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Forums - Gaming Discussion - "Metal Gear Solid" or "Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell"?

 

"Metal Gear Solid" or "Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell"?

Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots 183 73.49%
 
Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell: Conviction 66 26.51%
 
Total:249
Marco on 22 February 2010

Metal Gear Solid of course! best story, best caractere. and splinter cell is boring



the best RPG's are coming 2013 !!!! oh my god, this is perfect for RPG-GAMER = ) Ni No Kuni - 25 january, Time and Eternity, tales of xillia (PS3) and the maybe best game ever: metal gear solid ground zero


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rocketpig on 22 February 2010
huaxiong90 said:
rocketpig said:
huaxiong90 said:
AlkamistStar said:
I'm going with Splinter Cell on this one. Not to judge the new game Conviction, but the series as a whole, i even loved Double Agent, and played through multiple times. I think the SC series has always evolved sleath, and the use of shadows/hiding, while Metal Gear has remained unchanged. I shouldn't be able to pop a box out of nowhere and hide from a solider in MSG4...not anymore, that was for back in the day (and yes i have MGS4, and know the soliders can lift the box...but that's still more of the same).

Shooting out a light, using a EMP, or cutting the main line for a generator to cause chaos, and infiltrate a base however...that's sleath, and that's innovation. I've played through MGS4 about 4-5 times now with different playing styles to unlock different perks on my next playthrough, but on my last playthough it took like 5 hours to beat the whole game...5 HOURS! That's from skiping all the cut scenes. Is MGS4 a movie..no, but it's pretty damn close, and the series keeps getting filled with more cutscenes than gameplay.

Lastly i feel that long cutscenes are great, but throughout an entire game, it becomes a cheap way to tell a story. Many games have found innovative ways throughout gameplay (scripted events come to mind in CoD games), yet Kojima (and a lot of Japanese develops now a days) just throw cutscenes at you...it's like there's saying, "Here watch it...it'll explain everything, now you may run to the next cutscene...there you'll watch why you ran there" Splinter Cell has always been about raw gameplay, expanding on every feature from the last game, and that alone makes it the better franchise in my opinion.

I understand it's your opinion, but for me, and many other long-time Metal Gear fans, it's the story depth and the presentation of the whole single player that stands out. Kojima is better at it than any other Japanese dev I know of.

Kojima's presentation is wonderful. The story itself, though? Not so much. It's convoluted, repetitive (HORRIBLY repetitive), and non-sensical a lot of the time.

Convoluted plot does not equal deep story. It just means it's convoluted. I'd call it directorial masturbation more than anything else. It doesn't mean you shouldn't like it but let's call a spade a spade here.

Repetitive? All Metal Gear games are connected to one storyline, dude. And it may be overly complex, but I still understand what they're talking about most of the time. And should I not understand a specific thing, I just look it up on the net.

 

But to each their own, really. I still stand by my opinion that it has one of the best storylines in a game ever.

My friend and I counted a re-wording of the same sentence four times in the same cutscene.

By any measure, that has to be considered repetitive. I got it the first time, thanks. I don't need plot lines handed to me on a silver platter.

Kojima treats his audiences as if they're borderline retarded. Most of those 20 minutes cutscenes could be 5-10 minutes and deliver as much, if not more, content than their current iterations if the repetition and fat were removed from them.

And I didn't call it complex. I called it convoluted. Complex implies depth where convoluted just means there's a mish-mash of rubbish thrown in to distract from the core theme.




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Wagram on 22 February 2010

I am not a big fan of the Splinter Cell games. They are alright, but nothing i'll ever really remember or want to play again.



huaxiong90 on 22 February 2010
rocketpig said:
huaxiong90 said:
rocketpig said:
huaxiong90 said:
AlkamistStar said:
I'm going with Splinter Cell on this one. Not to judge the new game Conviction, but the series as a whole, i even loved Double Agent, and played through multiple times. I think the SC series has always evolved sleath, and the use of shadows/hiding, while Metal Gear has remained unchanged. I shouldn't be able to pop a box out of nowhere and hide from a solider in MSG4...not anymore, that was for back in the day (and yes i have MGS4, and know the soliders can lift the box...but that's still more of the same).

Shooting out a light, using a EMP, or cutting the main line for a generator to cause chaos, and infiltrate a base however...that's sleath, and that's innovation. I've played through MGS4 about 4-5 times now with different playing styles to unlock different perks on my next playthrough, but on my last playthough it took like 5 hours to beat the whole game...5 HOURS! That's from skiping all the cut scenes. Is MGS4 a movie..no, but it's pretty damn close, and the series keeps getting filled with more cutscenes than gameplay.

