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Forums - General - Dinosaurs co-existed with man.

Wiintendo said:
zarx said:
OoSnap said:
zarx said:

sorry this was debunked, the supposed "flesh" was just bacterial bio-films that have formed in the microscopic cavities that formed by the cells during fossilisation, a mistake that has been made before.

http://bacteriality.com/2008/08/26/dino/

 The other videos from what I have seen are full of incorrect statements and bad science, sorry.


Liar. It wasn't "debunked". You apparently didn't read the webpage you provided a link to.

From your link:

"The finding sparked a strong response from the researchers who originally claimed to have found ancient dinosaur tissue. Schweitzer argues that there are significant holes in Kaye’s study, namely an explanation for why the protein in the tissue looks like that expected for a dinosaur. She added that her group has considered biofilms but has found no evidence for their presence. Errors in the current study “seem to underlie a fundamental misunderstanding of our work, our data and our interpretations,” Schweitzer commented to the press."

"Other researchers seem hesitant to make a definitive statement about the controversy. “It’s actually quite common to find biofilms in areas where fossils would be formed,” said Frank Corsetti, an earth scientist at USC who was not involved in the research. “It’s an interesting idea, but the jury is still out.”"

From DiscoveryMagazine.com

"When Schweitzer showed Horner the slide, she recalls, "Jack said, 'Prove to me they're not red blood cells.' That was what I got my Ph.D. doing." She first ruled out contaminants and mineral structures. Then she analyzed the putative cells using a half-dozen techniques involving chemical analysis and immunology. In one test, a colleague injected rats with the dinosaur fossil extract; the rodents produced antibodies that responded to turkey and rabbit hemoglobins. All the data supported the conclusion that the T. rex fossil contained fragments of hemoglobin molecules. "The most likely source of these proteins is the once-living cells of the dinosaur," she wrote in a 1997 paper."

I just chose that link because it showed both sides of the argument, and as I said that explanation has been accepted for other similar situations, and was proven to be true. There are other theories that explain the findings as well. 

And even if the samples are of real T-rex blood and cells that still doesn't mean that Dinosaurs co-existed with man. There are currently theories of fossilisation that would explain the cells lasting 65 million years, but those theories haven't yet been accepted yet as they have problems. But the T-rex cells could lead to those theories gaining ground. Even the scientists that made the discovery don't think that dinosaurs co-existed with man, they are just claiming that a form of fossilisation that was previously unknown had occurred preserving the cell structure for millions of years. Even they dated the samples to be millions of years old. 


Mary, one of the leading scientists making the discoveries of soft tissue from multiple dinosaurs, including the t-rex soft tissue, rejects the notion of them biofilms.

Researchers Debate: Is It Preserved Dinosaur Tissue, or Bacterial Slime?

Schweitzer says her team considered the hypothesis that the material they found in the original thigh bone was a bacterial biofilm, and rejected the possibility. She says there’s no reported evidence that biofilms can produce branching, hollow tubes like those noted in her study [Science News].

 

 

I don't agree with Mary that the soft tissue is 68 million years old or anything close.  I don't think such things could be preserved for so long.  I believe in a young earth.

 


I think I'm just going to bow out of this particular thread at least for now.



@TheVoxelman on twitter

Check out my hype threads: Cyberpunk, and The Witcher 3!

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miz1q2w3e said:

I watched 3 of the Evidence" dinosaurs and man co-existed vids you linked to until i'd had enough...

@the "Evidence": I must say that drawings and sculptures are hardly evidence of something being actually observed by someone and that they actually coexisted at one point. One huge possibilty is that these people (being humans and all) created thses things by imagination, much like the tales of greek gods...etc as well as the fact that ancient people used to make personify most things in their surrounding environment, like death as a person who collects souls, thunder being an angry god, mother earth, father time - - - not too different from what we do now in books, movies ..etc - - - the mediums may be different but it's still all the same. or am i to assume that you now believe that Cerberus , Centaurs and this thing once roamed the earth as well??

Another possibility is that they simply found fossils in their area and documented what they found, scientists find fossils all the time nowadays, is it crazy to assume people might have stumbled upon fossils a few hundred years ago as well?

