Sam Harris Drops Patreon - Other Creators Follow

[Munn75]

collint0101 said:

Munn75 said:

Is that really your take away from this discussion? Simply a bunch of people defending the use of racial slurs. 

I think there are quite a few other interesting points and questions raised:

1. Sam Harris is liberal and yet he took a stand on principle, even for someone that he does not politically agree with.
2. Patreon has been vague and contradictory with their own policies and terms of service.
3. Tech companies like Patreon, YouTube, Facebook, Twitter, etc. have near monopolies in the space they occupy.
4. Because of this and their choice to often prioritize ideology over profit, will this lead to government regulation in a similar way to utilities?
5. Should companies prioritize their ideology over profits?
6. Why are we not more alarmed at what happened to SubscribeStar, essentially being deplatformed?
7. Will free speech versions of Patreon, Facebook, Twitter, YouTube etc. emerge from this?
8. Do we need an internet bill of rights so that these policies are transparent and applied equally to the left, right, and center?
9. Will content creators continue to leave Patreon since the rules seem to be applied arbitrarily on a case by case basis and anyone that they deem unfit could be next to lose their platform and income? 
10.  Free speech vs. hate speech. Do we want the government or private companies defining what is free and what is hate?

There are many other interesting aspects to this thread. I think to label it as simply the defense of racial slurs is reductive.

As to your last point, if you owned a platform and chose to ban Sargon based on your opinion of him being edgy and borderline racist, just understand that you empower others to ban you or I on similarly arbitrary observations and opinions. In my view, that creates a world where we cease to discuss ideas both good and bad. We polarize and things get progressively worse.

If conservatives have a problem with it they can create their own platform instead of relying on someone else's. The policies and rules are there Sargon probably should have read them before he decided to use the N word while having a conversation with a neo Nazi. The way I see this the right dug their own grave with this one if a baker has the right to deny customers based on his anti gay political beliefs then tech companies have the right to do the same to political ideas they don't agree with. After all these are private companies we're talking about they don't owe anyone anything and if the right doesn't like the way they're being treated then bye find a new home just like if vgchartz doesn't like this comment then they have every right to get rid of me and there's nothing I can do about it because I'm using their property

I think the biggest issue with the Patreon rules is that you can go back to when Patreon banned Lauryn Southern. Jack specifically said that they would have a warning system, appeals process, better communication, and that nothing was done based on politics. It can all be seen in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmcK6GvgVPs&has_verified=1

He is also on the record as saying that people would not be banned for things that are said outside of someone's own Patreon account. In Sargon's case, none of these rules were followed. If you search Patreon, you can find pages and pages of the same offensive word that Sargon used actually on Patreon and actually being used in a very bad way by others that are not banned.

Two your second point, when people started trying to leave Patreon for SubscribeStar, that company was basically shut down by PayPal again for political/ideological reasons. I think that when alternative platforms arrive in the near future, most of the problem will be solved. Let the market decide things. Patreon will have to live by their choices.

On your final point, I would say that private companies do owe everyone equal treatment. Sure they can ban whoever they want but they should be able to justify the ban based on the breaking of rules. Those rules should be equally applied to everyone and they should take the same action against anyone that breaks those rules, regardless of if they agree with them or not.