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Ryuu96 4 days ago
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Qwark said:
shavenferret said:

Perhaps the various powers of the world are wanting to be rather machivellian, and use this war to exhaust russia.  If so, then they would want Ukraine to continue fighting and regain its lost territory.  

I personally wish that Ukraine gets everything back, since anything lost seems like a win for the biggest bully in the world.  

Russia is not even being close to being exhausted. Only a part of Europe has a problem with what Russia is doing. The rest of the world is probably happy this conflict is deeply dividing Europe and Nato.

At this point it seems likely that:

Russia gets all the territory it conquered

USA gets minerals at a bargain price 

Europe can pay for rebuilding and the refugees

Ukraine doesn't get into NATO nor US defense and EU defense in Ukraine is too little to matter, since most EU nations couldn't defend themselves.

I am not as convinced as others that Russia is on the verge of collapse or exhausted in totality but I likewise thing you're being a bit exaggeratory on Russia's current condition, for one thing they are on the verge of economic collapse, secondly, they have lost a significant quantity and quality of heavy equipment, I mean we have Russians using donkeys to transfer equipment, mopeds to travel across battlefields and straight up some of them are simply marching on foot under drone bombardment in the open fields. Unfortunately Russia still has millions of citizens to throw to their deaths and turn this into a WW1 style slog but they've taken a serious beating in heavy equipment losses.

I also don't know why you believe that only a part of Europe has a problem with what Russia is doing, it is almost the whole of Europe that has a problem with what Russia is doing (UK, France, Italy, Spain, Germany, Finland, Norway, Sweden, Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, Czech Republic, Poland, etc) The only ones who don't have a problem are Hungary and Slovakia and Slovakia is debatable because Fico was only recently elected and is taking an old grudge out on Ukraine, before Fico, Slovakia was one of the strongest supporters of Ukraine, Fico also currently has huge protests against himself going on right now as well and is likely not going to win another election at this rate.

If by rest of the world, you mean China, then sure, Lol. But we've seen all the UN votes already and majority of the world is against what Russia is doing, likewise, Canada definitely won't be happy that America and Europe are coming into conflict with each other, likewise, what on earth would make you believe that countries like South Korea, Taiwan, Japan, etc. Would be happy to see America spit in the face of their allies, when those countries also heavily rely on America for their protection? Japan won't be happy either, as Japan has their own reasons to hate Russia (Kuril Islands).

Your likely to happen is basically a complete win for Russia and entirely pessimistic take. Russia steals territory, America plunders Ukraine, Europe foots the bill to repair Ukraine alone, Ukraine is defenceless in the future and Russia then attacks again in the future. Half of this stuff is not going to be agreed upon at all. "Since most EU nations couldn't defend themselves" is nonsense, it's more about political will than actual military capability, will they put themselves in an uncomfortable situation, if there was no nukes and Europe had some balls, Russia would have been pushed out of Ukraine already and been completely defeated.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - 4 days ago