to have as many days as possible. Therefore, their goal is to keep either of the other two factions from getting the upperhand against each other for as long as they can. This is why I have given the jesters roleblocking abilities: it is their one tool they can use to try and increase the number of days in the game, thereby increasing their chances at getting lynched. When the town seems to be winning, they can roleblock the vig, cop, and doctor to even things out. When the town is confused and the mafia seems to be steadily picking them off, they can roleblock the scum and stall for time. In the midst of all of this, the jesters are trying to get themselves lynched by the town without being so obvious that they look like jesters. This is important: in an open setup where there is a known jester contingent, the jesters have to learn to play as subtly and manipulatively as any scum does if they want to succeed in their goal of actually getting lynched. I think this has the potential to be a very interesting game dynamic.

There are a lot of other interesting things that could happen in this setup, and if it was used more than once, I expect some very subtle and clever strategies might emerge. For now, I'm going to leave it out in the open and see what you guys think.

If you dislike this setup, please make sure to specify whether you disagree with the concept in its entirety, or just think my current setup is flawed. 

Thanks, and I can't wait to hear some opinions. If people like it, I'll try to do one like this as a theme game. "Evil Clown Mafia", perhaps."



So essentially you want everyone to change from looking innocent to looking guilty, which honestly doesn't seem to really add to the game. In fact, you are trying to encourage "bad" play by everyone at which point the game will devolve into what VGC seems to be having and hating currently, bad play.

The last few signup threads I've read have all boild down to something like... "The game sucked because so and so roleclaimed right away" or "people posted their PMs" or other complaints about how people are trying to break the game. I don't see why we should encourage everyone to play the way that is currently being complained about.

To top it off, VGC has a bad habit of having horribly long games. I don't see why we should encourage people playing even slower by refusing to vote. Overall I think it is a bad idea.




If you drop a PS3 right on top of a Wii, it would definitely defeat it. Not so sure about the Xbox360. - mancandy
In the past we played games. In the future we watch games. - Forest-Spirit
11/03/09 Desposit: Mod Bribery (RolStoppable)  vg$ 500.00
06/03/09 Purchase: Moderator Privilege  vg$ -50,000.00

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nordlead said:

So essentially you want everyone to change from looking innocent to looking guilty, which honestly doesn't seem to really add to the game. In fact, you are trying to encourage "bad" play by everyone at which point the game will devolve into what VGC seems to be having and hating currently, bad play.

The last few signup threads I've read have all boild down to something like... "The game sucked because so and so roleclaimed right away" or "people posted their PMs" or other complaints about how people are trying to break the game. I don't see why we should encourage everyone to play the way that is currently being complained about.

To top it off, VGC has a bad habit of having horribly long games. I don't see why we should encourage people playing even slower by refusing to vote. Overall I think it is a bad idea.

I'm not encouraging "bad" play. .Isn't it the job of the town to figure out whos town and whos mafia ? I'm just adding a team of psychopaths into the equation...Jesters can't be too blatant about being who they are. But I think its an interesting dynamic that will make this game a little different from the rest.

Besides, there is a cop to find out whether the player they investigate is jester, mafia or town.

Why would players refuse to vote ? There are 2-3 unkillable Jesters. To help out non-jester players I will mention the number of Jesters remaining alive...it'll be in the day start flavour.

Roleclaiming isn't the problem. isn't that necessary ? :/ Name claiming is whats bad about themed games. and posting PMs are not allowed anyway...

Also I forgot to mention that the Jesters are not taken into the equation in the mafia 50% majority thing...that might cause a problem if they are...



Well, if you guys don't think its a horrible idea...it can still wait till the next round...provided no one else has plans.



I don't like the idea because it makes the townies' job impossible. How do you tell between a Mafia slip up and an intentional slip up from a jester? Mafia games breed enough paranoia as it is, a game where you've got two factions of bad guys with very different win conditions would be complete chaos.



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GodOfWar_3ever said:

I'm not encouraging "bad" play. .Isn't it the job of the town to figure out whos town and whos mafia ? I'm just adding a team of psychopaths into the equation...Jesters can't be too blatant about being who they are. But I think its an interesting dynamic that will make this game a little different from the rest.

Besides, there is a cop to find out whether the player they investigate is jester, mafia or town.

Why would players refuse to vote ? There are 2-3 unkillable Jesters. To help out non-jester players I will mention the number of Jesters remaining alive...it'll be in the day start flavour.

Roleclaiming isn't the problem. isn't that necessary ? :/ Name claiming is whats bad about themed games. and posting PMs are not allowed anyway...

Also I forgot to mention that the Jesters are not taken into the equation in the mafia 50% majority thing...that might cause a problem if they are...

Bold 1) People refuse to vote because they don't want to lynch town. In this scenario now they really wouldn't want to vote because they could lynch a jester.

Bold 2) I assumed that anyways as the game would be completely broken otherwise when you hit a stalemate of 2 scum and 2 jesters.

As for bad play. Having the town act like Jesters so they scum don't target them was one of the suggested "strategies". Along with the scum acting like Jesters so the town doesn't lynch them. This is essentially encouraging people to intentionally play "poorly" and create chaos. In otherwords you turn the whole game around. This is why people don't like jesters in the first place. While it might be fun and humorous, considering my observations in the past few signup threads people are not humored by the way people are playing now. To fix this problem it would be better to go back to a more basic game (townies/cop/doctor/few non crazy power roles, and a handful of scum).




If you drop a PS3 right on top of a Wii, it would definitely defeat it. Not so sure about the Xbox360. - mancandy
In the past we played games. In the future we watch games. - Forest-Spirit
11/03/09 Desposit: Mod Bribery (RolStoppable)  vg$ 500.00
06/03/09 Purchase: Moderator Privilege  vg$ -50,000.00

Nordlead Jr. Photo/Video Gallery!!! (Video Added 4/19/10)

1.MetalGear_94 
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as a note, I will be vacationing over Thanksgiving. (24-28) I expect the game to massivly slow down over this period, but I might be wrong. Either way my personal posting will drop off over that period as I will be spending a lot of time with family.




If you drop a PS3 right on top of a Wii, it would definitely defeat it. Not so sure about the Xbox360. - mancandy
In the past we played games. In the future we watch games. - Forest-Spirit
11/03/09 Desposit: Mod Bribery (RolStoppable)  vg$ 500.00
06/03/09 Purchase: Moderator Privilege  vg$ -50,000.00

Nordlead Jr. Photo/Video Gallery!!! (Video Added 4/19/10)