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Forums - General - AT&T to cut employee benefits due to $1B tax increase.

Final-Fan said:

Governments are the biggest nonprofit organizations out there.

The problem with Non-profits is... nobody regulates how much Non-profits pay themselves.

http://philanthropy.com/blogPost/Nonprofit-CEOs-Who-Want/21792/

I don't trust Non-profit companies anymore then for Profit companies because of this.   Non Profit companies actually have 1 less group to answer to...

stockholders.

Non Profit companies need tighter regulations.



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Khuutra said:
The government will inevitably spend it on something, I'm sure. Contrary to what humorists believe, government can't actually shoot money out into space.

There spending it on the Healthcare bill... and then some.

It's part of the "planned savings" that pays for it.  Well... so was the money they cut. 

Hey did you ever get around to that "Why healthcare would cost more post" I made instead of Mafoo.  Hate for that thing to be wasted.  Either way, this is a good example of why.


Either way, it's a good thing the loophole was closed... but it shouldn't of been closed until unemployment went down a bit more and the Medicare benefits kicked in.  I don't believe they have yet.



Final-Fan said:
For your first question, that's not the way the private sector is wired.

I think that nonprofits/gov'ts have done plenty to benefit medicine, thank you very much.

And if the internet was left to for-profits, it probably wouldn't exist at all, let alone in its current state of development.

Look, if you're thinking I'm trying to say that being nonprofit would make any and all organizations automatically more effective, I'm not. But I'm calling bullshit on your 99%. And for things like heath insurance, I think that non-profit may well be superior.

You'd be surprised. 

Apparently the top 5 US hospitals conduct more clinical trials then all the hospitals in any one country... and the US spends more on research... and the vast majority of useful medical discoveries come from the US.

Most non-profit involvement in research is colleges getting funding from for profit sources.

Whether this is do to the US not having socialized medicine or some other phenomena is unknown... but overwhelmingly chances are the next big discovery that extends peoples lives are going to come from the US. 

It's roughly the same odds as saying the next World Cup Winner is going to come from Europe or Brazil.  Argentina might do it.

 

All Goverments and Non-profits really do is handle stuff after the for profit companys get them started.  Drug companies will fund college studies with the right to the drugs.   Non-profits will secure the rights to distribute and manufactuer the drugs in areas that can't afford them anyway, like Africa.   Colleges with government grants will also go to drug companies just because they need the help.  Etc.



Ha, sounds like the opposite of how someone above said grants usually work in other fields.



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Final-Fan said:
Ha, sounds like the opposite of how someone above said grants usually work in other fields.

It is different in other fields.  Mostly because those other fields aren't profitable.  Those grants mostly go for stuff like biofuel research... stuff that's seen as too costly with little reward for private sectors.

Medical field though... that's almost all private.

Outside of earmarks and such, which are rapidly being cut down on.

Another fun show of how Non-profits can get a bit crazy with employee pay.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0310/35050.html

 

Maybe the House should hire some cheaper help...

 



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Kasz216 said:
Khuutra said:
The government will inevitably spend it on something, I'm sure. Contrary to what humorists believe, government can't actually shoot money out into space.

There spending it on the Healthcare bill... and then some.

It's part of the "planned savings" that pays for it.  Well... so was the money they cut. 

Hey did you ever get around to that "Why healthcare would cost more post" I made instead of Mafoo.  Hate for that thing to be wasted.  Either way, this is a good example of why.


Either way, it's a good thing the loophole was closed... but it shouldn't of been closed until unemployment went down a bit more and the Medicare benefits kicked in.  I don't believe they have yet.

I will be honest: I read it, but didn't respond to it because it would have counted as one of my five. I couold now that I'm pretty sure Mafoo won't be going back to that topic but eeeehhhhhhh. Rest assured, though, it was read.



Khuutra said:
Kasz216 said:
...
Hey did you ever get around to that "Why healthcare would cost more post" I made instead of Mafoo.  Hate for that thing to be wasted.  Either way, this is a good example of why.
...

I will be honest: I read it, but didn't respond to it because it would have counted as one of my five. I couold now that I'm pretty sure Mafoo won't be going back to that topic but eeeehhhhhhh. Rest assured, though, it was read.

One of your five??



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
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The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
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Khuutra said:
Kasz216 said:
Khuutra said:
The government will inevitably spend it on something, I'm sure. Contrary to what humorists believe, government can't actually shoot money out into space.

There spending it on the Healthcare bill... and then some.

It's part of the "planned savings" that pays for it.  Well... so was the money they cut. 

Hey did you ever get around to that "Why healthcare would cost more post" I made instead of Mafoo.  Hate for that thing to be wasted.  Either way, this is a good example of why.


Either way, it's a good thing the loophole was closed... but it shouldn't of been closed until unemployment went down a bit more and the Medicare benefits kicked in.  I don't believe they have yet.

I will be honest: I read it, but didn't respond to it because it would have counted as one of my five. I couold now that I'm pretty sure Mafoo won't be going back to that topic but eeeehhhhhhh. Rest assured, though, it was read.

Fair enough.  Either way, this itself is the first sign of proof.  If AT&T cuts benefits... employees of AT&T are going to have to pay more.  It almost certiantly is going to raise costs for everyone.  The real issue is will it be worth it for the extra coverage of some people... and how many people will actually suffer because they can't afford as much coverage or any with it being raised by comparrison.

Although ironically it may cost less specifically for your grandmother despite it costing more for the average person.


Louisiana actually got a kickback for increased medicare funding above and beyond everyone else.

 



Final-Fan said:
Ha, sounds like the opposite of how someone above said grants usually work in other fields.

Some grants can be good.

I used to work for the Air Force Research Laboratory, and we awarded grants of 250,000. The way it worked though, was if we needed something in-house that we could not find, we would put out a request. People would come in and try and win the award. We would pick who we thought would do the best, and give them enough money to make what we needed.

There were 4 phases (I think) of the system, if they passes the first mark, we would fund them with more money.

So while this is a "grant" program, it's really just paying someone for a service/product.

Most didn't get past the first phase. The best one I worked on, was when I was working for the Air Force Test and Evaluation Center, on a project for JEOD (the military's bomb squad). We needed a wearable computer, and all the specs we needed didn't exist, so we paid a company to make the items we need.

The "win-win", is we get the items we need, and what they come up with they get to sell (if they can). We basically give them the seed money.

Here is what my team ended up creating (well, funding the creation of):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OQO

funny line: "The original OQO model 01 was announced several years before prototypes were even seen". Not by me ;)

But anyway, as you can see they went out of business, and that's because the reason they needed us to seed them, is because there was no market for the product. In the end, we got what we needed (so that's cool), but as a way to help the market... not sure that it works.