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Ryuu96 on 20 November 2022
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dark_gh0st_b0y said:
Zkuq said:

Well bombing Russian civilians won't warm the Ukrainians either. If anything, they'll just want a fast and a reasonable end to the war, and I doubt a lot of people believe bombing Russian civilians is going to do much to help that. I know I don't. It makes about as much sense as the Russian belief that the Ukrainians will give up if you bomb them and prevent them from getting electricity - which has rarely, if ever, worked.

I understand, but the intention here is not to bomb Russian civillians but make Putin think twice! He knows that leaving Ukrainians without electricity probably won't help him much, but he does it anyway because he has almost nothing to lose. It's the same with going nuclear, he has been warned so he didn't use it - at least thus far. It's the same as before February 23 - threatened with economic sanctions was a green light in his eyes - not much to lose. Now if he is threatened with something serious he will think twice before bringing pointless devastation to Ukrainian civillians - an already poor country of 40m that had a -35% drop in GDP in 2022 WITH electricity, imagine what is at stake if Putin keeps destroying energy infrastructure...

So, are you saying that we simply threaten them but don't act on it to make Putin think twice? I.E., "If you continue to attack Ukrainian civilian infrastructure, we will send Ukraine ATACMS or other longer-range missiles to strike deeper into Russia?" - An example. I could see the logic framed like that, but it definitely shouldn't include "civilian infrastructure" in the threat.

Having said that, I don't think the threat works, Putin doesn't give a shit about his civilians or Ukraine striking into Russia, they've done it multiple times already. We should be sending Ukraine longer range missiles regardless without having to threaten Russia and as I've said already, aside from the moral objections, there is very little strategic value in targeting civilian infrastructure like Russia is doing.

Send them longer range missiles either way like ATACMS, Russia isn't going to do shit to the West, I don't know why we're still afraid, Russia isn't going to nuke Ukraine because they struck military targets with a missile deeper than Belgorod. Ukraine won't use the missiles on civilian infrastructure because they aren't Russia.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - on 20 November 2022