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Forums - General - After seeing Inception...

disolitude on 20 July 2010
Cactus said:

@ disolitude

Here is the short version of a response that, for some reason, didn't post properly

I agree that some of those theories are far-fetched, but if you take #1 and #4 and put them together, they work. I'm not saying that that this is the best route that they could have taken with the plot, but this line of thought would at least cover the gaping plothole that you were mentioning earlier.

Yeah, I guess thats the best explanation for the events. Ima see that part again...

I just remember watching that movie and hoping those ships blow each other up. That would have been another level of chaos which even Batman would have a hard time solving.

After that was resolved peacefully I felt that all the tension Joker caused is gone, and that the city has overcome the hurdle it had.

Then when the whole final scene with Dent was happening I remember being more pissed off more than Christian Bale on the set of Terminator Salvation. :)

"No, just no...wtf are you doing...you fucking amateur!" :P



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richardhutnik on 20 July 2010
disolitude said:
richardhutnik said:
 

Several possible answers to your question:

* The beginning of the The Dark Knight, you see a bunch of people dressing up as Batman and doing vigilantee work in his name.  They are out of control.  In short he was too much of a hero.

* The entire thing with the Joker taking down Dent needed to be kept secret, so that Dent remains as an hero figure who worked within the law.  They were able to spin it so that Batman is wanted for questioning (a character like Batman is always wanted for questioning).  By having things the way it is now, Batman is really outside the law.  Batman is free to do whatever he will do, and not have to answer questions by the authorities.  The Police can say they know nothing of his actions. 

Well, that is my take.  Batman ends up able to do his job and left alone, and the law turns a blind eye to his actions.

Most people have this take, but I don't think it works. If those ships blew each other up, it would work as the city would still be in chaos.

However the people in those ships showed that there is hope for Gotham by not blowing each other up. That is a huge moral vicotry for the city which renders Harvey Dent as a hero figure obsolete.

I will admit that the way they ended it sets up some cool ideas for Part 3, with Batman being an outlaw...so it may have been a necessary sacrifice for greater things to come.

Batman as hero results in untrained individuals dressing up in costumes and acting as vigilantees and getting hurt.  It is less about Harvey and more about Batman not elevated.  I just reread the ending, and you see how it is all about not letting the Joker win.  It is different between Harvey Dent being obsolete vs turning into a criminal who lost it.



NKAJ on 20 July 2010

wow just seen the film.It was brilliant.The ending was amazing as well because it made me question a lot of things and really devote a lot of time to thinking about the idea of inception and the whole "dream concept".



"They will know heghan belongs to the helghast"

"England expects that everyman will do his duty"

"we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender"

 

NKAJ on 20 July 2010
BBH said:

Inception looks a bit like Shutter Island to me.

Leonardo seems to like these mind fuck movies.

I could have saw on two occassions but chose Get Him to the Greek and Toy Story 3D instead.

Both fantastic movies. Get Him to the Greek must be the funniest film since the Hangover.


yeah i think its funnier THAN the hangover :)



"They will know heghan belongs to the helghast"

"England expects that everyman will do his duty"

"we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender"

 

ZenfoldorVGI on 20 July 2010
disolitude said:
oldschoolfool said:
 

You can find flaws in logic,in pretty much any movie. Just take it for what it is,it's just a movie after all. As long as a movie entertains me,then I'm happy. I'll watch the movie when it comes out on dvd. lol


Agreed.

I liked TDK myself as well as Inception. Hell TDK is my 3rd favorite Batman movie.

But I've run in to so many people that have praised it to hell and back that I may come off sounding a little jaded towards it. Seems like Inception is following the same path. Like Oscar worthy? Really?

But again, if Avatar and The Hurt Locker can be nominated and win...Maybe Inception and Dark Knight should be in there too. :)

Momento on the other hand...that movie didn't get enough praise. Yes, there is a major flaw with that movie too. How does a man with short term memory loss remember that he has memory loss? But once one accepts that little loop hole, the movie is sublime...

