What is Liberty?

[palou]

Final-Fan said:

palou said:

3) Is certainly not incomplete - it really does answer the most questions with the most precision. The question is more if you like the answer or not (I don't - I find it very artificial, with the stated issues.)

My problem with 2 would be, for example;

Say, there's a hurricane incoming, in a poor nation. A smart businessman quickly buys all the essential supplies in the area, and then proceeds to sell them at a ludicrous price, which locals are forced to pay (if they can even afford it.)

1) would probably tell you that this goes against the principle of liberty, since you are preventing a lot of people from getting something that they strongly want;

3) would tell you that it's a perfectly valid transaction of wealth;

2) would tell you... well, I don't know, really?

The problem is, to me, it really doesn't seem to *solve* any problems. It simply calls them by a different name. Just shift the problem from "is this right?" to "is this infringing upon other's liberties?" 

To answer anything clearly, it seems to me that this forces you to either establish an infinite number of arbitrary discriminants (so, no progress whatsoever from just declaring everything right or wrong on a whim) or reducing your concept of "border of liberty" to either 1 or 3.

For an example of what I meant by incomplete, suppose that in a tragic misunderstanding Donald Trump built a 50 foot wall around the house of John Mexico.  Has he infringed upon John's freedom? 

I see what you mean. I think that in this case, Donald is preventing John's ability to freely use his wealth, as he is preventing him from effectuating transactions with others. (This is the same violence that a libertarian would claim to see in taxation, or tariffs - just in a more physical form.)

 

I can see how some ambiguities can pop up, if we follow that path. However, I do think that it certainly convincingly covers a much broader spectrum of situations than 2 could.

 

Regardless, I personally find that, in essence, 1 seems to be the most sensible - which leads me to the conclusion that liberty is a superfluous concept. Though, none of this is strictly bad, either - there certainly are some fine minds that have defended the others, or have found more value in the definition of 1 - just have yet to convince me.