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Forums - Sony - Sony: Xbox 720 and Wii 2 will beat PS4 to market

HappySqurriel said:
Alby_da_Wolf said:

Wii released later than XB360, but it filled the gap in less than one year. Having the right product matters more than releasing early, obviously within reasonable limits, but it looks like just one year head start doesn't ensure victory. Keeping costs under control will be of the essence for Sony, though.


The XBox 360 is not the dominant console of the generation ... If the Wii launched in 2005, sold like it did from launch, and the XBox 360 and PS3 launched a year later with similar sales to what they had from launch, Nintendo's market-share would be much larger at the expense of the HD consoles. Being first to market does not ensure success, but releasing after the market leading console is deadly.

I agree about this, but with "having the right product" I just meant a product that has chances to be leader or at least at a close distance from it, and to this purpose, releasing a flawed console just to be first would be as deadly.



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I'm pretty sure GT5 will sell 10 million units, quote me on that peeps ;)



 

puffy said:

I'm pretty sure GT5 will sell 10 million units, quote me on that peeps ;)


Quoted.



thismeintiel said:
sethnintendo said:
thismeintiel said:
M.U.G.E.N said:
sethnintendo said:

Damn some harsh shit being said about all companies.  This fanboy war is pretty bad in this thread.  I think I'll stick to Nintendo thread from now on......   If you want to talk about copying then lets talk about control stick, rumble pack, motion controls......

way to contribute to what your trying to avoid there bud ;)

It's also funny how none of those things were actually done by Nintendo first.

And what is even funnier is that I didn't say Nintendo did it first.

Didn't you say you were sticking to the Nintendo forum. 

Besides, don't act like that wasn't what you were insinuating.

Actually, his post is not insinuating that. You're reading that from the post, because that's what you're looking for. I'll look at things by device:

Control stick: This first showed up in the 70s, through full-sized joysticks, to weird ones like the Odyssey, to even a disk that acts fairly close to the modern PSP-nub. Nintendo made this fade into obscurity with the control pad, to bring it back later on the N64. Sony copied this resurgance from said 64, though I give neither credit for inventing it. Weird how Nintendo basically re-trivialized their own revolution...

Rumble pack: I'm afraid I'm going to have to give this one to Nintendo for the home market. Again, going to the N64 days, it came with Starfox 64, and was the first console game to give you force feedback. There were higher-end PC controllers and arcade doing it first, though, so I'm not going to say Nintendo invented it. But people liked it for Starfox, so what feature showed up in the dual-shock? Hrm, even looking at the name, it shows that Sony copied two things at once for that controller. Again, not Nintendo's inventions, but Nintendo's making them popular.

Motion controls: Lemme guess, you want to cite the Eye Toy? Wrong. Way back when, there were a few little-known accessories for the NES, things called the Power Glove and U-Force. This was the first experience with console motion. But what popularized motion? Not Eye-toy. (And no, it wasn't the Wiimote either. That only set the base for ensuring everyone had access to motion.) What popularized it was Konami's Bemani series, specifically, moving your feet to Dance Dance Revolution, and your hands to Para Para Paradise. And yes, both of these had home versions, complete with arcade controls, before the Eye-Toy came out. Unfortunately, PPP did not leave Japan, but the DDR craze was a whole different thing in the Americas. I will give Sony credit for the Eye-Toy being the first camera-type device, but their later Move is a Wiimote with glowing balls. Again, attempting to copy how Nintendo made a motion standard that was actually popular, and not relegated to 1 series of games as an add-on accessory.



-dunno001

-On a quest for the truly perfect game; I don't think it exists...

puffy said:

I'm pretty sure GT5 will sell 10 million units, quote me on that peeps ;)


Done! addeed to sig



SOLIDSNAKE08 said:

its been confirmed today that GT5 has a weather system, track editor and go karts! seriously i think this is going to be the best selling in the series even beating GT3 sales of 14 million plus!

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I have read a lot of comments but not all of them.  So if my post is similar to someone elses sorry.

 

There is a huge difference in the next Generation console and this one.  The main reason that the 360 did not run off and leave the ps3 and the Wii early on was mainly due to the PS3 team basically saying that the ps3 would be so much better and more powerful than the 360.   And continually acting like it was just about ready to launch just around the corner.  I have no doubts that this caused a lot of people to hold off from buying a 360.

Now that the 360 has found its foothold, I have no doubts things will play out much better for Microsoft next gen if they get a year headstart.  If the Nextbox follows the same programming architecture as the 360 it will still be much easier to program for than the PS3.  So these same companies may drift toward M$ or Nintendo if this happens.  Like it or not Sony has dwindled its good will left over from the PS2.  (I think most gamers recognize this)

The last thing that may also drive sales would be Xbox Live.  If all of your online "friends" are moving over to the Nextbox people would generally move over because of (for lack of a better word) peer pressure.  I know if all my buddies moved over that would give me a gigantic reason to do so as well.

I am not saying that the Sony is doomed.  Either way I think they will be smarter about the next Playstation than they have been with the PS3.  More than likely it will probably be close to turning a profit when its released.  And hopefully every division in Sony will not have their greedy little fingers involved with the new console.  



"If you've got them by the balls their hearts and minds will follow."

Quote by- The Imortal John Wayne, the original BADASS!

