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SvennoJ on 25 January 2024
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Nusma said:

America is such a heterogeneous and polarized place, I honestly have no idea what the american public actually thinks and by extension, how the election will turn out. If there are any americans here I would appreciate to hear some first hand reports about what they see and hear around them.

I'm pretty sure most of the american public actually cares about the war against Ukraine, but how do they actually weigh it against all the other issues? Because that's the problem with their two party system, they don't have much of a choice and they can't make Ukraine a ride or die issue. Would any republican voter throw all his or her conservative values, stances on imigration, etc. over board, just so Ukraine gets American support? I mean, I don't even know if I could do that. But I fortunately also don't live under a two party system and don't have to loose sleep over that because I can choose from a range of parties that approximate my values way better.

So yeah, hearing an american's perspective about this would really interest me. Also regarding to the state of war-fatigue there after the huge bummer that was Afghanistan. And what impact the Israel issue has there.

The 2 party system is definitely frustrating and led to the blue vs red stale mate, basically turned the USA in a divide and conquer position for the lobbyists. It doesn't really matter who is in power, what matters is it switches every 4 or 8 years to remain the status quo and keep people divided on whatever the new issue is. There is no long term vision for the country, just corporations maximizing their profits through political influence.

Blaming immigrants is just another tactic to distract the public from the real reasons for inequality and the shrinking middle class. Which also makes it easy to sell less aid to Ukraine (we need it here) and military follies to supposedly keep prices down.

A poll from November shows the majority of republicans oppose more aid to Ukraine
https://www.axios.com/2023/11/21/republicans-gop-oppose-ukraine-aid-divide-democrats

Ukraine Aid seems to be mostly a victim of 'political hostage taking'
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-67649497

Justin Buchler, a political science professor at Case Western Reserve University in Ohio, told the BBC that this wing of the party has "adopted a strategy of legislative hostage taking" to accomplish its aims, a tactic that began during the administration of Barack Obama.  "Large segments of the party have decided, essentially, that when there are branches of government held by Democrats, they will look for any hostage they can take," he said. "That's what is happening now."

Other Republicans have taken a markedly more hard-line approach to Ukraine funding, with some arguing that, on principle, that the assistance is misguided or wrong. This position has been taken by a small but vocal minority of lawmakers from the hard right of the party, such as Representatives Matt Gaetz, Jim Jordan, Marjorie Taylor Greene, who has said Ukraine aid "puts America last" and means that "we're ignoring our own people's problems".

These members of a growing isolationist wing of the Republican party appear motivated by Donald Trump. The former president has repeatedly questioned aid to Ukraine and refused to commit to supporting Kyiv.

Polls have shown that support for Ukraine is slipping among the broader electorate, particularly Republicans. A November Gallup poll shows that 62% of Republican voters now believe the US is doing too much to help Ukraine. In June, the figure stood at 50%. Other polls have shown that Republicans are significantly more likely to view the US-Mexico border as one of the most important issues facing the US, and that voters of both parties are concerned. A recent Quinnipiac University poll found that 64% of voters disapprove of Mr Biden's handling of the border - including 95% of Republicans.

The immigration issue is also stalling aid to Israel (silver lining I guess)

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2024/jan/25/trump-biden-israel-ukraine-funding-immigration-deal-latest

As for aid for Gaza, it's not even part of the discussion. The last of that was early December.
https://www.usaid.gov/news-information/press-releases/dec-05-2023-united-states-announces-additional-humanitarian-assistance-palestinian-people
$21 million, pennies compared to the 3.9 billion yearly aid for Israel (and like $9 per Gaza inhabitant in need)

The rest is in the dead locked package deal

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/20/politics/us-israel-ukraine-aid-package/index.html

$61.4 billion in aid for Ukraine

  • $30 billion for the Defense Department for equipment for Ukraine and the replenishment of US stocks. So far, the US has provided Ukraine with air defense systems, munitions, small arms and ground maneuver units, among other weapons and equipment.
  • $14.4 billion for continued military, intelligence and other defense support. This includes investments in the defense industrial base, transportation costs of US personnel and equipment, and continuing an enhanced US troop presence in Europe, among other activities.
  • $16.3 billion for economic, security and operational assistance. It includes direct budget support to Ukraine to help it provide critical services to its people and sustain its economy, as well as investments in infrastructure, civilian law enforcement and getting rid of mines.
  • $481 million to support Ukrainians arriving in the US through the Uniting for Ukraine program.
  • $149 million for the National Nuclear Security Administration for nuclear/radiological incident response and capacity building in case of emergencies as part of general contingency planning.

$14.3 billion in aid for Israel

  • $10.6 billion for assistance through the Defense Department, including air and missile defense support, industrial base investments and replenishment of US stocks being drawn down to support Israel.
  • The aid aims to bolster Israel’s air and missile defense system readiness and support its procurement of Iron Dome and David’s Sling missile defense systems and components, as well as the development of the Iron Beam.
  • $3.7 billion for the State Department to strengthen Israel’s military and enhance US Embassy security.

$10 billion for humanitarian assistance

  • $9.15 billion for aid for Ukraine, Israel, Gaza and other humanitarian needs. It includes support for Palestinian refugees in the West Bank and surrounding areas.
  • $850 million for migration and refugee assistance at the US-Mexico border.

$7.4 billion for Taiwan and the Indo-Pacific region

  • The security assistance aims to bolster deterrence and to support allies facing increasing assertiveness from China and transitioning off Russian military equipment.
  • $2 billion for foreign military financing.
  • $3.4 billion for the submarine industrial base. It would fund improvements at the Navy’s four public shipyards and increase submarine availability.
  • $2 billion for the Treasury Department to provide a “credible alternative to coercive financing” and to catalyze billions from other donors through the US-led World Bank. The administration is seeking to offer options other than China’s “coercive and unsustainable financing for developing countries.”

$13.6 billion to address security at the US-Mexico border

  • $6.4 billion for border operations, including additional temporary holding facilities, DNA collection at the border and support for eligible arrivals and unaccompanied children.
  • $3.1 billion for an additional 1,300 Border Patrol agents, 1,600 asylum officers, processing personnel and 375 immigration judge teams.
  • $1.4 billion for state and local support for temporary shelter, food and other services for migrants recently released from Department of Homeland Security custody.
  • $1.2 billion to counter fentanyl, including inspection system deployment, additional Customs and Border Protection officers, and testing and tracing activities.
  • $1.4 billion for migration needs to support Safe Mobility Offices, for host communities and legal pathways in the region, for foreign government repatriation operations and to combat human trafficking and smuggling in the Western Hemisphere.
  • $100 million for child labor investigations and enforcement, particularly to protect migrant children entering the US through the southern border.

For some perspective, USA federal spending was 6,100 Billion in 2023, so the extra 105 Billion package would be an increase of 1.7% of the budget and still well under the 6.5 Trillion spending of 2022.


Anyway public support for the war in Ukraine is faltering and the Israel-Gaza conflict is heavily politicized and distorted in American media.