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LudicrousSpeed said:

Oh ok, so because I made some maps for Unreal Tournament or TimeSplitters, I know how long it takes to make fully fledged MP maps for real games and how much they cost to make, lol. Makes sense. I’ve also used the create a track feature in various racers, I am now an expert in racing game development.

No one in gaming is charging $10 for an apple because no one wants a $10 apple, unless maybe it’s an Apple apple :)Again, we have plenty of cases of devs/pubs over charging for cosmetics and it ruining their game. There’s no need for any of us to get worked up over it. Life finds a way. And MS games all get plenty of free updates, too. In fact in today’s market, is there literally a single game that doesn’t get free updates? Free substantial updates are not nearly as common as paid premium updates though. Here’s where you list a bunch of games that got free updates that you consider substantial and here’s where I reply with an even longer list of premium updates. I’m not going to bother continuing, good luck on your crusade against logical business.

Actually, yes. Timesplitters 2 is a great example of how pre-existing assets can be slapped together to make a new map. Modern game development is a little more complicated, but for the most part it's a great example. If you want to learn more, download Unity, and take the prefabs tutorial.

I was talking about a grocery story charging $10 for an apple, which would be an insane price gouge. These companies are trying to charge $10 for a skin in a game that already costs $70. Like I said before, 4,000% profit margins are not logical. Go ahead and list your games with premium updates then.

sales2099 said:

With Gears 5 or Sea of Thieves, you get the complete multiplayer experience. Same maps, same gameplay, all the modes. You are not required to buy anything to enhance gameplay. Me having a pink chrome shotgun in Gears 5 or a shiny gold sniper rifle skin in Sea of Thieves is NOT essential to my gameplay experience. It’s optional compensation for post launch support. You can dispute the effort it takes all you want, fact is people spend time on them, and the content is more sizeable then you think OP. It’s more then skins, it’s maps and modes, new areas, all of which require design, balancing and tweaks.

And I’ll say again we have Game Pass, which makes it increasingly smart to use instead of spending $70 upfront, unlike Sony. Game Pass is an essential part of this debate. 15 million users is no small number, which is likely to grow to 20 by years end, and a service that provides day 1 access to 1st party. 

As someone who plays Gears 5 and SoT, you know how much I actually spent on those games? About $10-15 for each game. On mtx that appealed to me that I felt why not since I gave these games so much of my time for practically nothing (given that I play more then enough GP to justify it)

The implications of this thread is clear, and to that end, until Sony can provide a enticing way to nullify the upfront $70 cost like Game Pass can, Xbox far and away wins on value. Not to mention so much unlockables can be done without spending anything, merely through just playing. 

That pink chrome shotgun or shiny gold sniper rifle is part of the game. In the case of those two weapons, they are literally 5 minute texture and material editor changes. And they are trying to charge you how much for them? Having multiple costumes in Spider-Man is also NOT essential to my gameplay experience. Neither is having multiple armors in GoW. You don't see those being taken out of the game and then charged a premium though do you?

Yes, people spend time on them. But you are seriously underestimating the time or money needed. $10 for a skin does not reflect the time or money needed to make said skin. They could charge $0.50 for a skin and still make a fantastic profit.

Yes, you spent $10-$15 on those games, but that's just your own anecdotal evidence. Most people spend far more than that over the course of a year. My co-worker for example has dumped $700 into the sims, over 7 years. I've spent over $200 on LoL crap in 3-4 years, before quitting the game for good. Tell me. Is the Sims worth $700? Is LoL worth $200?

I get your argument though. You are saying that Gamepass makes MS games virtually free to play. The problem is that to get the full experience you need to spend far more than the simple $70 that Sony is asking for. How much would it cost to get every skin, in Gears 5? I bet it's well over $100, just for all the character skins. And in the vast majority of Sony games all the skins are included free. So if you include the full package a Sony game is $70 and that's it. A MS game is $10 a month + over $100 and growing. Or worse, if you feel like actually owning the game it's $70 + $100 and growing. When including the full game, Sony games are far and away a better value. Not to mention that Sony games frequently go on sale for $40, and then $20.