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Forums - General - Why I am leaving the US...

TheRealMafoo said:
zarx said:

well an early welcome to NZ man hope you like it. As for why you are leaving people choosing 40-45 rather   100-60 is pretty odd, but I think one reason may be that people think it's more likely. As for stealing from the rich I don't see how the US government is doing that, I mean I could argue that many of the richest people are stealing from the poor as a lot of them don't pay much if any taxes. But what do I know I gust live in New Zealand. 


Just an FYI. The lower 47% of the US pays no federal tax. The top 5% of the income earners pay 60% of all federal income tax.

What I mean by stealing, is taking from someone for the sole purpose of giving it to someone else. That's stealing in my book. I would be ok with the statistic I gave you, if that was just to "run the country". It's not. A lot of money collected is given away to others.

Every dollar given to an american from the federal government, was first taken from someone else.


The top 5 income earners pay 60% of all federal income tax easily reasoned by the fact that their taxes alone is an equalizer for over 60% of the others in the nation. Sustainability must not be an issue to you.



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A country imports more goods than it exports is regarded  as a Consumer economy. US is the leading Consumer economy: most of its economic growth relies heavily on consumer spending. US makes huge current account deficits and accrues foreign debt which increases with accumulating interest.  China is  becoming the leading exporter in the world but is still a developing nation. China makes no current account deficits and China is the leading creditor to the foreign debt. 

The US once was the leading exporter and leading creditor for the majority of the 20th century. Things have turned around so dramatically. China's GDP in comparison of world's GDP is only 6%. It reached a peak in 1840 when it was around 33% of the world's GDP. 

We all hope the Chinese do not follow the US lead to financial oblivion and lost opportunity. Spain was once a great financial empire prior to the 16th century then it collapsed and never fully recovered. 



mrstickball said:
NoddyHolder said:
mrstickball said:
NoddyHolder said:
1) sure, but all money was created at some point, also, you assume that I agree with what people are paid for there jobs, which I do not.

2) seriously? your using a rare extreme here? I guess, but then i can just say this to you: it would be that rare and extreme for someone to abuse benefits too, so we should still have them because only a few will abuse the system that benefits the others.

50% of all divorces are due to arguments about money...So its not a rare case. Its actually quite common, in fact.

If you want to be one of those people that don't even agree with anyone being paid more for hard work, be my guest. I just wonder how much you'll change that in 10 years :-p

not what im saying actually, but good for you to resort to cheap insinuations.

You said that people spending unwisely was a rare extreme. I told you that not only was it not a rare extreme (it happens a lot), but money is a central subject in relationships and divorces...Hence why its important to reach proper agreements on its usage. Trust me, I've been in a relationship for 7 years. I know how money & women work :-p

I wasn't trying to insinuate anything, just point to the actual statistics to blow up your inexperienced statements.

I don't understand how you thought he said your insinuation was regarding point 2, not point 1.  I mean, statements about divorce statistics, vs. saying someone doesn't think hard work should be rewarded ... which is more accusatory? 



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

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I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

fastyxx said:

@ OP

One down, 100 million to go.  Take Rush and Sarah with you, if you please.


If all the people you want to leave left, who's money would you spend? All people would have to actually pay there own way.



TheRealMafoo said:
numonex said:

 

Along came the Global Financial Crisis and the big Credit Crunch and the world is in big financial turmoil. Who was in for 8 years leading up the big crash? Boston Tea Party Republican George W.Bush  admin. wasted all the US tax payers money and raided pension funds to finance two Vietnam 2.0 Wars costing trillions plus interest. 

Generous tax cuts for the wealthy elite and huge US budget deficits were racked up every year under the careful governance of George W. Bush. 

Obama has not been able to turn things around because the US economy is royally screwed. Unemployment has doubled from 5% to 10%. The US deficits and national debt are growing and growing all the time. Asset prices have fallen all over. the two wars in Middle East continue with no end in sight. 

Austerity measures will kick in with increase taxes and cuts in spending. Short term pain for long term gain is needed to bring the Zombie US economy back from the dead.

The US Budget was balanced under the Democrats Clinton Admin. National debt was being paid off. Tax rates were higher under Clinton than under Bush. But the Government budget was balanced and the US economy was in a much better shape under President Clinton. Along came Republican George W. Bush who changed everything for the worse.


Dude, get off your politically brainwashed ass and do me a favor. Think for yourself.

