Do you think The Witcher 3 is an RPG?

[HoloDust]

LegitHyperbole said:

HoloDust said:

Witcher 3 is a good game from my POV, it's just not very good as RPG - you're playing predefined character, with mostly predefined history, relationships, profession and with very limited moral bounds, and how you progress Geralt mechanically through the game doesn't make much difference in how he behaves and interacts with the world and world with him. Sure, you make narrative choices, but that is not exclusive to RPGs. Strip away its RPG mechanics and not much is really lost.

This is why a lot of RPG enthusiast don't consider it RPG at all. I always tend to say that for me it sits right on the fence between action-RPG and action-adventure, with very thin RPG mechanics, but fairly good narrative choices - from my POV, it's the game against which all these new breed of pseudo RPGs can be tested to decide on which side of the fence they sit at (or at least lean more toward). Though, ultimately, I think, just like there are Rouge-lites, which borrow some mechanics from Rouge, maybe it's about time for Narrative RPG-lites to get their official label. Because, if you view something like Witcher, it will always be under heavy scrutiny from strictly RPG point of view, although it's great as narrative action-adventure with some of RPG mechanics.

As for DOS 1/2, yes, they are RPGs - they're just not as good as actual macrocosmic world CRPGs (like Utlimas, Fallout 1/2, Arcanum or Age of Decadence), but pretty great as microcosmic theme park mega-dungeon crawlers (just like BG3).

P.S. As Witcher aficionado, you should really play The Dawn of Bloodwalker - looking it strictly mechanically as an action RPG it's better than Witcher 3 (though nowhere near as good as proper action RPGs), but it suffers from undercooked world and not as strong writing, areas in which Witcher 3 is really great.

I thought this on one playthrough. I have four now, the differences are profound. There are whole YouTube channels dedicated to the differences cause they are that nuanced between choices. 

I too am and was an RPG enthusiast and I thought the same my first two playthroughs bagk to back, then I decided to play completely differently my third playthrough and I was shocked by how diverse the choices are and how long in the game they span. 

And Jesus, DoS not being as good as 90's RPG's. Blasphemy. Lol. They and BG3 are way beyond anything in the 90's apart from perhaps the more dialogue heavy games but the choices were in your imagination, not in the game. These games change the actual game instead of predenting they do. 

But the above is all based on choice. By your definition Cyberpunk 2077 should be the greatest RPG of all time but it certainly doesn't feel it and it's not. 

And yes, Dawnwalker is on my list, I'm just poor atm. However, I done the same shtick in Metaphor refantazio and it did not hit. If they were to pull this off, and I'm not doubting they have, it needs to be really strict and from what I seen it is not at all. I do suspect I would love it though, despite as you mentioned the writing being lesser. 

May I ask what your favourite RPG is? And also, do you consider Skyrim an RPG?

- You are way too hung up on choices that you as a player can make, vs how your character interacts through RPG mechanics with the world and what choices he can make with them. Properly written branching visual novel has way more player choices than Witcher 3, but that does not make it an RPG. As I said, strip away all RPG mechanics from Witcher 3 and you won't loose much globally.

- No, for me DOS 1/2 (or BG3) are nowhere as good as cult classics (nor some of the new stuff) because they don't feel like worlds, but megadungeons masquerading as worlds. Good and fun megadungeon crawlers, with lot of micro interaction, but as someone who prefers playing worlds, both at the table and on computer, I don't find Larian's CRPGs nearly as compelling.

- I'm still keeping away from CP2077, so can't comment - initially I was exited when they announced it, especially since it's collaboration with author of tabletop original, but after my son played it (who knows a thing or two about RPGs, due to exposure through me) and concluded it's mostly FPS with some RPG elements - which was quite disappointing for me, given that I know the system and played it - I decided to abstain from it.  If you want to see game that is properly translated from tabletop to VG format, play VtM:Bloodlines, another cult classic among RPG connoisseurs.

- I actually don't have favourite VG RPG, there are games I love equally that do completely opposite things in different subgenres. I can tell you what I liked the most so far from this year, and that's Esoteric Ebb, great mixture of Disco Elysium and D&D.

- Skyrim is not a very good RPG, and even worse as TES game.