Before I start I wanted to say that I am not a Sony or Microsoft fan.  I have both consoles and really have no need to bash either.  Both have their pros and cons; really no reason to bitch about a specific one.

I watched Sony’s GDC presentation yesterday which focused on their new motion controller, the “Move”.  During E3 last year I was not really surprised that they were developing a motion controller; however, I was surprised that they were directly trying to compete with Nintendo.  After watching and reading the GDC coverage from yesterday’s press conference, I think Sony has taken a significant step in the wrong direction. 

Essentially, the Move is an advanced version of Nintendo’s Wii-Mote.  It definitely looks like it, apparently feels like it and has a significant amount of software based off of the same principles that have made the Wii so successful (reference http://wii.ign.com/articles/107/1076600p1.html.    If Sony is going after the casual market with this thing (which they obviously are), is it not a little late for them to enter the market with a non-differentiated product?  Sure Sony will have “Move Enabled” games catering to the hardcore gamer (Ex. Socom 4); however, the point of this thing is to capture a new market not serve an existing one.  If I was a casual gamer why on earth would I buy a bundled Move-PS3?  I could go get a Wii which has more software catered to my tastes, is cheaper and is far more established in this space.      

I am not saying that the move and to a broader extent the PS3 doesn’t have a good value proposition; what I am saying is that their go-to-market strategy is not viable if they are targeting the casual gamer.       

The PS3 is a great console and IMO, has the best 1^st party line-up.  God of War 3, Uncharted 2, GT5, etc, are among (or will be among) the best titles released this generation on any console.  IMO it would have made a lot more sense for Sony to focus solely on the hardcore market by continuing to release amazing hardcore games.  This is especially notable this year since Microsoft has a lot of good games in their pipeline this year (Reach, Fable, Splinter Cell, Alan Wake etc.).  Why not focus on eliminating Microsoft from this space?  Why not try to take over the online space and create an offering that can effectively compete with Live?  Why not try to innovate something that caters to who is interested in buying your product rather than releasing something that already exists?

What are your thoughts on the Move and Natal and their effect on the causal gaming market?  Also, do you agree or disagree with Sony’s approach?                

I think it's less about the casual market as more about the "Wii cannot sell hardcore software" which we know is false, but by offering something like the Wii developer's could indeed what would have been exclusive Wii only HARDCORE game's from 3rd party , now there would be 2 Platform's with pretty much the same control scheme

porting 3rd party app's which compete with 1st party Nintendo App's have a tendency to favor Nintendo not 3rd party's . this way they can get more sales for the 3rd party.

this I think is more about getting more 3rd party developer's to put their Wii only application's now on the PS3 also.

You bring up a valid point.  Porting hardcore Wii games to the PS3 or having multi-platform development for upcoming games.  The only thing is that I can maybe count 5 worthy 3rd party hardcore games on the Wii that are not first party.  I think Sony is clearly targeting the casual gamer with this thing.    

I agree that this is specifically designed for two reasons, the first to obviously try and get a percentage of the casual market. The second is clearly to take all the disenfranchised 3rd party WII developers and give them a HD console where they might be able to sell more games. I personally think that this is the perfect idea for Sony who has such a diverse lineup it gives the casual fans significant support. People who own a PS3 with kids have very few quality kid friendly titles to choose from, LBP, Ratchet and Clank, Rockband, Guitar Hero, and the BUZZ series pretty much makes up the list of quality kid friendly games not including sports titles or the terrible disney kid games.

Again though, this is not attracting any new entrants, just focusing on serving a niche within its existing install base...

The hardcore market is tiny in comparison to the 'casual' market, and with both Nintendo and Microsoft actively targeting these casual gamers more and more it only makes sense for Sony to want a piece of the pie as well.

Although I think their approach is backwards. They already have a console that has a solid casual market, mind you not a great penetration rate into that market like Nintendo has. So they decide to release a camera, that tracks balls, on a controller with a lot of buttons and wireless connectivity with 'sub controllers'? Not casual friendly to say the least.

I have seen people give up on playing the Wii, beacause the controller's wouldn't sinc, which in my mind means that simplicity is key without being simplistic, Sony seems to have the function with the 'Move' but not the form. The thing looks like a Dualshock re-designed in wand form, it's dosn't look simple, intuitive or easy to understand, add that it has to interact with a camera and the 'casuals' will be turned off.

Sony should have, dare I say it... copied Nintendo... more, release a easy to use and understand motion controller that people can pretty much 'plug and play'.

But now I'm getting side-tracked.

You said, Sony should focus on the hardcore market more

I answer: how can they?

They already (has you said) have a great 'core' lineup (although I dispute the core-ness of games like Uncharted 2) but that's an argument for another day. So why not take a more casual approach? It makes sense business wise, it makes sense strategy wise, it makes sense positioning wise, it makes sense marketing wise, it makes sense branding wise, in short, it just makes sense.