First off, for 2 of the 8 years Bush was president, Congress was run by Democrats. Congress controls the budget, not the president. Like wise, many years under clinton, Republicans owned Congress.

It's not all "Democrats are awesome" and "Republicans are evil" or vise versa. The only people who could possibly think that, are those who have no thoughts of there own.

That's your rebuttal?  Jesus.

 

On Topic (I think?):

Good luck in Middle Earth.  Hope you stay a part of the community online, gamers need to not become too hive-mindish.



 

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TheRealMafoo said:
fastyxx said:

@ OP

One down, 100 million to go.  Take Rush and Sarah with you, if you please.


If all the people you want to leave left, who's money would you spend? All people would have to actually pay there own way.

I understand that there isn't any changing your opinions on any of this that you're presenting as a problem...seeing as how this is comment page 20-21.....But keep in mind that a vast majority actually enjoy living here in the US of A....And you're also not going to change their (my) opinions on the matter.  So all you're doing here is justifying to yourself your reasoning for leaving what I see as a great country to live in...No need to justify it to any of us, really.
 



Just waiting for that PS Vita to come out so I can play some full featured games on the go with that beautiful screen and control scheme...

Vanbierk said:
TheRealMafoo said:
fastyxx said:

@ OP

One down, 100 million to go.  Take Rush and Sarah with you, if you please.


If all the people you want to leave left, who's money would you spend? All people would have to actually pay there own way.

I understand that there isn't any changing your opinions on any of this that you're presenting as a problem...seeing as how this is comment page 20-21.....But keep in mind that a vast majority actually enjoy living here in the US of A....And you're also not going to change their (my) opinions on the matter.  So all you're doing here is justifying to yourself your reasoning for leaving what I see as a great country to live in...No need to justify it to any of us, really.
 

I think you underestimate the problem ...

If you look at the migration statistics within most countries you can see people moving from one region to another when the kinds of problems that TheRealMafoo brings up exist in one region and not the other. A disproportionate number of these people who are migrating away from these problems are entrepreneurs and people in high value careers, and the region that scares these people away tends to see a reduction in standard of living and slower growth because of the loss of these individuals. 

While it is not as common, when a country is too small to offer much variety or the problems become widespread these individuals tend to be the first to leave the country; and much like the regional migration, the country they leave sees a reduction in standard of living and slower growth in the future.

There are reasons why cities like Detroit will never recover, and one of the reasons is that the people who can fix it left a long time ago.



 But you only get to keep some of that. 4 months out of your life, you get to work so you can give all your efforts to someone who doesn't work. All those people who you worked harder then, get to not pay taxes, Instead, you pay it for them, and the guy who has been working the same job at the counter for the last 10 years, gets part of his monthly spending money off government assistance that you have to pay for.


So if the USA government disbanded the IRS and switched to the fair tax you would stay?  Also, would you want to wipe out welfare completely, child credits, medicare, medicaid, and social security.  I wish I could op out of social security considering it won't be there if I hit 65 or very little will be paid out (taxation without representation, just like the new health care bill, you start paying taxes on it then years later you can maybe get health coverage?).  One tax that poor people pay more proportionally is social security since only the first 100k is taxed and after that it isn't taxed at all.  So people that make less than 100k pay more proportionally in social security tax than someone that makes over 100k.  They could just take that cap limit off and then possibly save social security (which it will only just prolong its death).  Anyways, the government is a huge waste and inefficient.  However, private companies are too greedy to run most things and can be just as corrupt as government (especially when there is little or no competition).  It is a catch 22 because in reality everyone is greedy and corrupted.  Power corrupts is the best saying.  Maybe if the politicians ever learned how to balance a budget I would respect them a little more.   Instead of being able to vote themselves for a pay raise each year while they drive the nation further in debt they should get a 50% wage cut with no pay raise in sight until they learn how to actually balance a budget / gain surplus to start paying off the national debt.  If someone had a job performance rating as low as Congress then they would be fired.  Problem is people vote them out "fire" them and they are replaced by another lobbyist controlled politician that will carry out the same agenda/wasteful spending as the predecessor.



HappySqurriel said:
Vanbierk said:
TheRealMafoo said:
fastyxx said:

@ OP

One down, 100 million to go.  Take Rush and Sarah with you, if you please.


If all the people you want to leave left, who's money would you spend? All people would have to actually pay there own way.