 

 

 

Something to consider, Sony's only ever won against Nintendo when they've launch 1-2 years before them (PSvsN64, PS2vsGC).  When they launched alongside them or slightly after (PSPvsDS, PS3vsWii) they've lost, and lost big.



Mummelmann said:

If so, Sony are more stupid that I thought. Here I was, thinking that perhaps this gen had taught them something.


Begins to throw dirt on Sony's grave



snfr said:

Don't know why some would think that this is a bad idea. IMO the PS3 could easily exist besides the Wii2 and the next Xbox. They have the most powerful console right now and I don't expect a really big jump in performance for the next consoles of Ninty and MS, simply because they know that performance is not all. That said the PS3 could have an advantage because it will obviously be cheaper than future consoles.

And if anyone thinks that Sony will finish 3rd next gen because of that... well... I think Sony doesn't care at all how they finish in the console war as long as they sell many units of the PS4.


Bad Idea, because Nintendo is going to be disruptive again, as we've seen with the 3DS, Nintendo really understand what disruption is, better than any other company, so giving Nintendo even a small head-start will result in Sony being left dead and broken on the side of the road



dunno001 said:

Actually, his post is not insinuating that. You're reading that from the post, because that's what you're looking for. I'll look at things by device:

Control stick: This first showed up in the 70s, through full-sized joysticks, to weird ones like the Odyssey, to even a disk that acts fairly close to the modern PSP-nub. Nintendo made this fade into obscurity with the control pad, to bring it back later on the N64. Sony copied this resurgance from said 64, though I give neither credit for inventing it. Weird how Nintendo basically re-trivialized their own revolution...

Rumble pack: I'm afraid I'm going to have to give this one to Nintendo for the home market. Again, going to the N64 days, it came with Starfox 64, and was the first console game to give you force feedback. There were higher-end PC controllers and arcade doing it first, though, so I'm not going to say Nintendo invented it. But people liked it for Starfox, so what feature showed up in the dual-shock? Hrm, even looking at the name, it shows that Sony copied two things at once for that controller. Again, not Nintendo's inventions, but Nintendo's making them popular.

Motion controls: Lemme guess, you want to cite the Eye Toy? Wrong. Way back when, there were a few little-known accessories for the NES, things called the Power Glove and U-Force. This was the first experience with console motion. But what popularized motion? Not Eye-toy. (And no, it wasn't the Wiimote either. That only set the base for ensuring everyone had access to motion.) What popularized it was Konami's Bemani series, specifically, moving your feet to Dance Dance Revolution, and your hands to Para Para Paradise. And yes, both of these had home versions, complete with arcade controls, before the Eye-Toy came out. Unfortunately, PPP did not leave Japan, but the DDR craze was a whole different thing in the Americas. I will give Sony credit for the Eye-Toy being the first camera-type device, but their later Move is a Wiimote with glowing balls. Again, attempting to copy how Nintendo made a motion standard that was actually popular, and not relegated to 1 series of games as an add-on accessory.

I find it funny you say I shouldn't insinuate things, and yet you did.  Where did I say Sony invented any of these things?

Control Stick: Actually there were at least 2 systems that released in '82 that contained an analog stick that could be controlled using only your thumb.  Atari's 5200 and Smith Engineering's Vectrex.  However, for awhile consoles lost interest in analog controls.  In '95/'96 Sony began to invest in the tech again, feeling it would be beneficial for gaming.  They released a flight stick in April '96 that used analog joysticks.  The same month the N64 was released, however it used a digital thumbstick.  A year later Sony released the Dual Analog, a control scheme many have replicated since (even Nintendo).  BTW, the DA also featured...

Rumble Pak: internal rumble.  This was a feature taken out of the American version of the Dual Analog, but eventually made its way to America in the form of an improved DA, the Dual Shock.  Notice the date of the DA's release, April '97.  The same month the Rumble Pak launched.  Of course, no one uses rumble packs anymore, instead opting for internal rumble.  And if you want to be technical about it, Tobal 2 was the first game on consoles to give you force feedback.  It released 2 days before Star Fox.

Motion Control:  Actually there was a motion controller before the Power Glove and U-Force (which were actually made by Mattel and Broderbund, respectively), it was called Le Stick and was for the Atari 2600.  Also, DDR is not motion sensitive.  It's based on pushing buttons/pads, not the motion of your body.  However, I will give you PPP, as it sensed your hands movements.  But, I will still give Nintendo the credit for making motion control HUGE.  And I wouldn't say Sony copied Nintendo, as there is proof they were working on the Move back when the EyeToy debuted.  However, it did take the Wii's success to push them to refine it and actually put it out, as it didn't seem like they were in much of a rush to do so on their own.  I will also say they drew inspiration for the controller's layout.  Of course, there isn't much you can do with the layout a controller of that type.

The thing I don't understand about your first 2 points (and one's Nintendo fans usually bring up), is how is the N64 responsible for popularizing those things?  I mean really.  What is going to reach more people, and therefore be more influentual and popular, a system that didn't even reach 33 mil sold, or one that sold over 102 mil?  I think the answer is obvious.  And if it's not for you, who did everyone emulate the following gen, the N64 or the PS?  Looking at controllers and the media format games came out on, I'd go with PS.