I think it's certainly oscar worthy. It's a far fucking better movie than The Goddamn Blindside which got nominated for best picture last year. I hate people who do that. By adding the word "really" you are implying that it is poposterious that this film could even be considered oscar worthy. That in itself is rediculious if you know anything about the current state of the academy. Obviously. Don't try to make the phrase "oscar worthy" seem like some unobtainable goal. That shit is ALWAYS relative, and look at some of the movies that are far shittier than inception from the past, that WON BEST PICTURE. Even in a good year this film would be nominated for something, and so far, it certainly is the best live action film yet released in 2010 imho.

I'm a bit shocked actually, that anyone from this forum would share enough of my interests to be able to debate me on something like this, but you seem bound and determined to push your opinion to the point of sheer irritation, so I'll further respond.

You implied earlier that this film has no characterization, and even proclaimed that I must either not know what that means, or have not seen the film. You've been rather free wheeling with your spoilers, but I won't be, because I'm not that kind of guy. I've seen it. I know that all the characters weren't fully realized due to time constraints. However, the characters that were realized, were EXCELLENT. Most notable, Fischer came through as a surprising delight, and of course Cobb was fucking epic. That said, I meant to speak generally about how great and subtle the character development is. This is NOT anime. This is high level movie making, and you have to actually draw a lot of conclusions here, but again, the character development is top notch. I am fully invested by the crescendo.

IMO, Nolan has shewn himself to be a fantastic director. He has yet to make a shitty film. Inception is possibly his best one yet, and I fucking loved it. That being the case, it certainly is oscar worthy, because I don't love anything. I think we'll see at least a nod for best director since we're probably pulling from 10 and we haven't seen anything even remotely close yet, but who the fuck cares. The academy is genre biased, and irrelivant.



I don't need your console war.
It feeds the rich while it buries the poor.
You're power hungry, spinnin' stories, and bein' graphics whores.
I don't need your console war.

NO NO, NO NO NO.

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Aiddon on 20 July 2010

Inception is going to get a Best Picture nom (especially since they snubbed Nolan last time), though I fully don't expect it to win; Nolan might get noms for Best Director and Best Original Screenplay and I also expect some technical noms for Editing and Visual Effects. Considering how barren this year has been for films (the summer especially) Inception deserves its praise.



themanwithnoname on 20 July 2010
disolitude said:
themanwithnoname said:

So you went from mentioning how refreshing it was to see such a smart film and not assume the audience is dumb, to seeing it again and claiming it's not smart at all? Excuse me if I'm not facepalming ad nauseum right now...

I'm beginning to think you just aren't a Christopher Nolan fan at all, which there's nothing wrong with, but I think you're kneejerking yourself way off the deep end.

I thought it was smart first time I saw it. However when I saw it the second time and was able to pay attention to other things as I already knew the specifics of the plot. Once you know the "rules" ther really isn't anything smart in the movie to watch out for.

Also I am not a fan of anyone. I'll never see a movie, buy a game, buy an album etc...and give it a handjob just based on who made it.

I'd love for someone to counter argue what I'm saying...rather than just acuse me of being a "Nolan hater".

Like no one has been able to tell me how the Dark Knight ending holds up on any level. The standoff with 2 ships which did not go as Joker planned proved that society won't collapse on its own. Why does Batman need to take the fault for Harvey Dents death? He says its cause the society will burst in to chaos...however doesn't the boat sequence prove otherwise? Society was just fine there without Harvey...

Also, even by that logic, cant they just blame the Joker for killing Dant? He pretty much killed him anyways...