Lastly i feel that long cutscenes are great, but throughout an entire game, it becomes a cheap way to tell a story. Many games have found innovative ways throughout gameplay (scripted events come to mind in CoD games), yet Kojima (and a lot of Japanese develops now a days) just throw cutscenes at you...it's like there's saying, "Here watch it...it'll explain everything, now you may run to the next cutscene...there you'll watch why you ran there" Splinter Cell has always been about raw gameplay, expanding on every feature from the last game, and that alone makes it the better franchise in my opinion.

I understand it's your opinion, but for me, and many other long-time Metal Gear fans, it's the story depth and the presentation of the whole single player that stands out. Kojima is better at it than any other Japanese dev I know of.

Kojima's presentation is wonderful. The story itself, though? Not so much. It's convoluted, repetitive (HORRIBLY repetitive), and non-sensical a lot of the time.

Convoluted plot does not equal deep story. It just means it's convoluted. I'd call it directorial masturbation more than anything else. It doesn't mean you shouldn't like it but let's call a spade a spade here.

Repetitive? All Metal Gear games are connected to one storyline, dude. And it may be overly complex, but I still understand what they're talking about most of the time. And should I not understand a specific thing, I just look it up on the net.

 

But to each their own, really. I still stand by my opinion that it has one of the best storylines in a game ever.

My friend and I counted a re-wording of the same sentence four times in the same cutscene.

By any measure, that has to be considered repetitive. I got it the first time, thanks. I don't need plot lines handed to me on a silver platter.

Kojima treats his audiences as if they're borderline retarded. Most of those 20 minutes cutscenes could be 5-10 minutes and deliver as much, if not more, content than their current iterations if the repetition and fat were removed from them.

And I didn't call it complex. I called it convoluted. Complex implies depth where convoluted just means there's a mish-mash of rubbish thrown in to distract from the core theme.

Ermm...convoluted = overly/unnecessarily complex as you've stated, I just wiki'ed it, and it seems I used it right.

 

I also don't really let the rewordings bother me much (when they say something and connect it to quotes or general phrases). I don't know, man, being an owner of the very first Metal Gear game on an MSX computer and just every Metal Gear following it (barring MG2: Solid Snake since it was exclusive to Japan, thankfully emulation and a fan translation saved the day), I guess I just got accustomed to Kojima and his ways ever since.



Rockstar: Announce Bully 2 already and make gamers proud!

Kojima: Come out with Project S already!

huaxiong90 on 22 February 2010
gamings_best said:
fighter said:
Splinter Cell - better gameplay, more fun, more realistic, better online features

MGS - story-driven - original and fantaisist universe - active fanbase

It is his opinion, even if I very strongly disagree with the better online features, since MGO1, as little time as I had to play it before it got shut down, was one of the best online experiences for me ever.



Rockstar: Announce Bully 2 already and make gamers proud!

Kojima: Come out with Project S already!

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rocketpig on 22 February 2010
huaxiong90 said:
rocketpig said:
huaxiong90 said:
rocketpig said:
huaxiong90 said:
AlkamistStar said:
I'm going with Splinter Cell on this one. Not to judge the new game Conviction, but the series as a whole, i even loved Double Agent, and played through multiple times. I think the SC series has always evolved sleath, and the use of shadows/hiding, while Metal Gear has remained unchanged. I shouldn't be able to pop a box out of nowhere and hide from a solider in MSG4...not anymore, that was for back in the day (and yes i have MGS4, and know the soliders can lift the box...but that's still more of the same).

Shooting out a light, using a EMP, or cutting the main line for a generator to cause chaos, and infiltrate a base however...that's sleath, and that's innovation. I've played through MGS4 about 4-5 times now with different playing styles to unlock different perks on my next playthrough, but on my last playthough it took like 5 hours to beat the whole game...5 HOURS! That's from skiping all the cut scenes. Is MGS4 a movie..no, but it's pretty damn close, and the series keeps getting filled with more cutscenes than gameplay.

Lastly i feel that long cutscenes are great, but throughout an entire game, it becomes a cheap way to tell a story. Many games have found innovative ways throughout gameplay (scripted events come to mind in CoD games), yet Kojima (and a lot of Japanese develops now a days) just throw cutscenes at you...it's like there's saying, "Here watch it...it'll explain everything, now you may run to the next cutscene...there you'll watch why you ran there" Splinter Cell has always been about raw gameplay, expanding on every feature from the last game, and that alone makes it the better franchise in my opinion.

I understand it's your opinion, but for me, and many other long-time Metal Gear fans, it's the story depth and the presentation of the whole single player that stands out. Kojima is better at it than any other Japanese dev I know of.

