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Forums - General - French Parliament Votes To Ban The Burka

Squall_Leonhart on 13 July 2010

Hmmmm i wonder if this will be brought to the UK...



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NiKKoM on 13 July 2010
FootballFan said:
NiKKoM said:

Nope... I disagree with a ban..  People should be allowed to wear what they want.  However, when pictures of facial features are required for identity cards such as passports and driver's licences or to prove identy when voting, then wearers should be required to remove the facial veil without fuss or muss...

Public Safety? Sure.. Yet, no one's out there banning masks, wigs, sunglasses or hats, which can obscure as much of the face as a veil...

The ban actually forbids the wearing of anything that covers the face. So masks, and things of that nature would be included within the ban.


Well... there goes my ski holiday to france...



 

Face the future.. Gamecenter ID: nikkom_nl (oh no he didn't!!) 

FootballFan on 13 July 2010
Squall_Leonhart said:

Hmmmm i wonder if this will be brought to the UK...

Out of curiosity would you be for or against?



richardhutnik on 13 July 2010
FootballFan said:
richardhutnik said:

This is not about public safety.  It is about specifically targeting Muslim women to drive Muslims out of France.   Well I am not in France, so France can do whatever it is going to do, but I feel the policy is wrong.

And it is things like this that lead militant Muslim fundamentalists to justify their war against the West.

Bollocks.

82% of French citizens want this case, banning garments covering the entire face banned.

It is nothing to do with targetting Muslims.....Muslims want it to seem like this to make the point that they deserve rules of their own and that 82% of the populations opinion doesn't matter.

Can I just ask you, if i walked around passed seurity cameras with a Burka could you identify me?

If there weren't Muslim women covering their faces, there wouldn't be the drive to ban the covering.  Before 9/11 tell me what percentage of the French were against Burkas?  Can you?  It wasn't an issue then.  This is specifically passed to target Muslim women. 

By the way, since when is an entire society supposed to be wired with security cameras and people aren't allowed to be in public ANYWHERE, because of these security cameras? 

Consider this:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/07/14/2952787.htm?section=world

The law does not apply if the face is covered for carnivals or artistic events.

And this:

France had already banned the wearing of Muslim headscarves in schools and the civil service, although female university students may wear them.

Again, this isn't about safety, it is about driving fundamentalist Muslims out of France.  It is a culture war.  Exactly how does a ban on HEADSCARVES in schools and civil service for safety?  Answer, it isn't. 

And it doesn't matter if 99% of the population wants it.  If it is a culture war act, it is a culture war act.



richardhutnik on 13 July 2010
FootballFan said:
kowenicki said:
FootballFan said:
richardhutnik said:

This is not about public safety.  It is about specifically targeting Muslim women to drive Muslims out of France.   Well I am not in France, so France can do whatever it is going to do, but I feel the policy is wrong.

And it is things like this that lead militant Muslim fundamentalists to justify their war against the West.

Bollocks.

82% of French citizens want this case, banning garments covering the entire face banned.

It is nothing to do with targetting Muslims.....Muslims want it to seem like this to make the point that they deserve rules of their own and that 82% of the populations opinion doesn't matter.

Can I just ask you, if i walked around passed seurity cameras with a Burka could you identify me?

Yeah, but if i walk past with a motorcycle helmet or a full face balaclava on could you identify me?

I dont like the burkha, but this is poor legislation.

It's what 82% of France wants. Motorcycle helemts are difficult as they are to protect them. Balaclavas would be banned IF this law gets passed. I tell you what though, it would be interesting on halloween when the authorities are dishing out £125 fines for people covering their faces.

Apparently festivals and artistic performances permit face coverings.



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FootballFan on 13 July 2010
richardhutnik said:
FootballFan said:
richardhutnik said:

This is not about public safety.  It is about specifically targeting Muslim women to drive Muslims out of France.   Well I am not in France, so France can do whatever it is going to do, but I feel the policy is wrong.

And it is things like this that lead militant Muslim fundamentalists to justify their war against the West.

Bollocks.

82% of French citizens want this case, banning garments covering the entire face banned.

It is nothing to do with targetting Muslims.....Muslims want it to seem like this to make the point that they deserve rules of their own and that 82% of the populations opinion doesn't matter.

Can I just ask you, if i walked around passed seurity cameras with a Burka could you identify me?

If there weren't Muslim women covering their faces, there wouldn't be the drive to ban the covering.  Before 9/11 tell me what percentage of the French were against Burkas?  Can you?  It wasn't an issue then.  This is specifically passed to target Muslim women. 

By the way, since when is an entire society supposed to be wired with security cameras and people aren't allowed to be in public ANYWHERE, because of these security cameras? 

Consider this:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/07/14/2952787.htm?section=world

The law does not apply if the face is covered for carnivals or artistic events.

And this:

France had already banned the wearing of Muslim headscarves in schools and the civil service, although female university students may wear them.

Again, this isn't about safety, it is about driving fundamentalist Muslims out of France.  It is a culture war.  Exactly how does a ban on HEADSCARVES in schools and civil service for safety?  Answer, it isn't.

Simple answer. Same reason as to why the Christian cross around people's necks are also banned. Children need to stick to the dress codes of the school. Formal and everyone should be the same. I wouldn't want my children to feel left out because some children were allowed to wear some items which go against the dress code and could be deemed as fashion items. There is a reason that everyone wears the same clothing and it is to stop this segregation.  



NiKKoM on 13 July 2010
FootballFan said:

Simple answer. Same reason as to why the Christian cross around people's next must be banned. Children need to stick to the dress codes of the school. Formal and everyone should be the same. I wouldn't want my children to feel left out because some children were allowed to wear some items which go against the dress code and could be deemed as fashion items. There is a reason that everyone wears the same clothing and it is to stop this segregation.

Ehm... there is no School Uniform in France..... like in a lot of parts in the world..



 

Face the future.. Gamecenter ID: nikkom_nl (oh no he didn't!!) 

Squall_Leonhart on 13 July 2010
FootballFan said:
Squall_Leonhart said:

Hmmmm i wonder if this will be brought to the UK...

Out of curiosity would you be for or against?

I think that i would be for it, since i personally don't like not being able to see the peoples faces...



FootballFan on 13 July 2010
NiKKoM said:
FootballFan said:

Simple answer. Same reason as to why the Christian cross around people's next must be banned. Children need to stick to the dress codes of the school. Formal and everyone should be the same. I wouldn't want my children to feel left out because some children were allowed to wear some items which go against the dress code and could be deemed as fashion items. There is a reason that everyone wears the same clothing and it is to stop this segregation.

Ehm... there is no School Uniform in France..... like in a lot of parts in the world..

I applogise. I must have mistaken it for somewhere else.



Reasonable on 13 July 2010

I'm not a fan of the various veils worn by Muslim women but this seems the wrong approach to me.

Like a fair number of Europeans (so far as I'm aware) I want a soceity where the state and legal laws take precedence over religous beliefs as the standards for behaviour, but this is a very simplistic approach to a thorny issue.



Try to be reasonable... its easier than you think...