I understand that there isn't any changing your opinions on any of this that you're presenting as a problem...seeing as how this is comment page 20-21.....But keep in mind that a vast majority actually enjoy living here in the US of A....And you're also not going to change their (my) opinions on the matter.  So all you're doing here is justifying to yourself your reasoning for leaving what I see as a great country to live in...No need to justify it to any of us, really.
 

I think you underestimate the problem ...

If you look at the migration statistics within most countries you can see people moving from one region to another when the kinds of problems that TheRealMafoo brings up exist in one region and not the other. A disproportionate number of these people who are migrating away from these problems are entrepreneurs and people in high value careers, and the region that scares these people away tends to see a reduction in standard of living and slower growth because of the loss of these individuals. 

While it is not as common, when a country is too small to offer much variety or the problems become widespread these individuals tend to be the first to leave the country; and much like the regional migration, the country they leave sees a reduction in standard of living and slower growth in the future.

There are reasons why cities like Detroit will never recover, and one of the reasons is that the people who can fix it left a long time ago.


Much like some immigrants who go to a country just to make money and then leave it without any form of loyalty. The saddest thing about America is that people can take a disproportionate piece of the wealth and then act like its a good thing to leave when people don't kiss their ass. If you are member of the capitalist class, then act like it. There are risks that come with being rich, because if most haven't noticed, they are making money at others demise. It's a tilted scale. Other people want money now more than ever. One who makes millions fucks over hundreds, but one who makes billions fucks over thousands and possibly millions of people on the scale of wealth. There are plenty of middle class people moving out of the country as well for a better life, which is way more than the minority of rich who own the majority of the nations wealth (which is obviously why they pay higher taxes).



TheRealMafoo said:

Well, it's been a few months since I posted. I took a trip to New Zealand looking for a new home. I found it just north of Wellington, along the cost.

45 minute electric train ride into town and on an amazing beach, not bad at all.

Anyway, for those that know me (or don't know me), the reason I am leaving the US, is it's broken and can't be fixed. I am a problem solver at heart. I worked in a think tank for the US military for 7 years, with the sole purpose of solving technical problems that the rest of the organization I worked for could not. So it's just something I naturally do.

About 3 years ago I started looking into the problem of the US decline. Trying to figure it out. I finally did. The real problem with America, is the mindset of the it's people. I asked this simple question on many forums, including this one:

If you could rate human quality of life on a scale of 1 to 100. 1 being the worst, and 100 being the best, would you rather live in a world where the best was 100, and the worst was 60, or the best was 45 and the worst was 40?

Shockingly, more people picked the second option. People care less about there absolute position in life, and care more about there relative postion compared to everyone else. This then justifies the redistribution of wealth, and the root of our problems. The wrong people are not in office. They are the people a majority want ruling, and are doing what a majority of the people want them to do.

All the polls showing unhappiness are more upset that these philosophies are not working. No one is upset that we steal from the rich. They are just upset with the results of such actions. When you steal from the rich, everyone losses. What's happening is exactly what I have predicted will happen (along with every other economic conservative). Next year, we are going to start stealing a lot more from the rich, and thus the consequences we see from those actions will continue to grow. We are heading into a deeper depression, and our leaders are sending us there. They are sending us there by doing what a majority of the voters want them to do. We are moving more from the first option of my question, to the second. We are doing so, because we are getting exactly what we as a people think we want.

 

To fix the problem of a failing US government, you first have to fix the mindset of the people electing our leaders. Sadly, this takes at least a generation of time to do, and I don't wish to wait that long. Plus, I don't think the US will survive that long, at least not as the US I grew up in. 

So, time for me to leave. New Zealand was everything I imagined and more. We are on a plan to move in the summer of 2011. First and formost, is we have to sell our house. Not the best time to be selling it, but we will do what we can.

Take care everyone :)


I think that without people who believe as you do that America's chances to change attitudes is even less likely.  Without role models who exemplify said beliefs and behaviors where will they even get the idea that such a change is possible let alone plausible?

By being an active and visible you have far more opportunity to change things than you do by leaving.  People are always astounded to find out that I'm gay simply because I don't fit the perceived stereotypes.  Simply by being an active and visible member of my community I have managed to change many negative attitudes.  Not only about homosexuality but African Americans and other attitudes as well.  People often don't understand how the world can be different from what they assume it is until they perceive that change. 

If nothing else I might ask a little patriotism of you and say that the community that grew you and allowed you to foster your beliefs and ideals might be worth sticking around to support in it's darkest hours.

Either way I wish you the best of luck.