Here I'm moving the argument from the other thread here then.
Avalach21 said:
negative health effects of homosexuality higher incidences of domestic violence between homosexual couples higher rates of promiscuity in homosexual culture ... I could go on... also, common sense things like, it takes a man and a woman to create a child - that a man and a woman are naturally (obviously[surely]) supposed to go together. I don't feel like I should have to state these things, and I'm not even trying to start an arguement or take a side on the supposed arguement, just merely state that it is possible for such an arguement to exist (which you have denied as possible.)
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The negative health effects argument isn't valid because it's not immoral to be unhealthy. And you can be homosexual without having sex anyway. And not all gay people have anal sex. Just like straight people, some of them only want oral sex or no sex at all. Just like straight people, some of them don't even like sex or might have weird-shaped genitals so it's unpleasant for them. You don't get diseases just from being gay. AIDS hit the gay community really hard because at the time society was so anti-gay that we were ready to just let them all die, and we even called it GRID for Gay-Related ImmunoDeficiency before we found out it was just any fluid transfer and started hitting babies who got dirty blood. And it's not somebody's fault for being born into a sexuality which has a higher risk of AIDS due to bad choices made by people (both gay and straight) in the past regarding the fight and spread of AIDS.
It's immoral to beat your partner whether you're gay or straight, but that doesn't mean it's immoral to be gay or straight. We can't let the spouse-beaters of either sexuality ruin it for the rest of us. The reason there's a higher incidence of domestic violence is that when it's a man and a woman, the man beats the shit out of the woman and she shuts up and is often too scared to report it. When it's 2 men or 2 women, they're more frequently the same size and have similar levels of strength, so it's up in the air which one will win, so they both hit way harder because they both have a chance. It's not an inherently gay thing to beat up your spouse. It's a matter of straight couples covering it up more often because they're embarassed/afraid. A similar example would be pointing out that it's more likely for you to accidentally shoot your kid when you own a gun than when you don't own a gun... so nobody can own a gun. We can't let the wackjobs ruin it for the rest of us. We just try to stop the wackjobs as best we can without limiting the rights of the regular folks. Owning a gun alone isn't immoral. Shooting your kid is immoral. Being gay alone isn't immoral. Beating your partner in any relationship is immoral.
The promiscuity thing is also a religious argument, which proves my whole point. If I have safe sex with 10 girls or guys it doesn't hurt anybody. If a straight guy has sex with 10 girls we're supposed to think that's awesome and he's practicing or partying or whatever and he'll settle down later. If a gay guy has sex with 10 guys we're supposed to think he's stupid and weird and going to die of AIDS. If we let gay people get married, that might (just maybe a tiny bit) affect this.
I still believe that any argument that something is wrong, when that something doesn't hurt other people, comes from religion. Only a religion would say I'm a bad person when I'm not hurting anybody.
