Machiavellian said:
Ryuu, that is my point, has the MP increased Halo user base, NO, has forged increase Halo user base for as many years its been in Halo NO. What is the most complaint concerning Halo, the SP. So if MS isn't building a crack SP team to tackle this very big issue, the decline of Halo will continue. This is why games like Halo decline. What you call staples of Halo, I call a huge weight that shakle a game into this mold where it can never breath. The game becomes stagnant and thus can only please the old heads but can never get new gamers. That is why you see so many creative people leave the team because they cannot actually be creative. Having something in Unreal really means nothing when you do not know the full scope. Just think how long it took MS to just get Forge out on their own engine when it already have the foundation for it. Unless MS showed a fully running forge in Unreal, I would take their statement as something more along the line of we got something up and running but nothing more. So if they are not building the campaign first then would that not be their problem. If you keep doing the same thing over and over again with each iteration worse results, its time to change things up. My opinion is a refocus on the SP is the route as the MP just isn't lighting anyone fire to get back into Halo. From what I am hearing, I do not hear anyone saying, I got to get back into Halo because of all these cool maps with forge. I do not hear anyone saying, I need to get a Xbox for Halo. What I do hear is people saying I need to get PS5 for Spiderman, GOD of War, The Last of US and a slew of other IP coming to the system. Halo way forward to prominance isn't the MP, MS must get the SP right for people to care about actually playing the game and then come to the MP. My point is that even if Forge could not work in Unreal, its not the vital point to getting Halo back as the big 3 in MS arsenal. The SP has always been and should always be the main focus first and everything else builds from there because if you cannot make people want to play the SP, then why would they want to engage in the MP. |
"What is the most complaint concerning Halo, the SP."
This...Isn't true, at all, Lol. The biggest complaint by far with Halo Infinite was the Multiplayer support...The Campaign was widely praised across the board. Halo Infinite had a HUGE launch but it collapsed because the Multiplayer support after launch was terrible. We'd have an incredibly healthy and successful Halo IP right now if the Multiplayer support wasn't terrible.
I don't know where you're getting from that the biggest issue with Infinite was the Campaign...Infinite did NOT represent a decline for Halo at launch, it was actually an INCREASE in Halo's recent popularity but 343's post launch Multiplayer support caused all goodwill to vanish and for the game to collapse.
You know what the biggest complaint for Halo 4 was? The Multiplayer. It sold a ton at launch then quickly became irrelevant despite the great story and quickly ruined 343's standing within the Halo community right at the start. You know what 5's biggest complaint was? The Campaign. Guess what, Halo 5 had among 343's best player retentions, Lol.
"Has the MP increased Halo user base"
Yes, for Halo 3 and Reach, Multiplayer has been the main draw of Halo since Halo 3. If Halo Infinite's post launch support wasn't terrible, it would have easily increased Halo's overall userbase. Forge is an important competent to Halo's Multiplayer. Custom Games/Forge have played major parts in Halo 3, Reach and Halo 5. Custom Games was dead in Halo 4 because its Forge was terrible.
Now as we can see with data provided to us, once again, Forge is significantly helping Halo's Multiplayer.
Halo Infinite started with 20m players, that was a huge achievement. What more could you ask for? 50m? Lol. I've absolutely zero doubt that the majority of those 20m were in it for the Multiplayer as well. But the title went on to die because 343 couldn't keep them around because they provided terrible post launch support in an age where Multiplayer titles are constantly updated.
"The game becomes stagnant and thus can only please the old heads but can never get new gamers. That is why you see so many creative people leave the team because they cannot actually be creative."
Forge is the last thing you can accuse of causing stagnation to Halo creatively, Lol. It's by far the most creative thing that Halo has. I don't see anyone leaving the Forge team either. The Multiplayer team was refreshed a little due to failures there and the Campaign team was let go as a cost/benefit analysis from the looks of things, I.E. Campaign isn't going to bring people back to Infinite, they need to focus on Multiplayer for now.
"Just think how long it took MS to just get Forge out on their own engine when it already have the foundation for it."
Look at how long it took for them to get basic stuff such as Maps out and Co-Op for Campaign, Lol, Halo Infinite's development was a mess and Slipspace was a bad engine. At least Forge in Halo Infinite is a MASSIVE step up from Halo 5's Forge which is why the community was mostly forgiving of the delay, they could see the huge improvement that they couldn't for Maps/Co-Op.
Microsoft haven't made a statement on Forge, that is a leak from Jez that they have an internal demo of Forge running on Unreal Engine.
"If you keep doing the same thing over and over again with each iteration worse results"
Halo Infinite had better results than Halo 4/5 at launch...
"Its time to change things up."
Which Halo Infinite's Campaign did, Lol.
"My opinion is a refocus on the SP is the route as the MP just isn't lighting anyone fire to get back into Halo."
I don't know if you're just a super fan of Halo's Campaign, I am, but I can at least see that the Multiplayer is the main draw of Halo now, Lol. Sticking your head in the sand and pretending it's Campaign isn't going to 'save' Halo. Microsoft has the data and there's a reason why they laid off the entire Campaign team, even we have the data in some parts such as charting or Achievement data for the 1st level.
What more could Infinite had done? It's practically a soft reboot of the franchise, Lol.
"The SP has always been the main focus first"
No...It hasn't...Not even during Bungie's days.
"My point is that even if Forge could not work in Unreal, its not the vital point to getting Halo back as the big 3 in MS arsenal."
It's a vital component to Halo's Multiplayer, I think that is what you aren't getting, Forge isn't just some thing on its own to the side, it is inherently linked to Multiplayer now and has been a major contributor to Halo's Multiplayer since Halo 3.
"From what I am hearing, I do not hear anyone saying, I got to get back into Halo because of all these cool maps with forge."
Aside from the data saying that Halo Infinite's Forge playlist is the most popular playlist it has EVER had. Also, I don't know where you browse, because I hear a massive amount of people complaining about Infinite's Multiplayer support and barely any complaints about the Campaign.
Halo has traditionally had both a strong Campaign and Multiplayer but when the Multiplayer is bad, it causes significantly more damage to Halo than a poor Campaign because that is where Halo's fanbase predominately is now.
Why this insistence on side-lining a staple of Halo now, to piss off millions of fans, to chase some imaginary "new" users that may or may not appear when Infinite had a massive launch on a strong Campaign/Multiplayer but ruined it all with bad post launch Multiplayer support.
