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theprof00 said:
DonFerrari said:

I don`t think Joel is a villain or a hero, all he done after losing sarah and meeting Ellie was to keep living, killed to live. And the kills he done after Ellie was to keep her safe. Very simple and understandable.

Killing to keep alive and for revenge is different stuff, but yes I totally understand Abby killing him even without seeing flashback. Even Ellie say it would be impossible to know which group Abby was because Joel had so many enemies.

Without getting into details, I'd just recommend checking out this tvtropes link on villain protagonists. I think you'll find it hard to disagree. He embodies all the characteristics of a villain, and at best is typified as a sociopathic hero who crosses the line into full villain upon killing Marlene.

I would say that at the hospital he wasn't at his best mental state and he also knew that if anyone was left alive that knew about Ellie she was going to be hunt. And sure after all the kill he done in the past he wouldn't have issue killing a few more.

Anyway even criminals have loved ones and can act kind. And he being able to sympatize and have real care and love eliminates him being a sociopath.

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