Yes the more 'hardcore' gamers (otherwise known has the ones who spend more time on the internet then gaming - the only ones we hear from) will hate this new direction that Sony and Microsoft are going in, but these companies have a universal goal, to please their investors, and if that means making 'casuals' happy with games like Little Big Planet, Sony 'Move', Natal, Mario Kart Wii, New Super Mario Bros. Wii then that's what they will do.

Now I'm a gamer, a hardcore one at that (meaning I spend more time on VGChartz then with a controller in my hand) and yes I would love to have a new Metroid or Fire Emblem in my hands every year but I understand that business is business and making these kinds of games A: isin't profitable and B: dosn't please the investors so they make Wii Sports and to solve both those issues.

Look at the sales charts (that's what this site is for right?) Look at the games that light it up:

Call Of Duty
Halo
The Legend Of Zelda
Uncharted
Final Fantasy
Resident Evil
God Of War

ect. X infinite

These arn't core games, (although the 'core' gamer certainly believes they are) their bridge games, games that everybody can play, grasp and enjoy for whatever reason. these are the type of games that developers should focus on making, not the 'super hardcore games' that only a few thousand people will enjoy, but games that the majority of people who own your system will play and like and recommend to others.

Their is beginning to be a feeling that Casual = Kiddy, this could not be further from the truth. Sony clearly wants God Of War to be a success, and they can't have that with just making a 'super hardcore game', no they will advertise, they will push to the 'casual market',but think about it, their going to have to enjoy the game to recommend it to other people right? So Sony puts in a more 'casual friendly' design and simple puzzles and easy modes to ease people into the experience. I'm just using God Of War as an example, but look all around you, the reason games starts with tutorials and explanations is to ease new gamers (see casuals: who don't know every single detail on a game months before release) into the experience, make it fun for THEM so they can propel sales skyward. Why do they do this? Beacause they know that you and I, already know how to play and they know we will buy it and so will our freinds, they know this, they want new gamers to buy their products.

Now I'm sorry I went on such a long rant, but reading your OP made me want to get some stuff off my chest here, just some feelings and thoughts I'v been having.

: )

sony Know's stealing the casual market away from Nintendo is most likely never going to happen, but getting 3rd party developer's another option for a platform is what sony is mainly going for here. and with the ability to add motion control's to other previous ps3 game's it retro active update's the game's with more motion controls

Just look at warhawk it already has motion control's and so does little big planet, now add in Eyepet, modnation racer's flower, flow

it's not only a good thing for Sony and Microsoft but aslo 3rd party's because this should also increase more 3rd party Wii hardcore game's

AT least I hope.

Sony isn't going after the casual audience by competing with the Wii, they're trying to make it so that the PS3 is the go to system for all audiences.

What I mean is, say you are a father of two and looking to buy your first video game console in your new home for you and your family. You prefer the hardcore shooter games such as Call of Duty and SOCOM and would like to have the luxury of having a blu-ray player, however your family would like to have casual games such as Wii Sports and Move Party. You can either buy a Wii and completely cater to your family while ignoring your wants or you can go with PS3 and get everything you want as well as games for your family.

I agree that essentially Sony is trying to do with the Wii's control setup what Nintendo cannot do with the Wii and that is bring it to the HD market. All in all, not a bad idea.  How well it will be recieved on the PS3 is a big unknown.  Like Microsoft's Natal, Sony is asking PS3 owners to invest in new hardware for their system which historically does not do that well.  All of these are interesting ideas, just not sure if they'll fly in the market.  It's not the same as the launch of the Wii, since it was it's own whole product that only required the buyer to purchase more of the same controllers.  Both the PS3 and the 360 are well established in another market.  The PS3's version might be more successful overall because developers can easily make Wii and PS3 versions of the same game, at least in the way they control.  In that case, directly ripping off the Wii control scheme might be the path with the greater chance of success.  Natal is way out somewhere else and is bigger gamble, from the way I see it.  I don't think either manufacturer is playing with odds that I would go to Vegas with, though.

I give this thread a 9.6.

So far the Move really hasn't impressed me. Ignoring the fact that if I want to allow just myself to play I have to have two Move wands, a nunchuck, and an Eye Toy, it's still pretty much the Wii to me.

I've read the articles that point out the differences and they really aren't enough to overwhelm me. Everything they showed me I can already do on the Wii except the Move one looks prettier and might be a little better. That a little better isn't really something I can justify spending $100+ on.

Don't get me wrong, I'm still following it and I'm interested, but I need more than rereleases of games, Sony Sports Resort, and an on-rails shooter to convince me.  Give me something I can't even come close to doing on the Wii.

If this had come out two years ago when I was still all over motion controls I might be a little more excited, but I'm pretty much over it. The first few years of the Wii's life I bought games just because of the motion controls and some where fun, some weren't, but they were all interesting because they were new.

Now, meh.

They just haven't shown me something to justify spending $160+ on (game + accessories).