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LurkerJ said:

Both sides are aggressors... ok

Both sides shitty... ok

Both sides are villains... ok

Both sides have the right to defense and fight back regardless of difference in power ... ok

you can't trust Palestinians.. ok

Ok, fine, cool, agreed, whatever. But why does this need to come up at all when only one side continue to expand in geography? What sort of retaliation is it for the west bank to house over 550k Israelis up from 100k in 20 years? Infusing the west bank with more settlements and creating check points separating Palestinian neighbourhoods preventing them from building anything that resembles an economy or a unified piece of land is an institutionalised effort that's done by one country one country only and it's not a form of retaliation to anything Palestinians do or don't do, it has nothing to do with "trust" or "mistrust", and it's been on going for decades blessed by Israel's biggest ally, be it the cuddly Obama or the monstrous Trump.

On the other hand, you're trying to convince the other side of a two state solution and peace is the way forward when there isn't any land left to build that state on to begin with. All while watching the Judaization of East Jerusalem and well off Jewish Americans or Europeans moving into the west bank despite not having stepped foot in the middle east since they were born, yet Palestinians, their parents and their grandparents are left wondering wtf is a 2 state solution. Keeping all that in mind, it becomes fathomable why the despicable Hamas continues to gain support

And no, Islam isn't a beautiful religion, no religion is tbh, it's all nonsense that you should criticise how stupid it is and explain why logically to all different age groups so you avoid stupid conflicts like this one. Yes, humans will still find ways to fight but at least it won't be over fairytales. 

Fully agree with all you said, except that religion can't be a beautiful thing. The art, conservation of history and community produced by religion is one of our greatest assets as a species. Yes, it is also rife with conservatism, but that's no different from politics. Which is where religion goes wrong, used for political gains.

Teaching people religion is stupid won't stop conflicts like this. It has nothing to do with religion, religion is simply a tool to keep the conflict going and justify all the crap that's happening. Without religion people will use something else. People tend to want to belong to a group with the genetically build in superiority complex to all other groups. Zionism and Jihad are not born from religion, they're born from those using religion to justify their superiority complex. Unfortunately people don't need religion for ethnic cleansing, apartheid, slavery, war on terror etc.

Btw the best religion is in Bhutan :)
https://theculturetrip.com/asia/bhutan/articles/how-and-why-bhutan-came-to-worship-the-phallus/

I'm not religious myself but find all things produced by religion quite fascinating. Sure, it comes from archaic beliefs in (a) 'higher' power(s) to explain the unknown. Yet most people don't follow the 'teachings' by the letter and know full well they're just stories to describe history and values.


The problem with the state of Palestine is, they keep giving 'the world' reasons not to help. Giving Israel the chance to play the victim and justify all the crap they're doing. A tear down the wall moment is needed, not shoot rockets over the wall.