SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: I dont believe them because human beings tend to see/hear what they want to see/hear, whether they think they want to see/hear it or not. in the end theres probably a rational explenation, people just chose not to believe it for personal reasons, whether concious or sub-concious. I will believe these things when I see them, as ive never seen or experienced anything in my entire life that even suggests that they do, nor have I seen ANY evidence of them or to even suggest them. all these "stories" are incredibly convinient as NO-ONE, EVER takes a picture of video or documents some evidence of them, which leads me to believe that my original hypothesis (that its just humans wanting to see/hear these things) is the correct one. not to mention there are all kinds of things that could make you see/hear things that arent there (drugs, alcohol, illness) your entitled to believe what you want, but im just as entitled to think the way I do. For the sake of arguement... who the hell is going to be taping or recording something that spontaniously happens. For example, the above story of a massive metal door slamming on it's own... why would i be videotaping that? If you can come up with a logical reason for a heavy metal door to shut, i'm all ears... cause i've on an off thought about it for about 7-10 years.   wind, a human, you imagined it? all 3 are possibilities, or as I said, you just think those things dindt cause it or you wanted it to be unexplainable and so your brain finds a reason to reject them. in that case, I accept you wouldnt video it or anything, but some of the things people describe (not neccesarily here) in this context suggest they had more than enough time to do so, also given the number of these stories people claim, its hard to believe NO-ONE ever had even a camera phone on hand they could have easily used to prove there story.

Wind is going to blow a giant metal door shut... that's designed to resist explosions from bombs?  Let alone... wind UNDERGROUND?

A human, would be impossible as had already been stated...

and how would I imagine it?  The door was open... then it was closed... and someone was with me.  We both imagined it?

 

I do believe the vast majority of such stories can be explained... but not all can.  For example the one i've mentioned, there was nobody near by... and it would take hurricane force winds to move that door.  It's a bomb shelter door... meant to withstand blasts from bombs.  Someone with me... so... unless it was some shared hallucination which in of itself is ridiculious... no way for imagination to be the case.

Concerning angels, demons, ghosts, alien visitors, and the like; they do not exist, but people can easily convince themselves that they do. If somebody wants to believe something, they will.

ManusJustus said: Concerning angels, demons, ghosts, alien visitors, and the like; they do not exist, but people can easily convince themselves that they do. If somebody wants to believe something, they will.

thank you, thats exactly what I was saying.

SciFiBoy said: ManusJustus said: Concerning angels, demons, ghosts, alien visitors, and the like; they do not exist, but people can easily convince themselves that they do. If somebody wants to believe something, they will. thank you, thats exactly what I was saying.

It's certaintly a convient position anyway, when you can't come up with a conclusion to what would move a giant metal door... in the presense of people who actually would perfer NOT to believe in random things such as ghosts and demons. There are legitimate unexplainable things that occur though rare. Ignoring them is just the same as deluding yourself in believing in your "pet" expeirece you want to exist. Like Alien abduction people. You are no better then those people if you believe there is nothing that happens that can not be currently explained.

Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: ManusJustus said: Concerning angels, demons, ghosts, alien visitors, and the like; they do not exist, but people can easily convince themselves that they do. If somebody wants to believe something, they will. thank you, thats exactly what I was saying. It's certaintly a convient position anyway, when you can't come up with a conclusion to what would move a giant metal door... in the presense of people who actually would perfer NOT to believe in random things such as ghosts and demons. There are legitimate unexplainable things that occur though rare. Ignoring them is just the same as deluding yourself in believing in your "pet" expeirece you want to exist. Like Alien abduction people.

either you do believe subconciously or you arent telling us something (like the door is one you need to prop open or it closes)

both are possible.

SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: ManusJustus said: Concerning angels, demons, ghosts, alien visitors, and the like; they do not exist, but people can easily convince themselves that they do. If somebody wants to believe something, they will. thank you, thats exactly what I was saying. It's certaintly a convient position anyway, when you can't come up with a conclusion to what would move a giant metal door... in the presense of people who actually would perfer NOT to believe in random things such as ghosts and demons. There are legitimate unexplainable things that occur though rare. Ignoring them is just the same as deluding yourself in believing in your "pet" expeirece you want to exist. Like Alien abduction people. either you do believe subconciously or you arent telling us something (like the door is one you need to prop open or it closes) both are possible.

The door didn't need a prop to open. You don't think I would of thought of that if this were the case? Your reaching. Hell dude lived in the house till he was like 25. I think I would of noticed. The second is just a silly explination. What would the second half to do with... well anything. What you believe or not isn't going to change something actually happening. To tell if it happened or not is as easy as seeing if the door is open or closed. Your deluding yourselself all the same.

Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: ManusJustus said: Concerning angels, demons, ghosts, alien visitors, and the like; they do not exist, but people can easily convince themselves that they do. If somebody wants to believe something, they will. thank you, thats exactly what I was saying. It's certaintly a convient position anyway, when you can't come up with a conclusion to what would move a giant metal door... in the presense of people who actually would perfer NOT to believe in random things such as ghosts and demons. There are legitimate unexplainable things that occur though rare. Ignoring them is just the same as deluding yourself in believing in your "pet" expeirece you want to exist. Like Alien abduction people. either you do believe subconciously or you arent telling us something (like the door is one you need to prop open or it closes) both are possible. The door didn't need a prop to open. You don't think I would of thought of that if this were the case? Your reaching. Hell dude lived in the house till he was like 25. I think I would of noticed. The second is just a silly explination. What would the second half to do with... well anything. What you believe or not isn't going to change something actually happening. To tell if it happened or not is as easy as seeing if the door is open or closed. Your deluding yourselself all the same.

im deluding myself?

youre the one claiming a door shut of its own accord...

SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: ManusJustus said: Concerning angels, demons, ghosts, alien visitors, and the like; they do not exist, but people can easily convince themselves that they do. If somebody wants to believe something, they will. thank you, thats exactly what I was saying. It's certaintly a convient position anyway, when you can't come up with a conclusion to what would move a giant metal door... in the presense of people who actually would perfer NOT to believe in random things such as ghosts and demons. There are legitimate unexplainable things that occur though rare. Ignoring them is just the same as deluding yourself in believing in your "pet" expeirece you want to exist. Like Alien abduction people. either you do believe subconciously or you arent telling us something (like the door is one you need to prop open or it closes) both are possible. The door didn't need a prop to open. You don't think I would of thought of that if this were the case? Your reaching. Hell dude lived in the house till he was like 25. I think I would of noticed. The second is just a silly explination. What would the second half to do with... well anything. What you believe or not isn't going to change something actually happening. To tell if it happened or not is as easy as seeing if the door is open or closed. Your deluding yourselself all the same. im deluding myself? youre the one claiming a door shut of its own accord...

Clearly. 

You can't come up with a logical reason for something to have happened.  Yet still try and come up with silly details that anyone with half a brain would of thought of.  "Something holds the door open when it needs to be open."

Really? 

That guy lived in that house until he was about 25.  I had plenty of chances to look at the door and try and figure out what happened.

You're the kind of person who could see something unexplainable with witnesses... come up and dismiss all possibilities and still be skeptical...

It's a VERY unscientific stance and very delusional.

The difference is... rather then being delusional to the fantastic... it's being delusional to what you know.  It's fairly common.  Scientists who stood in the way of scientific progress often try to explain away things that show their theories are wrong and stand in the way of progress in such cases.

They've always been proven wrong when new discoveries were aloud to be made by those who weren't so close minded.

Calling someone dellusional when they actually apply a scientific approach to figuring something out... is in fact delusional.

Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: ManusJustus said: Concerning angels, demons, ghosts, alien visitors, and the like; they do not exist, but people can easily convince themselves that they do. If somebody wants to believe something, they will. thank you, thats exactly what I was saying. It's certaintly a convient position anyway, when you can't come up with a conclusion to what would move a giant metal door... in the presense of people who actually would perfer NOT to believe in random things such as ghosts and demons. There are legitimate unexplainable things that occur though rare. Ignoring them is just the same as deluding yourself in believing in your "pet" expeirece you want to exist. Like Alien abduction people. either you do believe subconciously or you arent telling us something (like the door is one you need to prop open or it closes) both are possible. The door didn't need a prop to open. You don't think I would of thought of that if this were the case? Your reaching. Hell dude lived in the house till he was like 25. I think I would of noticed. The second is just a silly explination. What would the second half to do with... well anything. What you believe or not isn't going to change something actually happening. To tell if it happened or not is as easy as seeing if the door is open or closed. Your deluding yourselself all the same. im deluding myself? youre the one claiming a door shut of its own accord... Clearly.  You can't come up with a logical reason for something to have happened.  Yet still try and come up with silly details that anyone with half a brain would of thought of.  "Something holds the door open when it needs to be open." Really?  That guy lived in that house until he was about 25.  I had plenty of chances to look at the door and try and figure out what happened. You're the kind of person who could see something unexplainable with witnesses... come up and dismiss all possibilities and still be skeptical... It's a VERY unscientific stance and very delusional. The difference is... rather then being delusional to the fantastic... it's being delusional to what you know.  It's fairly common.  Scientists who stood in the way of scientific progress often try to explain away things that show their theories are wrong and stand in the way of progress in such cases. They've always been proven wrong when new discoveries were aloud to be made by those who weren't so close minded. Calling someone dellusional when they actually apply a scientific approach to figuring something out... is in fact delusional.

your whole argument assumes I am to believe your story, I see no reason to do so as it asserts something that you cant even prove...

SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: Kasz216 said: SciFiBoy said: ManusJustus said: Concerning angels, demons, ghosts, alien visitors, and the like; they do not exist, but people can easily convince themselves that they do. If somebody wants to believe something, they will. thank you, thats exactly what I was saying. It's certaintly a convient position anyway, when you can't come up with a conclusion to what would move a giant metal door... in the presense of people who actually would perfer NOT to believe in random things such as ghosts and demons. There are legitimate unexplainable things that occur though rare. Ignoring them is just the same as deluding yourself in believing in your "pet" expeirece you want to exist. Like Alien abduction people. either you do believe subconciously or you arent telling us something (like the door is one you need to prop open or it closes) both are possible. The door didn't need a prop to open. You don't think I would of thought of that if this were the case? Your reaching. Hell dude lived in the house till he was like 25. I think I would of noticed. The second is just a silly explination. What would the second half to do with... well anything. What you believe or not isn't going to change something actually happening. To tell if it happened or not is as easy as seeing if the door is open or closed. Your deluding yourselself all the same. im deluding myself? youre the one claiming a door shut of its own accord... Clearly.  You can't come up with a logical reason for something to have happened.  Yet still try and come up with silly details that anyone with half a brain would of thought of.  "Something holds the door open when it needs to be open." Really?  That guy lived in that house until he was about 25.  I had plenty of chances to look at the door and try and figure out what happened. You're the kind of person who could see something unexplainable with witnesses... come up and dismiss all possibilities and still be skeptical... It's a VERY unscientific stance and very delusional. The difference is... rather then being delusional to the fantastic... it's being delusional to what you know.  It's fairly common.  Scientists who stood in the way of scientific progress often try to explain away things that show their theories are wrong and stand in the way of progress in such cases. They've always been proven wrong when new discoveries were aloud to be made by those who weren't so close minded. Calling someone dellusional when they actually apply a scientific approach to figuring something out... is in fact delusional. your whole argument assumes I am to believe your story, I see no reason to do so as it asserts something that you cant even prove...

Now saying you don't believe me is a much better position. 

Still problematic however since I think i've generally show myself to be a reliable person when it comes to relating the facts.

I would say your not believing me would be soley based on your wanting to not believe me.

Either way, lets switch positions, and say this happened to you, and you went through every logical solution and found none... and then I called you delusional.  What would be your reaction?