You're free to believe what you want to believe. But I ask you to consider that the Ica Stones drawings had dinosaur skin features that matches recently discovered petrified dinosaur skin. How would they know what it looks like unless they saw it? Maybe they just got lucky, right?

 



g-value said:

I'm tired of all these threads were people basically mock the believe of God. Now I'm going to have to create a thread that will prove that God exist and that he created the universe and the earth that's in it as well as prove that the bible is true (And I'll use alot of historical facts to back up my argument as well). Don't expect it soon though (in about 2 weeks or so). Look forward to it everyone :)


Mind if I provide you with some resources?

I have been a Christian for many years but I always had some doubts about certain things in the Old Testament such as Noah's Flood, Nephillim, Sodom and Gomorrah etc. That was until I actually did some research on my own and found answers.

Just about all the common questions concerning the major events in Genesis (such as "where did all the water come from for Noah's flood?") can be found in the following links.

 

Dinosaurs in the Bible
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0Z75ngqeQY

Evidence of one world flood, language. Did you know there are over 500 cultures with a worldwide story where a family was saved inside a boat? Hmm, perhaps it really did happen. I suggest you watch all parts of the video (I think 12 parts)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dceMA5JdcJo Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFsZk...re=relatedPart 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7Taj...eature=related Part 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7Taj...eature=related Part 4

Chinese culture/language gives credence to a worldwide flood

http://www.bibleprobe.com/chinese.htm

http://creation.com/images/pdfs/tj/j19_2/j19_2_96-108.pdf

Noah's flood evidence
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_JJsYO0Dec

Giants or nephillim evidence. Perhaps some of the photos are hoaxes but not all of them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-8bVEIVUh8&feature=fvw Fossil evidence
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31hcHvtmMQM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N63lhtx2q8o Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFXAP...eature=related part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Uu1J...eature=related part 3

Young Earth Creationism. There are 12 parts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTJo7IHuzQA



OoSnap said:
miz1q2w3e said:

I watched 3 of the Evidence" dinosaurs and man co-existed vids you linked to until i'd had enough...

@the "Evidence": I must say that drawings and sculptures are hardly evidence of something being actually observed by someone and that they actually coexisted at one point. One huge possibilty is that these people (being humans and all) created thses things by imagination, much like the tales of greek gods...etc as well as the fact that ancient people used to make personify most things in their surrounding environment, like death as a person who collects souls, thunder being an angry god, mother earth, father time - - - not too different from what we do now in books, movies ..etc - - - the mediums may be different but it's still all the same. or am i to assume that you now believe that Cerberus , Centaurs and this thing once roamed the earth as well??

Another possibility is that they simply found fossils in their area and documented what they found, scientists find fossils all the time nowadays, is it crazy to assume people might have stumbled upon fossils a few hundred years ago as well?

You're free to believe what you want to believe. But I ask you to consider that the Ica Stones drawings had dinosaur skin features that matches recently discovered petrified dinosaur skin. How would they know what it looks like unless they saw it? Maybe they just got lucky, right?

 


Uhh. Thats called hatching, it's the form of shading used on line drawings. It has nothing to do with dinosaur skin.



Slimebeast said:

I know you never called yourself a humanist on these forums but I imagined that you would imagine yourself to be a humanist if one would ask you IRL.

Your last paragraph is key. And yes most people do this (elevate their personal morals). There's an alternative conclusion to the one you drew though. Why is this impulse so strong within us, the fact that so many people hold their morals up to an absolute? Why is it so hard for us to tolerate different opinions on our core moral issues? I can't see the necessity to evolve such a strong moral sense so quickly.

And about different morals, actually when it comes to core morals we have the same morals. Why is the world evolving its common morals to the Human Rights that we agree upon universally, no matter if you're atheist or religious. Human Rights = absolute morals.



I think you are wrong about this. There used to be an indigenous tribe in Africa or Australia (can't remember where exactly). In this tribe it was considered moral for one to pretend to befriend someone, and then kill them when they least expected. Deceit and murder were considered virtues within that tribe (and as you can guess they never went very far, as a society).

