40% of Americans have negative net income

[Baalzamon]

SpokenTruth said:

Baalzamon said:

I would argue poor people now are living more lavish lifestyles than ever before.

There is a reason the average house size used to be like half the size it is now. Entire families used to own 1 car. People didn't have computers, phones, tvs, etc.

Buying power isn't the problem, it is people believing they are entitled (despite being poor) to a much much better lifestyle than the poor ever used to have.

It most certainly is a problem.  I'll give a simple example.  My father in law bought their house brand new in 1991 for $90k.  That same house is now valued at $270k.  Did wages increase by that same rate?  Not even close.  A brand new house of the same square footage, lot size, etc...would cost nearly $400k. 

Yes, they had 1 car because only 1 person had to work.

Also, TV's are cheaper now than they were back then.  That's a horrible argument point.  You can get a 4K TV for $500.  You couldn't get a 32" color TV for under $1000 back then.  As for phones, that's ~$100 per month.  Far lower than the differential from increase rent or mortgage or health insurance or student loans.....and let's not even bother going down the increased cost of education road.  We ALL know how that is.

The interest rate on your father in law's house was also probably...around 10.5%.

So a 30 year loan (assuming 20% down payment) would have cost total of $255,000 (including the down payment).

The $270k value now will be a total cost of $448,000 over a 30 year loan (at 4.5% interest).

Per government data sites, the average wage in 1990 was $21,000 compared to $48,500 in 2016 (most recent available on data set I'm looking at on social security site). So in 1990, the house represented 12.14 years of wages, whereas in 2016 it represents 9.24 years of income. Seems to me like the house has actually gotten cheaper.

Electronics being cheaper...its almost like you are saying buying power has...increased? Isn't that exactly what I'm saying. In today's day and age, even the poor can afford a much more lavish lifestyle than they ever used to be able to.

And yes, lets not go down the road of student loans, because those are often a choice people make (none of the union workers we bring through our system have any student loans and they are averaging approximately $80-$100k/year in compensation after 5 years, and we are massively short of labor).