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ConservagameR said:
Machiavellian said:

The case did not show MS hindering at least at that time anyone from putting a browser on the OS.

A judge who talks about a case can be seen as not impartial which can cause all kinds of problems with the judicial process.  So you believing its not a big deal does not mean the judge actions were not a big deal.

We can do if then buts all day long but until there is actually evidence its a waste of time.  I do not live in if then buts.  This is why we have a process to expose such things instead of delving into what ifs.

You still have not established any corruption, all this guessing what could or could be means nothing without actually showing corruption.  If we go down your position where we believe that something could be there without any actual data to support it than we can believe everyone and everything is corrupt.  How can you prove me wrong if I say well if if your actions or non actions are corrupt behind the scenes without proof.  This does not support any real argument, it just throws out unsubstantiated opinion without substance.

I have already stated that no company is a saint, but what I have not stated is that they use sleazy tactics or even tried to insinuate such a position without proof.  I would agree that all business when they gain an advantage will continue to push for that advantage in their market.  That does not mean they need to resort to corrupt tactics to achieve it. My point is that you have not supported your first claim and continue to throw out well what ifs, this is not a solid position to support your previous statements.

United States v. Microsoft Corp. - Wikipedia

On June 28, 2001, the Circuit Court overturned Judge Jackson's rulings against Microsoft. This was partly because Jackson had improperly discussed the case with the news media while it was still in progress, violating the Code of Conduct for American judges.

Ultimately, the Circuit Court overturned Jackson's holding that Microsoft should be broken up as an illegal monopoly. However, the Circuit Court did not overturn Jackson's findings of fact. The Circuit Court adopted a "drastically altered scope of liability" due to Jackson's conduct, which was favorable for Microsoft.

The Department of Justice announced on September 6, 2001, that it was no longer seeking to break up Microsoft and would instead seek a lesser antitrust penalty. Microsoft decided to draft a settlement proposal allowing PC manufacturers to adopt non-Microsoft software.

On August 5, 2002, Microsoft announced that it would make some concessions towards the proposed final settlement ahead of the judge's decision. On November 1, 2002, Judge Kollar-Kotelly released a ruling that accepted most of the proposed DOJ settlement.

Microsoft later "agreed to consent to a two-year extension of part of the Final Judgments" dealing with communications protocol licensing, and stated that if the government later wished to extend those aspects of the settlement as far as 2012, it would not object.

MS only got off initially due to the first judge making a poor and illegal move involving the media, which obviously doesn't change MS past actions leading them to court. MS still ends up guilty after appeal, just with a lesser penalty. MS accepted this, this time.

Convinced yet?

I also saw this on Wikipedia but it is incomplete. It looks like the only wrong thing done by the judge was inappropriate talk to the media while the thruth is that those talks were loaded with partial take against MS

The opinion was notable for its rebuke of Judge Jackson. ``The trial judge engaged in impermissible ex parte contacts by holding secret interviews with members of the media and made numerous offensive comments about Microsoft officials in public statements outside of the courtroom, giving rise to an appearance of partiality,'' the court said. ``Although we find no evidence of actual bias, we hold that the actions of the trial judge seriously tainted the proceedings before the district court and called into question the integrity of the judicial process.''

Also, in the end, it doesn't really matter, the whole thing happened only because of the time it happened, OSs were only a thing to the masses for less than a decade and a great part of the reason it was seen as monopolistic was due to incompetent competition which was tripping over themselves every now and then (and yes that include Apple).

The very same behavior that got Microsoft into trouble back then is used without consequence by Google, Apple, Sony, Nintendo, Amazon, etc. and is in fact still being used by MS (all bundle their app and stores with their respective OS). So, to me, It's funny to use a 20+ years old case to paint today's MS evil all the while every other actor with the proprietary OS are depicting the exact same behavior and are just lucky they haven't been challenged and/or that the context of today is more lenient on those practices.


Last edited by EpicRandy - on 25 January 2023

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