In another comment you said that cannibals were wrong due to absolute morals. That is not true. Their morals were wrong because they didn't allow their society to move foreward. For a society to thrive people have to live together and work together. Stealing is immoral because it destroys stability. So is murder and so on. Morals have to assure people's wellbeing, so that people can live together. Human rights aren't absolute morals, but they're elevated to that status by people, because they assure people's well being and create stability within society.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

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g-value said:

I don't need luck. All I need is the Lord's blessing. I'll say it right now, you WILL be a believer once the Holy Spirit is through with you.

Oh my, you sure are something! You seem like a sort of cartoon character.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

yea, yea, yea, Sure.

George Carlin says it best.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPOfurmrjxo

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ardipithecus

here some science for you.

Charles Darwin = A true Genius, who's work has lead to scientific evidence that just can't be given in any other belief structure. Lucy(Australopithecus),ardy( Ardipithecus)recent findings and proof constantly being put forth. Yet fear and tradition put it out of question when answers can be scene at your local museam. Question a belief that uses fear to operate, Question everything that is to be Questioned. science is beautiful because this is the way we find the truth.
Through trial and error the story of life, health, science, technology, space and time comes complete.

 



sapphi_snake said:
g-value said:

I don't need luck. All I need is the Lord's blessing. I'll say it right now, you WILL be a believer once the Holy Spirit is through with you.

Oh my, you sure are something! You seem like a sort of cartoon character.

@g-value

There's over 4,500 different religions and they all think there right. What make you think you are?

(goes to the entry gates "oh sorry, thats not  the answer we where looking for, thank you for playing guess the right religion.)

Oh, I see, the number one reason to believe, Fear, I get it. Fear of sin, Fear of god, Fear of hell, Fear of other religions and they are the evil ones, fear of the Lord. If someone  don't believe me I will just hit him until he fears me enough to believe.  By the way I do not operate on fear and also don't believe in violence or some sort of punishment for living. thank you please drive through.





sapphi_snake said:
Slimebeast said:

I know you never called yourself a humanist on these forums but I imagined that you would imagine yourself to be a humanist if one would ask you IRL.

Your last paragraph is key. And yes most people do this (elevate their personal morals). There's an alternative conclusion to the one you drew though. Why is this impulse so strong within us, the fact that so many people hold their morals up to an absolute? Why is it so hard for us to tolerate different opinions on our core moral issues? I can't see the necessity to evolve such a strong moral sense so quickly.

And about different morals, actually when it comes to core morals we have the same morals. Why is the world evolving its common morals to the Human Rights that we agree upon universally, no matter if you're atheist or religious. Human Rights = absolute morals.



I think you are wrong about this. There used to be an indigenous tribe in Africa or Australia (can't remember where exactly). In this tribe it was considered moral for one to pretend to befriend someone, and then kill them when they least expected. Deceit and murder were considered virtues within that tribe (and as you can guess they never went very far, as a society).

In another comment you said that cannibals were wrong due to absolute morals. That is not true. Their morals were wrong because they didn't allow their society to move foreward. For a society to thrive people have to live together and work together. Stealing is immoral because it destroys stability. So is murder and so on. Morals have to assure people's wellbeing, so that people can live together. Human rights aren't absolute morals, but they're elevated to that status by people, because they assure people's well being and create stability within society.

@sapphi_snake very well put



ChichiriMuyo said:

I've only watched the first part of the series of videos, and I find a lot of the sources questionable.  Marco Polo, for instance, was later found to have been one of the greatest liars in history.  Almost everything he wrote was proven false later on.  I'll keep watching, though.  No sense in not hearing the opposition's arguments.  I mean, it's possible that a few decendents of dinosaurs still walked among men, though this seems tragically to be poised as an argument agaisnt evolution which it fails so terribly at.

well birds are supposed to be evolved from dinosaurs. So maybe he wanted to really say that. which then would just add  evidence to evolution..  yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!

http://www.ucmp.berkeley.edu/diapsids/avians.html

Ok I'm going to read about games now.