Jaicee said:
First of all, let me just say that I find it altogether appropriate that it's you, one of this forum's most ban-happy contributors, who has emerged as the thread's principal champion of indefinite Covid restrictions. There's a fitting consistency of logic to the fact that one of the most controlling people on this entire message board is also the most passionate and popular enthusiast for restricting other people's lives in other ways as well. I guess it just takes a more authoritarian mindset than I possess.
...You know, one could conclude that your response here didn't exactly epitomize calm, sobriety, or rationality itself. I mean why do I feel like you might slit the throat of the next maskless person you see in the name of saving lives? Look, when the science around masking was unclear, I was okay with lockdowns. Not happy, but okay, because I didn't know what else could be done to mitigate the virus' spread. As the science around masking became clear, I favored that as an alternative. Once vaccines became available, I favored those as an alternative to compulsory masking. That has been the evolution of my thought pattern on Covid measures over time. You make it sound as though I'm a mask-burning anti-vaxxer who believes in Dr. Joe Rogan science and doesn't care how many people die. You can treat me like I'm an intelligent human being with a soul for a change. Thanks. There has been a very real and serious human cost stemming not only from this goddamn virus, but also from the mitigation measures imposed to control it. I think getting a visual of that cost might help put matters more in perspective for you. Nevada lifted their indoor masking requirements the other day. Here's a glimpse of what the response looked like inside one school room in Las Vegas: 97% of American teachers report that their students have experienced learning loss. From May 2020 to April 2021, the U.S. recorded over 100,000 drug overdose deaths, a 28.5% increase from the 78,000 deaths that were recorded in the previous 12-month period, according to CDC data, which I believe is also an all-time record. Domestic violence jumped 8.1% during the lockdown period in 2020, which saw many women in particular effectively trapped at home with abusive partners. Also, we shut the economy down, displacing at least 15% of our workforce and exacerbating supply chain disruptions in the process, in turn partly yielding the current 40-year high price inflation rate! (Another part of that is corporate price gouging, but that is another issue for another time.) The most worrisome human cost though has been the emergence of a major mental health crisis resulting from both the pandemic itself but considerably exacerbated by related restrictions on life. (Also, I can't recommend that last article enough. The New York Times really is the best...when they want to be.) That, the mental health crisis, is the big one in my opinion, as its victims are far more numerous than those of the coronavirus itself and include me. People cannot live on high alert for years and remain unscathed. I think it would just be nice to see topics other than Covid in the news more often, frankly. That would help people's mental well-being. And no, it's not "just" a mask. It's a symbol, and a constant reminder, of a traumatizing era that I very much need to be in the past, speaking of which.
It would be entirely to easy to respond to this. I would just challenge you to find a place where broad-based bail reduction policies or policies eliminating bail have met with something other than a spike in crime rates, including violent crime, because it seems like I really could just name any major city in this country to make my case on that, as well as vis-a-vis so many newly-elected progressive district attorneys' penchant for systematically refusing to enforce many, many laws and more. |
"First of all, let me just say that I find it altogether appropriate that it's you, one of this forum's most ban-happy contributors, who has emerged as the thread's principal champion of indefinite Covid restrictions. There's a fitting consistency of logic to the fact that one of the most controlling people on this entire message board is also the most passionate and popular enthusiast for restricting other people's lives in other ways as well. I guess it just takes a more authoritarian mindset than I possess.
...You know, one could conclude that your response here didn't exactly epitomize calm, sobriety, or rationality itself. I mean why do I feel like you might slit the throat of the next maskless person you see in the name of saving lives?
It's just done for show so that people like you won't go off like this on us and physically assault somebody."
So... we're basically going to do ad hominem attacks? I did not say anything about you as a person. Just that what you were saying and the positions you were advocating are illogical and irrational. This is pure and simple flaming, so cut it the fuck out.
Interesting to see that your go to argument against me, that anything I say is some form of censorship because I'm a mod, hasn't changed despite the fact that I'm not a mod anymore XD. Which was my choice. I have no interest in the power to ban anyone, and what I did as a mod has no relevance here. That being said when I was a mod you thought my saying "I thought my point was clear" or something like that was an abuse of power, so gonna say your criteria for authoritarianism is fucked. Which, hey, just might explain your view on masks. I apparently was also responsible for other mods closing your topics, and instigating an overall conspiracy against you in the backroom. *shrug* Again though irrelevant and flaming.
As for why you think I'm going to slit someone's throat, maybe you're not well? Don't want to throw out insults, but that's a pretty demented interpretation. Or maybe you're just doing more flaming. I don't think anything in my post was angry or aggressive. I was going for sarcastic and dismissive. If you think that was too harsh, go find a safe space.
You can treat me like I'm an intelligent human being with a soul for a change.
just point out and focus on the part where you explain how I don't have the right to disagree with you or to be upset because January 6th happened and so forth.
And some nice victimization to go along with the ad hominem. Counterspeech is not oppression or censorship. You get to say whatever illogical thing you want, and I get to call it as such. Doing so is not denying you the right to disagree with me. Cut the victimization shit all the way out. If you actually want to be able to express your opinions, this is what comes with that right. Sorrynotsorry.
You could call my post idiotic though. I'm fine with that. Others seem to disagree with you. Doesn't mean they're right, but tbh I think they are for the most part better at understand logical arguments, so I believe I made my points clearly. You didn't really explain why it was idiotic, just called me a violent bully and whined about how I'm not nice enough to you. As for treating you as intelligent, no. I won't treat you any kind of way, because I don't know you. If you say something intelligent I'll treat that as intelligent. So far, in this topic, you are batting zero.
As for the actual "substance" of your post.
You clearly made the point that the restrictions being dropped was based on arbitrary politics and not any actual reason. That's why you mentioned approval and polling and yada yada. You outright suggested in a jaqing off fashion (just asking questions) that it was a purely political ploy. We were all there, we all saw it, it's the first paragraph of the OP, and the whole post was ranting against the democrats, so no need to gaslight us. If that isn't what you meant, then get better at explaining I guess.
I don't care what children think of mask policies.
I'm sorry, but I don't make any of my decisions based on what 7 year olds think about it, and don't think we should build policy around that. We don't let seven year olds vote for a reason. How about a panel of epidemiologists instead? If you were trying to counter my point that this was emotional reasoning and not logical/scientific reasoning, that's a spectacularly bad example to use. I also don't care what your store does. I'm not your fucking manager and have no idea what that has to do with anything.
The rest of this is a pure bait and switch. Your OP was about the restrictions that are in place now. Here you're talking about restrictions that are no longer in place. There is no lock down in New York City. I can go wherever I want and do pretty much whatever I want. I imagine that there is even less restriction in Texas. The only thing left are masks and vaccines. So yeah, at this point it's just a mask. Unless your point was that we need to get back to normal by lifting the restrictions that have already been lifted. What changes exactly are you advocating if not for lifting masking requirements?
So, you have still provided no logical or rational justification for your position. Just added some personal attacks and waaah he said I can't have an opinion to the mix. Really validates my earlier post more than anything. Poor showing.
P.S. Fabric, whatever N95s are made of.
P.S.S. You're looking at it from the side I imagine you think will affect you more, a rise in crime. On the other side there are people who are routinely victimized by the current system. How much do you weigh such harm when you don't think it's likely to impact you? That's kind of the crux of all this.
Last edited by JWeinCom - on 12 February 2022
