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naruball on 20 April 2017
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setsunatenshi said:
naruball said:

I've been to two meetings of feminists and I was pleasantly surprised that though the hardcore ones were all about women's rights, the topics that they discussed and the reaction by most attendees were about men's rights too. They talked about how women are pressured to have a certain type of body and then female feminists would jump in and say, men don't have it much better since they're not allowed to show their feelings or they will be criticised by both men and women. They talked about words that they think are harmful, such as pussy or reference to "having balls" as a good thing, because both harm men and women. They brought up the need for paternity leave (though they said nothing about child custody).

My point is, how many times have people, who accuse feminist of all sorts of things, actually listened to them?  

How many of those reasonable ones get millions in donations and get to speak at the UN council as well as having tons and tons of mainstream websites / media regurgitating their talking points?

 

exactly...

 

Also in the example you have provided, I'm all for them discussing those or other topics. As long as they don't feel like they have some moral highground to make others conform to what they perceive as correct.

The discussion about language I find particularly harmful as it has the smell of thought and speach police. As if limiting the use of x or y words is the correct way to solve any problem.

Also the societal pressures I find a completely pointless subject (again, they should feel free to discuss it as much as they want) because these will always exist. It also reeks of an attempt to control sexuality and what people feel attracted to. Like for some reason it's bad to have a sexy woman / man displaying some sensuality in media.

 

So yeah, there's plenty of points I would disagree even with the more rational kind of feminists, which again, does not in any way make them evil like the OP suggested.

I don't know exactly because a lot of feminists in politics don't scream "I'm a feminist". They don't do anything outrageous for it to become news and the rest of us to find out. They do their job, get their funding and the rest of us just don't hear about it. I noticed some of Emma Watson's speeches and they were all great, imho. Same with Angelina Jolie, Jeniffer Lawrence and others I can't think of at the moment. My point is, since I don't know what percentage they represent, I won't assume most feminists are great. Because that would make be biased. I'd like to believe/I hope that a great number of them fight the good fight.

As for language, I think it's a good idea, but I can see why some disagree with it. I haven't experienced the discrimination that women do in the work field, but I've read several articles, have heard from women whom I respect that they don't get the treatment they deserve. Once a feminist friend pointed out that there is no need to say "she's got balls" to describe a woman, I thought about it for a second and tried not to say it again, because I agreed with her. She didn't enforce her beliefs or give me a lecture. She just mentioned a study she had recently read. I think this kind of conversation is healthy. The extreme verrsion of that, I most certainly disagree with.

Disagreeing with them is absolutely fine. I do too, especially with those who think that women have had it so bad for so long that if men have it a little worse now it's all good. I've been in more disagreements with feminists than I can count. I still respect some of their beliefs.