Kojima's presentation is wonderful. The story itself, though? Not so much. It's convoluted, repetitive (HORRIBLY repetitive), and non-sensical a lot of the time.

Convoluted plot does not equal deep story. It just means it's convoluted. I'd call it directorial masturbation more than anything else. It doesn't mean you shouldn't like it but let's call a spade a spade here.

Repetitive? All Metal Gear games are connected to one storyline, dude. And it may be overly complex, but I still understand what they're talking about most of the time. And should I not understand a specific thing, I just look it up on the net.

 

But to each their own, really. I still stand by my opinion that it has one of the best storylines in a game ever.

My friend and I counted a re-wording of the same sentence four times in the same cutscene.

By any measure, that has to be considered repetitive. I got it the first time, thanks. I don't need plot lines handed to me on a silver platter.

Kojima treats his audiences as if they're borderline retarded. Most of those 20 minutes cutscenes could be 5-10 minutes and deliver as much, if not more, content than their current iterations if the repetition and fat were removed from them.

And I didn't call it complex. I called it convoluted. Complex implies depth where convoluted just means there's a mish-mash of rubbish thrown in to distract from the core theme.

Ermm...convoluted = overly/unnecessarily complex as you've stated, I just wiki'ed it, and it seems I used it right.

I also don't really let the rewordings bother me much (when they say something and connect it to quotes or general phrases). I don't know, man, being an owner of the very first Metal Gear game on an MSX computer and just every Metal Gear following it (barring MG2: Solid Snake since it was exclusive to Japan, thankfully emulation and a fan translation saved the day), I guess I just got accustomed to Kojima and his ways ever since.

Don't get me wrong, I *mostly* enjoyed MGS4 and absolutely love the original MGS. MGS3 was pretty cool as well once I got past the horrible controls. I just wish Kojima would stop worshipping cinema and try to blaze his own path in the video game realm (like BioWare recently did in Mass Effect 2). Stop with the obnoxious cutscenes and try to embrace the medium instead of trying to make it into cinema. I was cool with that back in 1998 but the idea has worn thin over the years.




Or check out my new webcomic: http://selfcentent.com/

themanwithnoname on 22 February 2010
CommonMan said:
rocketpig said:
CommonMan said:
I have only played Double Agent of the Splinter Cell series, but it is by far a better stealth action game than MGS4. MGS4 has an awesome story with crazy things happening that make you go WTF! but the gameplay is sooooooooo bad.

Just wait til you play an SC game from Ubi Montreal (versus Shanghai for Double Agent). They're VASTLY superior games. The original SC and Chaos Theory were Ubi Montreal games, as is Conviction.

I'll put it this way: you know how awesome it was to sneak into that Shanghai skyscraper in DA? Well, the original SC and CT were that way for the ENTIRE GAME. The gameplay was so much better than MGS at the time that it was ridiculous.

Funny, that was one of my favorite moments in gaming, when you're hanging off the side of the skyscraper (in DA) and the guy leans out the access door and you yank him out, you can watch him all the way down. I chuckled.

Should I go back and play the originals then?

Edit: In honor of post 1234 I'm changing my avatar.


Definitely go back and play the old ones. Double Agent is probably the worst of them, and even it was still great. You could perform that kind of execution all the time in Chaos Theory, which also had the famous Spys vs. Mercs multiplayer.

Every Splinter Cell I've played has been quality. Sadly, a lot of people judge Double Agent from its 360 version, while the original Xbox version is said to be much better.

The old ones used to be that you had to play through long stretches until you hit a checkpoint. Everytime you hit a checkpoint you wanted to do a dance or something so you didn't have to go back another 15-20 minutes of gameplay. Running out of bullets happened frequently in the older games, for me anyway.



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Tuganuno on 22 February 2010

MGS4 is the second best game ever (first one being MGS2), therefor MGS>Splinter Cell =p /opinion

And you gotta be crazy to say that Splinter Cell's online is better than MGO2. Obviously you have never played it, because there is no game even close to MGO, I can guarantee you that.



rocketpig on 22 February 2010
Tuganuno said:
MGS4 is the second best game ever (first one being MGS2), therefor MGS>Splinter Cell =p /opinion

And you gotta be crazy to say that Splinter Cell's online is better than MGO2. Obviously you have never played it, because there is no game even close to MGO, I can guarantee you that.

I preferred Splinter Cell's online, though that's not saying much because both games had online components that were pretty "meh" in my opinion.




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heruamon on 22 February 2010

This isn't even going to be close, with the amount of sony fans on this site. Since these are exclusive, it's a moot point, as you can't compare the 2.



"...You can't kill ideas with a sword, and you can't sink belief structures with a broadside. You defeat them by making them change..."

- From By Schism Rent Asunder