By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close
A_C_E said:
JWeinCom said:

Every book has good and bad parts, but not every book claims divine origin.  If I'm reading a secular book on morality, I'm free to say "oh I like this" or "that's stupid". When you're dealing with a book that is supposedly divine, you don't have that option.  If an all powerful perfect being wrote the book, directly or indirectly, then you can't just throw out the parts you don't find appealing.  If yahweh is the perfect being, and he created the old testament through his scribes, then you can't just throw out the parts you don't like.  

As for "it's up to the individual", why does the individual need to concern himself with any of these books?  There are truly vile ideas contained in all three books (I actually think the New Testament is far worse than the old) and the best way to take away the power of these ideas is to question the whole institution.  The attitude of "there's nothing wrong with the religion, it's all just a misinterpretation" makes it harder to challenge the institutions. 

Just because a book claims divinity does not mean I have to treat it as such, that is my decision not the books decision, so yes I do have that option. This actually goes along with my point since if there is someone willing to commit viscious acts (baby in a microwave for example) in the name of religion then they have a problem with their brain. Or we could just blame religion and just act like the lady who put her baby in the microwave would be mentally stable if not for religion. Also, you can't throw out parts you don't find appealing? The New Testament and King James Bible come to mind immediately?

Why does the individual need to concern him/herself with any of these books? They don't need to, they choose to.

Honestly, if religion disappeared violence will still take place. Literally anything can be used as a catalyst for violence and religion just so happens to have the most awareness. I don't think it really matters if there is someone who read a book about a divine frog that said all people in Turkmenistan should die, it is still up to the individual to depict reality.

It would be pretty hard to argue that a peaceful mind would suddenly turn evil after reading a book.

If you actually believe the bible to be divine, then you can't logically ignore parts you don't like.  At least not without cognitive dissonance.  

As for literally anything can be used as a catalyst for violence, no not really.  Throughout history, there are patterns of certain things consistently leading to violence.  Religion is one of the big ones.  Nationalism is probably a close second.  Things that divide people into factions, American vs non-American, saved vs damned, muslim vs infidels, are particularly effective at causing violence.  Another key element is when something is beyond question.  

Religion has a special ability to be used for evil because of its priveleged status, the way people are indoctrinated, and the obedience it instills.  Take for instance the catholic church.  Generally, parents would not leave their child alone with a man you sort of know who is not in your family.  As a teacher, there are tons of things in place to prevent us from doing anything innapropriate to children (although not always effective).  But, since people were trained with the idea that priests are holy, they left their kids in the priest's care.

Afterwards, the vatican actively shuffled pedophiles around the globe to avoid a scandal.  If any other organization were caught in something like this, that would be the end of it.  Yet the catholic church can endure it.  Because it is supposedly ordained by god.  

That's an example of a kind of abuse that could really only happen with religion.  Sure there are many cases of molestation that take place outside the church, but the scale of it is almost impossible to imagine being carried out by any other group.   There are tons of other examples I could use too.  

Of course violence would still occur if religion disappeared.  I never said it wouldn't.  But, we'd be taking away one of the most effective tools in driving people to violence, and we'd eliminate a large chunk of it.  Individuals do not exist in a vacuum.  They are influenced by the environment around them.  A person with violent tendencies may or may not act them out depending on the environment they find themselves in.  We've seen pretty consistently that religious environments are much better at promoting violence.