Makes no sense I tell ya. - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbgLapRAloQ :)

Somehow, I seriously doubt that, but whatever. I suggest you go reread the bolded and tell me how not giving them a handjob is the same as saying "I'm not a fan of anyone." I don't think going to see a film twice in a short period of time is a good idea anyway.



themanwithnoname's law: As an America's sales or NPD thread grows longer, the probabilty of the comment "America = World" [sarcasticly] being made approaches 1.

disolitude on 20 July 2010
ZenfoldorVGI said:
 

I think it's certainly oscar worthy. It's a far fucking better movie than The Goddamn Blindside which got nominated for best picture last year. I hate people who do that. By adding the word "really" you are implying that it is poposterious that this film could even be considered oscar worthy. That in itself is rediculious if you know anything about the current state of the academy. Obviously. Don't try to make the phrase "oscar worthy" seem like some unobtainable goal. That shit is ALWAYS relative, and look at some of the movies that are far shittier than inception from the past, that WON BEST PICTURE. Even in a good year this film would be nominated for something, and so far, it certainly is the best live action film yet released in 2010 imho.

I'm a bit shocked actually, that anyone from this forum would share enough of my interests to be able to debate me on something like this, but you seem bound and determined to push your opinion to the point of sheer irritation, so I'll further respond.

You implied earlier that this film has no characterization, and even proclaimed that I must either not know what that means, or have not seen the film. You've been rather free wheeling with your spoilers, but I won't be, because I'm not that kind of guy. I've seen it. I know that all the characters weren't fully realized due to time constraints. However, the characters that were realized, were EXCELLENT. Most notable, Fischer came through as a surprising delight, and of course Cobb was fucking epic. That said, I meant to speak generally about how great and subtle the character development is. This is NOT anime. This is high level movie making, and you have to actually draw a lot of conclusions here, but again, the character development is top notch. I am fully invested by the crescendo.

IMO, Nolan has shewn himself to be a fantastic director. He has yet to make a shitty film. Inception is possibly his best one yet, and I fucking loved it. That being the case, it certainly is oscar worthy, because I don't love anything. I think we'll see at least a nod for best director since we're probably pulling from 10 and we haven't seen anything even remotely close yet, but who the fuck cares. The academy is genre biased, and irrelivant.

 So you are saying that in a 2 hour and a 30 minute movie he didn't have time do develop 4 of the main characters as well as severly under-use Michael Kane's character?

You don't need a lot of time to develop a character and give it a personality. James Cameron for example knows how to give a personality to pretty much anything that is on screen for more than 30 seconds. The horse which Arnold rode in True Lies had as much personality if not more than Arthur from Inception.

In any case, I won't post here anymore. This became a bickering fest I really did not wan it to be.

If the movie wins an Oscar, kudos to Nolan.



themanwithnoname on 21 July 2010

Yes, James Cameron is clearly the pinnacle of character development. I really hope that's a joke. I think you can pretty accurately describe any character in Avatar after seeing them for about 30 seconds, because they're just about all cardboard cutouts.



themanwithnoname's law: As an America's sales or NPD thread grows longer, the probabilty of the comment "America = World" [sarcasticly] being made approaches 1.

disolitude on 21 July 2010
themanwithnoname said:

Yes, James Cameron is clearly the pinnacle of character development. I really hope that's a joke. I think you can pretty accurately describe any character in Avatar after seeing them for about 30 seconds, because they're just about all cardboard cutouts.


Youre pretending like Avatar is all hes ever done.

He got Sigourney Weaver her only Oscar nomintaion for a role in a freeking sci fi thriller...and rightfully so.

Avatar wasn't his greatest movie on any level (other than visually) but he still knows how to make you care for the characters a hell of a lot better than Nolan in Inceptption. Other than Cobb, and possibly Ficher, did you honestly care what happens to any of thoseother people in the dream? You hardly knew anything about them to care...

Spoiler coming:

.

.

.

I for one only cared that Saito got shot cause he could get Cobb back to his family, and rest could have dropped dead and there would be no impact on the film what so ever. Cobb and his wife were well developped and I had genuene care for them. Fischer and his uncle had some cool supporting role moments but everyone else was as disposable as they come.

Mind you that the whole character debate started when Zen started praising characters the movie. There is a lot of things which christopher nolan does well in Inception, but character development isn't it.