How bad is MGS4 for the image of our hobby?

[jman8]

@Happy

Your original post is a bit confusing. You say in your first paragraph that Kojima has attempted to add "deep content." But then you go on to suggest the game is not deep when you say:

"From what I have seen, the only people who really see Metal Gear as being particularly deep are people who tend to only see the surface messages in movies/books/videogames and miss the subtext of a story.

When someone who truly understands and enjoys deep subtext hears about how "Deep" Metal Gear Solid is, and then plays the game, they are bound to think that either games are the most shallow medium ever created (if this is the deepest game created) or that Metal Gear Fans ar morons."

But now I get what you're actually trying to say. You're not saying that there aren't deep themes. You're saying that those themes aren't integrated into the story well. Or in other words, the themes aren't "deeply" entrenched in the story. I somewhat agree with you. I look at MGS2 and I see that Raiden's whole adventure (i.e. the entire game) is an example of how context and culture is just as powerful as a shaping force on one's life as genes effect who you are, and I have a hard time completely agreeing with you.

Anyway the point of my posts are to point out that there are thought-provoking themes in the series. That doesn't make the series art, but practically no one has said MGS is on the level of literature or great movies. Garcian is on a witch hunt.