Humans Suck -_-

[Victorlink87]

danasider said:

Victorlink87 said:

Fairly bleak to be sure. This is why government and religion exists. (Both of which can be corrupted by people).

 

But being morally broken doesn't necessarily mean we are always going to do the immoral thing. Rather, that if it is questionable or downright wrong or can be messed up we will find a way to do it. Not everyone in everyway, just everyone in their own way with their own vice.

Unfortunately, this also means we will do some messed up things as a society because they are grey or not understood or we are greedy (slavery on that last one). Amazing how at the root of every major social evil from the past from slavery to genocide is pride and greed.

 

I do see morality as objective, but not without room for interpretation and not to the degree that every decision we make has a moral right/wrong. Rather that the basics are true, I will list the positive: love, patience, charity, kindness, honesty, integrity, etc. 

Morality is basically an artifact of our species' effort to further itself. These things we deem positive (and I agree, those things you listed are all considered right), are done so because we need a framework of rules that prevents us from doing things that would likely threaten our odds at surviving. Some of those things you mentioned didn't exist before the dawn of civilization.

I think even though we aren't perfect as a species, I'd lean towards us being more moral than immoral. The proof is in the numbers. Seven billion people show the rules we've followed through the morality we've made works. And they work really well, because the population was less than half (three billion) in 1960.

I agree with almost everything you said. It is an artifact, but not something we can cast off. I do not believe we invented them, but that isn't what this thread is about. So I don't want that to distract us and will move on from it for another time.

 

Again, being immoral doesn't necessarily mean you will crash the society. That's too extreme. An immoral species can thrive so long as its held to standards like laws. Laws that are enforced primarily by government. We have set up institutions because we don't trust a large unchecked and unguided group of people.

I think we are morally broken not because we swing to the extremes, but because we can't do it all right all the time. (I will note that I do not think this means we are without hope or that human kind isn't pretty awesome)

Sometimes we do swing to the extreme, but most of the time we do not. Most of the time our morals do not impact anyone except those immediately involved. 

Summary: we are way more moral than immoral because there is restraint in the rule of law enforced by government and communities. Mankind has a lot going for it.

So, in the end we agree.

To my original comment: I am not shocked or even saddened by the extinctions or damage we have caused because of the view of morality I hold. (Anger and disappointment sometimes.)