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Pemalite on 17 March 2019
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Intrinsic said:

Its not really an apples to apples comparison though.... cause I/O in a dedicated CPu and I/O in an APu are kinda two very difeent things.

How about this... 


 

Which is why I decided not to include I/O. Zen 3 (My mistake, didn't mean Ryzen 3 specifically) has the I/O on a separate chip remember.

Intrinsic said:

AMD Ryzen 3 3600G (7nm)

 

  • 8C/16T 
  • CPU clock 3.2GHz base/ 4Ghz Boost
  • Navi 20CU GPU
  • TDP 95W
  • MSRP (rumored) ~$225
AMD Ryzen 3 3600 (7nm)
  • 8C/16T
  • CPU clock 3.2Ghz base/ 4.4Ghz boost
  • TDP 65W
  • MSRP ~$200
I think that is where we need to start looking at things from. This is the closest thing to an apples to apples comparison we will see. Here are my takeaways.
  • TDP for a spec of the chip (at least the CPU)  is only 95W for CPU and a 20CU GPU. But thats to accomodate a CPU that is designed to clock as high as 4Ghz.
  • Addition of a 20CU Navi GPU (of unknown clock for now) raises TDP of the package by 30W.
When that chip is released later this year, we can then look atthe size of the chip and see where it falls in the whole 200mm2 to 400mm2 range. 

I think for the CPU side of the equation we will probably be looking at a single CCX complex. So probably around 4-6 cores.. Mostly for simplicity sake and have more of the transistor budget spent on GPU functional units and clockrates... Because at the end of the day it is the GPU that draws all the pretty pictures that is used in advertising.

Nozz-A-La said:

Isn't the power consumption and heat level of a 14,2 tf gpu the bigger problem for sony/ms than the price of those components

300w is probably manageable for consoles these days, especially with more exotic cooling solutions like Vapor Chambers.

OdinHades said:

I don't think so. On PC video cards with 8 GB can already be a limiting factor at full HD.

Usually that only happens because of inefficient effects/assets being pushed, I.E. Best graphics regardless of it's hardware requirements.
Consoles tend to be a little more relaxed on that front and usually opt for medium equivalent settings.

In saying that, despite 8GB GPU's sometimes being pushed, PC is pushing past 8GB of system ram these days as well, 16GB is the sweet spot.

OdinHades said:

Those new consoles will want to push 4K textures and we're talking about shared memory here. So I think 24 GB is the minimum for a console to be somewhat relevant in the next 6 years or so. 32 GB would be better. Anything below that will be a serious bottleneck in the future. Not today and not tomorrow, but soon enough.

4k textures have been around for years, even during the 7th gen, texture resolution and display resolution are completely separate.

24GB is a good ballpark, but I think 16GB might be more realistic. That is... 16GB 100% for games, not the OS.

Intrinsic said:

Thats definately not th case. Ever heard the saying "the first chip cost $5B and every other one cost $5" The actual cost of  processor is less tha $10 on a material cost basis, what is expensive is the costof the technology that goes into making those chips. But even then its owhere near as bad as you desibe.

Sony/MS can be paying anywhere from $40 - $150 to AMD for each APU. Just know AMD makes over or around half of whatever they are paying as profit for themselves while the other half goes to whichever foundry makes them.

If a foundry has a ton of orders though, costs per wafer generally increase, which eats into profit margins as well. 7nm is likely to be one of those nodes which are going to have a ton of orders due to mobile rushing towards it as well... But the implosion of the GPU market on PC might lessen that impact somewhat.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--